ising two year old aggression in stable

Will she accept you doing it.
Including taking on board if he's big and bolsy it may not be easy .
He might take to it no problem and get it straight away.
He's going to very large so it really needs addressing pdq .
Has she taken on board the not giving him treats thing .
 
Goldenstar said:
Will she accept you doing it.
Including taking on board if he's big and bolsy it may not be easy .
He might take to it no problem and get it straight away.
He's going to very large so it really needs addressing pdq .
Has she taken on board the not giving him treats thing .
Click to expand...

I think I am going to have to tell her I will be teaching him to tie up but that if he injures himself doing it, then I cannot take the blame (though I have never had one injure themselves yet). I plan to do it in his stable as it has thick padded flooring and wooden kick boards, as well as a tie ring that is high enough up to avoid him getting the rope caught over his poll. I will do it with a long line just threaded through the ring to start with.

I THINK she has taken on board the treats thing, but I think his aggression when you try to leave his stable is due to him being treated in there a lot in the past and therefore getting angry when you try to leave without giving him anything. I am not against treating per se as I think it depends on the horse and the timing of the reward, but I have said almost from day one, he is a horse that cannot routinely be treated.
 
I just feed the [long]rope through the ring and teach it not to run back, so I would not want to be in a stable particularly if he has shown aggression.
I would not just tie up and leave.
To be honest if the owner is not prepared to train the horse why does she have it...... and its not really your job to do this, I think you should make this clear.
 
I thought they were all on full livery Wagtail? If so, and if you need to tie up in order to do your job then just teach the youngster to tie. Not in the stable though, or at least I wouldn't. I always teach tie up outside. It's not a big deal that he doesn't know how to tie at the moment. He obviously understands pressure and release so him learning tying should be a walk in the park for him at this stage. I don't teach my weanlings to tie, I have no need of them knowing this or doing this at that age. I generally teach them around 2 or 3 years old once I'm planning to put groundwork in for backing them. Well I say teach, actually I don't have to *teach* them really, they just understand as they've had so much handling by that stage that it's second nature to them. Not many breeders in my neck of the woods do much at all with their youngsters and I sure don't know many (unless they only have one or two foals) who teach tying at weanling stage. Each to their own though and whether it's done early or later makes no odds, except in your case where you need the youngster to know how to tie.
 
Wagtail said:
He doesn't tie up - I know!!! I have been telling his owner for over a year that he needs to be trained to do it. She's not even tried to. I guess it will be down to me.
Click to expand...

THis ^ is what needs sorting out NOW, then a lot of troubles will be eased, particularly before he gets any bigger/older/stronger.

Edited to add: Wagtail, I'd make it a yard rule that nobody should enter the box unless the chap is headcollared 1st. Neither should anyone remove the headcollar until the handler is outside the stable & horses head over the door.

Tying up is important as you know - what if he needed to be travelled for vet treatment?

Hope you manage to teach him to tie in a short amount of time as he sounds like he could be a bit more of a problem in a few months time - good luck mrs :)
 
Last edited:
Thanks everyone.

Spring Feather - he is on Part Livery. I do all the mucking out, feeding, turnout, bring in etc. Owner mucks out at weekends. Things such as training, grooming, tack cleaning, exercise are charged extra. This would come under training. I have already done all the rest of his training effectively, as I am the one handling him. Owner seems to avoid doing anything with him at all unfortunately, but does not 'ask' me to either. Strictly speaking, teaching him to tie up would be an 'extra' which should be charged. I have already discounted his rate by £90 a month so make virtually no profit at all on him.
 
Wagtail said:
Owner seems to avoid doing anything with him at all unfortunately, but does not 'ask' me to either. Strictly speaking, teaching him to tie up would be an 'extra' which should be charged. I have already discounted his rate by £90 a month so make virtually no profit at all on him.
Click to expand...
Sounds like ultimatum time. If he is to stay on your yard, he needs to be taught to tie up. Tell her that you will do it (assuming that you are up for it), and charge her appropriately (hourly rates?).

How come the £90 discount?
 
And that's fair enough Wagtail, so all you need to say to her is that you will put in some training for him in order for you to do your job properly, and charge her for it. It's the same here; we teach all of our clients foals to lead, load, feet pick up etc but we do charge for it, not much, but enough. Makes our lives easier too if we have cooperative foals to handle.
 
Wagtail said:
Thanks everyone.

Spring Feather - he is on Part Livery. I do all the mucking out, feeding, turnout, bring in etc. Owner mucks out at weekends. Things such as training, grooming, tack cleaning, exercise are charged extra. This would come under training. I have already done all the rest of his training effectively, as I am the one handling him. Owner seems to avoid doing anything with him at all unfortunately, but does not 'ask' me to either. Strictly speaking, teaching him to tie up would be an 'extra' which should be charged. I have already discounted his rate by £90 a month so make virtually no profit at all on him.
Click to expand...

