Issues with colt not leading at a viewing - rearing and biting!

[wakijaki]

Went today to view 2 mini colts from different sellers and wondering if I was expecting too much or if the seller was in the wrong here with the viewing process?
So went to one yard and saw a lovely colt - handled and lead up by a child, picked up feet ect. Owners obviously passionate about their horses and spend a lot of time with them. Not pushy at all and very open and honest.
Went to the second viewing - gorgeous little colt...very nippy but put that down to being young. He was defensive when I went in with him to halter him - moved away and turned his back end to me. I asked the seller if she would walk him up for me so I could see him moving and she said 'Oh you can lead him if you want'
Well - all I can say is its a good job he was teeny as he almost had my arm off - leaping around, rearing and biting and jumping all over the place. She laughed and said ' oh hes a bit fresh as hes been in the stable for a week but he is funny!'
To be honest I was really struggling to hold on to him and not get headbutted and was out of breath when I got him back in the stable.
She then 'said oh hes got lice but Ill treat that' I really did like the look of him but was really shocked by his behaviour as she hadn't warned me he would explode like that.
She then asked if we would leave a deposit so I said I would get back to her once I had a quote for transport.
My partner and I then went for lunch nearby to compare what we thought and I told him my arm and wrist where actually hurting from trying to hold the colt and that looking back it was a bit strange that she didnt lead him herself or step in when he was being so naughty.
Am I expecting too much as I know its a yearling colt but after watching the other yearling being lead up and down by child I was not expecting to have my arm yanked out while the lady stood and laughed at his antics. And to then say he has lice and expect me to leave a deposit?
Looks wise I really preferred the 2nd colt and was wondering if he would calm down once out in the field and with more time but if he had been any bigger behaving like that he would of been dangerous.
Shes had him up for sale for a few months so find it odd that the lice issue hasnt been sorted already and then the fact that hes clearly not had much handling.
We were trying to pick between the two but we both came away thinking what a really weird viewing

 

[PipsqueakXy22]

I suppose right or wrong is subjective but you’ll find some sellers are just like that. They are all different and I suppose it depends on how much of a project youre really wanting and how much time and experience you have, as I’m sure you could put the work in and teach that colt some ground manners. Unfortunately some sellers just want to make a quick buck, and will put minimal effort in, then will ask for a deposit on the spot to get the horse sold. Also seems quite common that you travel a long way to see a horse and they don’t disclose issues or behavioural problems until you’re there. I usually walk away from these sellers as who knows what else they’re hiding. The first owners sound far more genuine and honest. Unless you’re planning to do showing or something where looks matter or perhaps there is a massive price difference between the two, I’d personally go for the first one.

 

[gallopingby]

Why do you want a mini colt? Are you going to have him gelded? Manners can usually be improved with more frequent handling. Sounds like she’s frightened or not able for some reason to manage the second colt. Depends entirely how knowledgeable you are and your future plans-

 

[SEL]

I think if any of mine had been in a stable for a week they'd be a PITA to lead let alone a youngster.

If you like him then it's just knowing he'll need more work than the other one (probably starting with lice treatment!)

 

[Red-1]

I would be most worried about why a youngster had been locked in a stable for a week! How did he get lice when kept alone? Was he alone because of the lice?

So many questions!

ETA- I would walk away until you find the one that you don't have reservations about.

 

[TheMule]

Please don’t buy a colt- if you're surprised by that behaviour then you are not well placed to have a colt. If you like either of them then buy it subject to them gelding it and wait 4 weeks post castration.

 

[Barton Bounty]

That behaviour is not surprising, they are hard work and as @TheMule says if you are surprised by that do not buy one.
They are constant hard work until you instill the manners.
They can be little beggars, they do bite , play, bounce. All of which is normal.

 

[Gloi]

I think most yearling colts are like the second one unless they have had an awful lot of handling since birth. I agree that if it surprises you don't get a yearling colt. The other one might be more lively away from his home environment too.

 

[scruffyponies]

My little Dartmoor came to me as a 15mth old colt. The big strong guy who delivered him barely managed to get him out of the trailer. With some difficulty he got the lead rope off, but decided the head collar wasn't worth the effort involved!
Turned into the most mannerly little stallion you've ever met, but it wasn't without effort Oddly we haven't had any trouble at all with colts we've had from foals... I think they learn from the others.

I don't think it's reasonable for the seller to have expected you to handle him until he's yours. How did she know you were even capable? Very foreseeable that you could be hurt, or lose control of the pony.

 

[Palindrome]

The second seller doesn't seem trustworthy, who knows if he has really been kept stabled or not? In any case, you have to go with the horse you have in front of you and I would rather go for temperament than look.
Even a pony can hurt you, I knew of an experienced riding instructor/eventer that got kicked in the knee by a pony, he needed surgery and has long term damage.

 

[rara007]

What do you want it for? If it’s a pet/companion why make life difficult (remembering the first will likely revert at times). If it’s a show pony then take the quality one. I’d expect most yearlings (which are actually mainly still under a year old) to have had limited handling by this time of year.

