It is down to me to teach someone how to care for their horse ??

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Muddywellies

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I am a paying livery at my friend's house. Another person has just bought a horse and is keeping it at the yard also on livery. They have never owned a horse in their life.
They are making glaring mistakes - really simple things that will affect the health and safety of the horse. To be honest, it annoys me that people buy themselves a horse yet really dont have a clue what to do with it. Its shocking actually. There is endless amount of information and advice out there - books and internet, as well as courses in horse care.
I have said (nicely) a few things to them, which they are grateful for. I know they are keen to learn from me. But I am a busy person, am merely a paying livery, and really dont want them to rely on me. Who's to say my methods are correct anyway? (Though in my mind they are). If i give them some advice which they act on, and something goes wrong, I wonder if they would blame me for giving them bad advice? What I have said to them so far is "I dont want to tell you what to do, by if it was MY horse, I would......." .
I have never claimed to be an instructor of any kind, and just want to go and do my own horse, not give basic lessons in horse care.
What am i to do ?
 
recommend .....

1) that they buy a decent quality book that covers horse care, stable management etc

2) subscribe to a couple of horsey mags.....

and - keep a low profile
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This is always tricky as you don't want to seem to be uncaring and not freindly and for most of us we are more than willing to help anyone and their horse if needed ...it's in our horsey natures !! but when it comes down to it your paying your hard earned money to keep your horse and when you get to the yard you want to be able to enjoy him/her ! Can you not have a quiet word with your YO and explain the situation ... I'm sure the YO has already noticed that they are novices and it's the YO job to make sure all equines on the premises are looked after to an acceptable standard. If this person keeps on bugging you tell them gently to ask the YO as your not sure !
 
It's not down to you to teach them at all however everyone has to learn from somewhere & very often books are not always the best place. Everyone has to start somewhere, there was a time when you knew nothing but you learned. At least they want to learn & look after their animal well. I would just keep a passing eye on what they are doing & if they are happy to take constructive criticism then pick them up on the more potentially bad/dangerous things as you see things unfold.
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Incidentally....you're asking people for advice at the moment aren't you? so everyone needs a bit of advice sometimes
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I'm buying my first horse at the moment, and I really hope that if someone on the yard where I keep it when I get it thought I was doing something that would endanger my or its safety that they would say something and not begrudge me a little free advice.

It costs nothing to give someone a few kind words.

No matter how many books you read or how much experience you get there comes a point when you have to do things alone for the first time or make decisions for your horse all by yourself and nothing can prepare you for that. Nobody knows everything.

Could you live with yourself if the horse or owner got injured and you hadn't spoken up?

They probably have an idea how to do things but are unsure and want reassurance. I remember often asking people whether the horse I shared needed an extra rug or not (and other similar daft questions) because I wasn't really confident in my own judgement and worried about being critisised. You can't learn that sort of stuff without trying and we all have to start somewhere.

You could lend them a good book, or recommend one to them to help them out, and you could suggest that they sign up for the BHS stage one course or the horse owners certificate for extra confidence and tuition too, but ultimitley think about the people who helped you out when you were a first time owner and pay it back!
 
In theory no it isn't, but in practise you'll find it unavoidable. Why not sit her down with a cuppa and ask if she wants you to chip in and offer advice when needed? Don't worry, in my experience she may turn into the Yard Expert in about 6 months time.
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Been there and done that one..I was the total novice who bought my daughter a pony!! Initially she was on working livery but she was always in the school so we never got chance to do anything with her.

I was offered livery on a tiny yard right across the road from my house (only 2 other liveries) and I can honestly say without them I wouldn't still have horses! I had read loads of books/magazines but when something happens for the first time I think a bit of panic sets in and a reasuring word is worth a million books.

I am lucky enough to have my own land now and have 8 horses in total with 3 babies due this year and although I would say I was competant there are still occasions where I chat to my old YO (now a good friend) just to confirm or for a different opinion. We all have to start somewhere and if I can pass advice on I will happily do so.

I would chat to the new person and ask them if they need help advice but also direct them to other sources of help so it doesnt always fall on you (this forum for example :-))
 
Why do people buy horses without the first idea of how to care for them?

I truly believe that you should have at least some proper equine education before being able to go out and buy one. Maybe a test or something.

It should not be down to other owners to educate these people - they should go to a riding school and have both riding and stable management lessons.

We have some absolute idiots on our yard, dont know about correct diagonals or canter lead legs, then present their horse to huge jumps completely wrong and beat the horse for knocking it down. It really beggers belief.
 
Have you got a fairly basic horse care book that you could lend her? I've got the BHS Horse Care & Stable management (or something), it is nice and straightforward, has loads of good photos and tells you the absolute basics, right down to how to muck out your stable. Something like that would be ideal for her.
 
qr- Recommend a good instuctor and continue to help when you can. I wish people learnt more before getting a horse too. Novice owners getting a horse too soon = compromised welfare and safety risk!
 