I would be asking her to leave, over horsed and under paying is what it sounds like to me, if she cannot deal with the horse she either needs to step up and pay for training for both of them so she can go on to dealing with him-or leave.

sounds like far too much of a headache to be making no money from
 
He's a young horse who isn't being handled comptently by his owner. She needs to put the headcollar and rope on when dealing with him and be confident.

As far as treats, to each his own. Mine get 2 pieces of carrot and a mint at 9pm and a treat after riding. My horses are not knocking me down or trying to shake you down for treats. This includes 9pm in the field with 4 mares. They wait patientlt out of my space and nobody gets stupid. When treats are done off they go. Not had an issue ever. I don't treat randomly. They actually can learn patience in this situation too. Nobody else is allowed to treat mine.

Terri
 
go back to old school BHS style-always tie him up (if he's that clever it wont take long to teach him) to skip out/rug/groom and make sure owner does it too, make sure all handling is entirely consistent between the two of you at all times, never duck in front of him but get him to move over, go round the back, move back from door when you go in. If the horse is ok in all other respects, then maybe is something else going on-not necessarily a 'manners' thing although it needs sorting out. Your yard, your rules and if he needs training then charge for it.

you can treat some horses and not others IME although I tend not to.
 
She is a long term livery, and she fell on hard times after she put the mare in foal. I discounted the livery price for the second horse (the now rising 2 year old) to help her out. Her finances still have not improved but she's a good payer, never late and pays in full for her mare.
 
May I be pedantic and say treat is a noun not a verb .
Wagtail you have very little luck but it looks like its gong to be your job to sort it, you might as well as you will only end picking up the pieces anyway .
Is the owner going to sell the horse ? If not I think you better get resigned to training it for your own piece of mind . Happy days .
 
Wagtail said:
He doesn't tie up - I know!!! I have been telling his owner for over a year that he needs to be trained to do it. She's not even tried to. I guess it will be down to me.
Click to expand...

Good god it's a nightmare in the making. Get them to tie it up and teach it some manners. Don't let them leave it for you to do, if the horse were to get hurt they'll blame you, if were to get hurt they'll not give a toss. These irresponsible 'fwuffy baby' owners really do boil my p***
 
Your comment about him being the bottom of the heap struck a chord if she is treating him and is a push over for him he will increase his attitude as he is moving himself off the bottom and putting her firmly there she needs to get herself higher up in the herd and get ahead of him you cannot do that for her. By all means teach him to tie up what you charge is your business and yours alone but he needs to know he truly is the bottom of the pecking order no matter how big he is
Oh and treat is a verb as well as a noun it depends on the context
 
Last edited:
I think it's a good-hearted thing you are doing Wagtail. At least you might make him into a useful equine and not one that'll end up on the scrap-heap. What's he like in general/conformation apart from being a big boy?
 
Wagtail said:
She is a long term livery, and she fell on hard times after she put the mare in foal. I discounted the livery price for the second horse (the now rising 2 year old) to help her out. Her finances still have not improved but she's a good payer, never late and pays in full for her mare.
Click to expand...

If she is still on hard times she needs to sell one...
 
I have a two year old, sixteen hands plus. Not an expert but I believe in being consistent... He will not barge, bite, pull or kick. He will tie up for a new rug, move back when I enter the stable. Why, because I am consistent, does he have mints... Yes! Am I scared of him... No! Be firm, be fair encourage the right behaviour and ignore the wrong... unless dangerous. I am firm but fair and although not the bravest in the saddle will not tolerate any dangerous behaviour... Tie him up, gently but treat him like a big horse... Quiet and timid, will create a bolshy, pushy horse...
 
Yes Wagtail, you are subsidising her hobby, you MUST run your yard as a business, there needs to be cash put away to pay for improvements, and holidays in Dubai :)
Don't fill your stables with your own horses, fill them with paying guests :)
 
Fools Motto said:
Not help regarding the aggression - that's been done by others, but with the treats - it does depend on the horse. I've always treated my filly, as every other horse I've had. She knows she had one polo for catching, and one after she has done any work. Been like that since she was 6months. She KNOWS that is all, begs for the one, may try to rummage for more at times, but has NEVER shown aggression. She would get a smack for it. So, please don't assume that all those who get treated turn.
Click to expand...


TBH, FM, I don't think it does depend on the horse. I think it depends on the handler. Those, like us, who use treats consistently to reinforce good manners, get good manners. Those who use treats to 'buy' niceness get bolshy, pushy horses.

Incidentally, the noise that blue pipe makes is so effective, it doesn't need to touch the horse.
 
Last edited:
zigzag said:
If she is still on hard times she needs to sell one...
Click to expand...

This sounds like the ideal way forward the ownership of young big sport horses Is not for everyone no judgement on any one on that young horses deserve the bast start they can get.
A big youngster is not going to be cheap to produce properly so if she's struggling now it's going to get worse .
Wagtail this exactly the sort of hassle that saps your mental to ride horses yourself think it through you have the horse on the yard reducing your margin every week and now you have to train it for nothing .
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top