 

[wakijaki]

Thanks for all the replies and to clear up a little I have a mini mare and considering breeding so that's why I was looking at colts.
Hence I liked the 2nd one more because he was better looking/colours.
Both where same age and price only first sellers where more than happy to include delivery whereas 2nd one said she couldn't do that but she did have transport there which made us feel like she just didn't want to.
I totally understand coltish behaviour and whilst I'm not massively experienced with them I just felt it odd afterwards that she hadn't handled him like I had asked and could then see me struggling with him as she hadn't warned that he might just explode but she must of known. It was only afterwards I said it was odd as I asked her to walk him up for me and she made me do it.
In contrast the other colt same age ect was lead quietly by a small child no problem.
Plus she has had him up for sale for over 3 months so lice should really have been sorted or at least mentioned prior.
It just seemed like he hadn't been handled at all so took me by surprise.
I guess with trying to weigh up between the two I was trying to judge wether he was having an naughty day after not being out or was just more or less totally unhandled

 

[Hallo2012]

why are you breeding?

is the mare an exceptional example of her type, a multi award winner, graded and with no health issues and an excellent temperament?

same Q re the potential colts-are you going to get him licensed and produced for show ring?

i have 2 pony stallions at home and both would be sharp as a tin tack after a week stabled. i also ride a variety of other stallions for people and they all without exception are prone to the nippy dancing prancing, occasional rear if fresh from being stuck in etc. I think being surprised by that shows a massive lack of knowledge sadly.

do you have an experience of handling mature stallions? or breeding?foaling?

how are you going to keep them safely separate but provide company for both? (please god dont say you are just going to turn out together and let nature take its course.........)

 

[ihatework]

Quite honestly this sounds like a potential disaster waiting to happen. Even if you go for a colt that seems beautifully behaved and handled now that can change rather dramatically rather quickly!

 

[KittenInTheTree]

Buy both as company for each other, geld them, and then turn them away together and handle them appropriately until they are mature. Give it at least six months after gelding before letting them near any mares. Don't add to the number of tiny ponies already in the world. Oh, and treat the lice too, obviously. You're probably infested by now.

 

[littleshetland]

I f you were going to view a riding horse/pony to buy, you would ask and expect to see it ridden first before getting on board yourself -thats common sense, so surely you would have expected to see the colt being led by the owner first?
Also, the sellers had ample time to deal with the lice....why haven't they?
And how rude that they laugh at you whilst struggling with their ill mannered pony....
I don't think I'd give them the satisfaction of giving them a 'sale'. I'm sure you'll find a suitable pony elsewhere.

 

[wakijaki]

I don't have experience with breeding but everyone has to start somewhere.
My circumstances have changed recently where I put my ridden horse on loan and they want to buy him. I got my mini mare as company for him but they have totally different needs so it didn't really work. So now my mare is unhappy on her own.
My ex partners mother bred minis so I fell in love with them as they were just such a joy to be around.
Not interested in showing but they are all spsbs registered so would of put in for DNA testing and licensing ect.
As Littleshetland said above if I was viewing a riding horse I would of expected to have seen it ridden first so looking back it was strange that she didn't want to lead it herself.
I've done viewings myself before and I've always been honest about my horse and got on myself and said they haven't been ridden for so long ect.
And after coming away from the first viewing where the little colt behaved so well I was not expecting this smaller one to behave like that after I'd been told he was well handled and he was acting like he had never been touched before.

 

[irishdraft]

I don't know anything about mini ponies but if you asked the seller to trot him up so you could see him move, perfectly reasonable request, and she asked you to do it, then how could you judge his movement ? . I would have insisted the seller trotted him up but anyhow it all could work out but I wouldn't be impressed with her behavior and probably leave it on that basis .

 

[Widgeon]

if you asked the seller to trot him up so you could see him move, perfectly reasonable request, and she asked you to do it, then how could you judge his movement ?

I thought this too....odd behaviour and would suggest to me that the seller is afraid to handle him.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

If you really want to breed, then send mare off to stud to get covered and buy/loan a similar sized companion for her. But then again, when you have a foal on the ground it often works better to have a 2nd one.....

It works out a darned sight cheaper and easier to not have a stallion on site unless you have a v good one and several mares to cover.

 

[Nari]

The attitude of the second seller, and the reluctance to handle would put me off. What care has that pony received? Regular worming, farriery, vaccinations? Feels unlikely if he hasn't been handled. And while I would say it's not surprising behaviour in a colt that's been in for a week the fact she wasn't prepared to walk him up for you - and you wanted to see him move so needed him lead, not try to watch and lead - makes me wonder if she's scared of him. If he's learned that he can make people back off with that behaviour he may be harder to turn into a mannerly lad than one that had never been handled. And she was pushing for a deposit, that always makes me wary.

On balance I would walk away from the second one unless he's absolutely perfect and you have experience dealing with unruly colts. If you don't like the first one enough to buy then leave him too, they aren't the only two mini colts in the country.