I learned to drive with my first horse. In the winter when stabled he was manic and the yard grounded him. I bought him so I could ride and drive on MY insurance - although he never bucked again when he had me for his 'mummy'.

Caring for him? I was the manager of a big Trauma and Casualty department with very long hours so I kept him on full livery. I had never put on a NZ rug or bought a sack of feed.

A year later I moved him (after he had a colic, caused by head girl's lack of care) I still knew nothing and had to get up at 5.30am to care for him. He has never looked back and is now 31. I now have 11 horses.

The moral of this story is that we all have to learn and practical advice imo works better. I am still learning every day. When I meet someone who knows nothing of yard mgt I think 'that was me - be kind.'
 
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Why do people buy horses without the first idea of how to care for them?

I truly believe that you should have at least some proper equine education before being able to go out and buy one. Maybe a test or something.

It should not be down to other owners to educate these people - they should go to a riding school and have both riding and stable management lessons.

We have some absolute idiots on our yard, dont know about correct diagonals or canter lead legs, then present their horse to huge jumps completely wrong and beat the horse for knocking it down. It really beggers belief.

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Theory and practice on riding school horses is one thing, its a different matter when you have one of your own (bit like babies really) We all have to learn somewhere and I for one am happy to help anyone out if I can just like people helped me out.

I dont believe you should have to pass a test to own one (you dont have to do that to bring up a child) and yes we all make mistakes but as long as you are willing to listen and learn then I would tell anyone to go for it.

I have seen 'professionals' behaving like idiots out showjumping and parents screaming at their ponies and children. Kids beating ponies up (with the parent/coach shouting in agreement) when the pony has just tried to do its best when set at a fence incorrectly....so professionals can be just as bad as people who are just learning the ropes.
 
I have been in this situation and it needs to be nipped in the bud ! Everyone helps of course we do and everyone is still learning (hopefully) but when the questions become rentless it's tiring and you just can't get on with your own horse ! I'm not saying not to help but do steer them to the YO for your own sanity !
we all had to learn at some point but did we bug the hell out of someone ??
 
I am another person who has benefitted greatly from the help of fellow yard-mates, and probably wouldn't have my own horse without their help. I am an intelligent university-educated professional who has a horse as a hobby. I spent 20 years having lessons in a riding school, as my family couldn't afford a pony! As soon as I was earning enough money I began sharing then loaning. I read every book I could find, every magazine, listened to and watched everyone and really relished learning as much as I could about horse ownership. I bought my own horse only when I felt like I was TOTALLY ready...
And yet I still know nothing! Every day I come across a new problem or something I'm unsure of. Sometimes I think I should sell my horse for his own sake.
Only now I realise how difficult it is to actually quantify how much some one does or doesn't know, or what is good or bad advice?
We all have to start somewhere!!!!!
 
I also learnt from people who helped me when I bought my second horse.My first I kept at livery and they took me as an idiot which I was, bought 2nd horse and had the sense to move to a small livery yard and did I have a big learning curve and I came through loving it. I learnt to hunt, jump ,x-counrty and a little bit of dressage and 30 odd years on I just love going for a happy hack. But if anybody needed help, yes I would as I've done in years gone by. So sometime a little word here or there or advice doesn't come admiss and sometimes greatfully recieved
 
I would rather be on a yard with 20 people whom know nothing but want to learn than be on a yard with 1 person whom thinks they know everything and there way is the only way
 
I find it a bit odd that people who know nothing whatsoever, go out and buy a horse. When I was growing up I didnt have a horse - I used to go and help out whoever and wherever I could. I learnt loads that way, and of course the person i was helping knew I was learning before they agreed to let me help them. I didnt buy a horse, turn up on a yard, then expect others to bail me out. I also read loads and loads - borrowed books from the library and bought magazines. When I eventually owned a horse, I considered myself to be fairly experienced and competent.
 
I put my mare on part loan to a lady who had had a horse for years when she was younger and had been out of horses for about 20 years.

She knew the basics but things have moved on in the horsey world in the past 20 years and therefore i had no problem in helping her with this transition (nor did anyone else on the yard).

I think we all need help and advice at times and it cost nothing to help someone if they want help.

I am the type of person who will help anyone if i can but i suppose we are all different, I like to think that if i needed help/ advice someone would help me.
 
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I find it a bit odd that people who know nothing whatsoever, go out and buy a horse. When I was growing up I didnt have a horse - I used to go and help out whoever and wherever I could. I learnt loads that way, and of course the person i was helping knew I was learning before they agreed to let me help them. I didnt buy a horse, turn up on a yard, then expect others to bail me out. I also read loads and loads - borrowed books from the library and bought magazines. When I eventually owned a horse, I considered myself to be fairly experienced and competent.

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I don't think people do go out and buy a horse when they know nothing about them. I think that the vast majority think that they know enough, and I think that they do read all the books etc but it is never enough.

You only realise that later, you could wait for ever to be "ready" but in reality you never will be unless you take the plunge. Hopefully people will find a supportive livery yard and some knowlegable friends to help them out and will continue reading and learning but if more experienced owners aren't prepared to offer friendly help and advice learning will be tough!

The opportunities for helping out are decreasing all the time too, children can't work for rides the way they used to, and in our litigious society many people are reluctant to have people help with their horses, especially children.
 
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I don't think people do go out and buy a horse when they know nothing about them.

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My mum did - and thas how I ended up with my horse
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TBH, I learnt loads from asking questions and still do now. You can read all the books you want, but hands on experience is best (especially as things change so much!)

I would and have given my advice to others when needed and tbh I would take it as a compliment that she looks to you for your advice - It wont last forever
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Many of us learn how to look after and manage our horses as a result of hands on experience.

However, the owner of the yard and horse have joint responsibility under the ammended animal welfare bill to ensure that the animal is looked after properly. So the responsibility is with the owner of the horse and the owner of the of the yard who if they fail to do so can be prosecuted.
 
There's a big difference between a bit of friendly advice and help and 'tuition'. The first is fine, the second is way beyond the call of duty. I'm lucky in that my yard is full of experienced people but even after 20 years of owning horse I come across problems for the first time (e.g. never had to feed a horse up or learn the best ways of getting and keeping a grey horse clean until I got my current one 4 years ago) and so do my fellow liveries so we always offer advice and help if we've been there.

We all have different experience that we can share. One horse has really started taking the mick while being led (following 2 weeks box rest) after years of behaving. His owner was at her wits end not to mention black and blue from being pulled about, knocked over and trampled, so I have been helping her as my old boy did this for the whole 14 years I had him! Bridle, lunge line, and steel toe caps all the way!
 
I think the general consensus here is that its me being grumpy. Ive always had my own yard, until recently, and even then, I was alone on my friend's yard. I am used to doing things my way, everything is where i leave it, everything is left tidy incl the muck heap, and most importantly, the tack room is absolutely never ever left unlocked (even when Im on the yard). But I just cant help feeling that they should have had a little bit of knowledge before they bought their horse - they can't even tie it up or pick out its feet (I had to show them). They clearly dont know the rules of feeding and I keep on having to top up their hay and water. If i had the time to do two horses, I would probably have another myself ! But thank you all for your comments - I clearly need to try to mellow somehow (???)
 
They sound like they're aware of their shortcomings and wouldn't be offended at an offer of advice. It might be best to bite the bullet and make an effort for a day and let them shadow you to see what you do. It might mean you take a bit longer to do your chores that day but you might get some peace afterwards?

Or maybe you could offer to write them a check list of your daily routine. Don't sell it at as gospel, just what you do - turn out, muck out, hay feed water, pick out hooves adjust/change rugs etc. You could include basic feeding rules (show calculation of 2% body weight, hard feed to forage ratio) so not only do they know how much hay to give etc but they understand why and can adjust accordingly as the horse's work changes without bothering you. They could then put it up somewhere visible to remind them until they know what they're doing. It would be a pain but you'd only have to do it once and they wouldn't keep interrupting you when you're busy.

Then when they know what they're doing they will owe you several favours and can turn your horse out when you want a lie in.
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PeterNatt got in with what I was going to say first
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YO and horse owner both have responsibility for the horse's welfare, you don't (in the eyes of the law). Unfortunately we all feel a bit responsible when we see a horse potentially suffer and we can do something about it.

Firest step if you've not already done so is to ask YO to educate them. If that fails...

How about recommending they have an instructor over to give them weekly stable management lessons? or offer to have a couple of hours with them on a saturday morning to go through the basics (I appreciate this is your time, but you could make it just one or two slots of this to save lots of 10-15 minute talks). I like anagain's suggestion of lists, and if they will take it kindly why not make them a to do list - with things like phone a vet to get a worming and vaccination plan, book a farrier every 6 weeks, phone a reputable feed company for a feeding plan, enrol for horse owners certificate or stable management lessons at nearest exam centre/riding school, and a list of essential reading: manual of horsemanship from BHS, perhaps? The stable management one is on Amazon for £15.
 
Theres a family at the yard where we keep ours, classic mistake, young kid, has a 4yr old pony bought for her and is getting well and truly walked all over! Luckily the ponys on full livery. She can ride but thats all and the pony knows it! Shes started doing half rears to get her own way. They even bought the tack from a car boot! I hope the accident thats waiting to happen doesnt happen but.....
 
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