 

[TheMule]

Reality check- this is a terrible idea!
Buy another mini as a companion and by all means breed your mare, but don’t try to do it from home with your own colt. It is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Maxidoodle]

If you’re breeding to keep then just get your own mare covered. Otherwise, if you’re breeding to sell, please consider the need, there’s so many ponies out there needing a home. Halo2012’s post says it all. I have minis and have experience of mini colts and if you don’t have the experience, they can be just as dangerous as larger entire equines.

 

[Hallo2012]

so once the mare is covered and in foal, and you separate her back out again.......neither will have company? and when she foals the foal will not have company either?

i don't have mares on site, mine go away (to collect for AI) but are then stabled next to each other at home,and can touch/play through the grill and can also touch/play though field fence so they do have that social contact-you cant be doing that with one mare and one stallion (and then one foal)

i didnt see either of mine trotted up when i bought them but one we saw loose and one i trotted up and OH took videos -both times this was due to sellers ill health so they couldn't actually trot them up so that in its self wouldt be an issue if you could see them move elsewhere.

but you need to think about the massive commitment this would be-and the foal, will it be for sale? will it be commercial if the parents are unshown? if its NOT for sale can you cope with 3? if its a filly you need to ensure your stallion doesnt cover his daughter. If its a colt for gods sake dont keep that one entire too.

I would encourage you to spend time on the ground at a big stud to see how it works before starting this, there will be so much you havent considered. mine dont do live cover currently but if we start accepting mares in the future i intend to spend time at the stud who bred my younger stallion AND at a larger stud, for WEEKS to learn all i can before we start.I also already have a lot of support and back up in the form of friends who already do this.

 

[eggs]

If you really want to breed from you mare please find a suitable stud with a stallion that will complement her. Do not buy either of these colts unless you are planning on getting them gelded before getting them home as a companion for your mare.

 

[paddy555]

My partner and I then went for lunch nearby to compare what we thought and I told him my arm and wrist where actually hurting from trying to hold the colt and that looking back it was a bit strange that she didnt lead him herself or step in when he was being so naughty.
Am I expecting too much as I know its a yearling colt but after watching the other yearling being lead up and down by child I was not expecting to have my arm yanked out while the lady stood and laughed at his antics. And to then say he has lice and expect me to leave a deposit?
Looks wise I really preferred the 2nd colt and was wondering if he would calm down once out in the field and with more time but if he had been any bigger behaving like that he would of been dangerous.
Shes had him up for sale for a few months so find it odd that the lice issue hasnt been sorted already and then the fact that hes clearly not had much handling.
We were trying to pick between the two but we both came away thinking what a really weird viewing

sorry but I think this is a crazy idea. You assume that the first little paragon of virtue is going to continue to be like that. Not necessarily.
I bought a colt to keep as a stallion (quite deliberately) between the ages of 1 and 4 he was many different horses. We had spells of gorgeous sweet youngster and then spells of Kevin the teenager and back and forth. Just part of growing up for an ungelded colt.
I think you can expect that sort of behaviour from both colts.

The lice and the fact you didn't take to the 2nd owner wouldn't bother me but it would bother me that you found your arm and wrist were yanked and hurting with a yearling. You may well be in the same position with a much bigger 3yo
Do you have the experience to be able to deal with an older and far bigger and stronger colt. If he stands on his hind legs and comes at you will that bother you, will you know how to deal with it?



Do you really have the facilities to keep a colt/stallion away from your mare and, idc if you have a foal, away from what would be his daughter.

I have a very very very well behaved stallion and I have a couple of mares. Always at the back of my mind is making sure I know where everyone is and the mares are kept safe. I am in a very low risk situation for that but if you have a mini colt/ stallion things will not be that easy and he will be an expert at getting out.

If you want company for your mare then surely there are mini geldings available or small geldings of any of the pony breeds.
I'm afraid this is a terribly bad idea. Covering your mare will be the easy part, it is everything afterwards that will be a nightmare.

If you bring a yearling colt home now where will it live? with the mare? is she strong enough to continually discipline it because if not it could make her life hell by constantly being a PITA.

As for the 2nd owner and poor presentation of the colt then sometimes it is like that. You are buying the colt not the owner.

 

[rara007]

I wouldn’t buy a colt to live on the same property as your mare unless the fields are Fort Knox and you’re prepared to handle colt extra sass. Use a stud stallion!

 

[Ample Prosecco]

If you are breeding for your own joy/pleasure and will take full responsibility for the care of any foals, then go for it. But as others have said, a colt/stalllion is not a suitable companion for a mare! You'd be far better off buying/loaning a much older companion pony and send your mare away to be covered.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Buy a companion for your mare then find a nice licensed stallion for her if you really want to breed one, keeping stallions and mare together is not ideal, and no disrespect to you but you don't sound like you have the experience to be breeding your own.

Have you any idea how to cover a mare properly? It's not just a case of chuck them in a field and hope for the best, one of them could get seriously hurt if you don't know what your doing.

 

[Red-1]

I didn't know you intended to keep him entire. I would not buy either on this basis, as I don't think 2 horses would work. You need to be able to separate, and also a foal needs mates.