Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
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It should be illegal to ride on a public road without wearing High-Viz Florencent
- Thread starter Judgemental
- Start date
Carefreegirl
Well-Known Member
Well here I am reading a hi viz thread in the Hunting forum and notice Alec's little ditty about Queen and fat bottomed girls.
Alec, I salute you
Alec, I salute you
cob&onion
Well-Known Member
I always wear hi-viz when hacking - it pisses me off when i see others riding without it, especially through wooded/shaded roads (alot round here) in the winter when its getting dark on dark horses in dark clothing. WHY?? takes seconds to put on a hi viz tabard
Kaylum
Well-Known Member
Watched a program a few months ago about a cyclist that was killed on the road, he had no hi viz on and the police arrested the car driver. They then investigated what had happend, the driver could in no way have seen the cyclist as dusk was falling. The driver was released without charge. If the driver had seen the cyclist he would most probably have even alive today. A very harsh lesson learnt for both parties. The poor driver I feel sorry for.
No excuse at all, everyone should do their best to protect those around us who we share roads with and do the best to protect ourselves and our animals. No wonder horse riders on the road have such a bad reputation.
EAST KENT
Well-Known Member
Re: It should be illegal to ride on a public road without wearing High-Viz Florencent
I'm sorry JM, but that's nonsense. We are already burdened by more than enough bureaucratic old bollox, some originating from our clown like Continental cousins, some from our own Government who employ others to tighten the control which they have over us, and I strongly suspect some to originate from those with nothing better to do than dream up yet more stringent and restrictive rules and regulations.
It's my life and I will live it as I see fit. If I still rode, I'd also still chase a fox or two, armed with a Hoss, and a dawg or two.
I agree with you, that Hi-viz is an excellent idea, at all times of the day, but to burden us with further rules and conditions, by which we live our lives, isn't on.
Alec.
Thank God someone said it! Let us lead our lives with less not more flaming rules.
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
As would we all. The ill prepared person who dies, is rarely the victim, they're off to heaven. The victim is all so often the innocent person who sits with the dying, as they pass on.
I understand your concerns, but our freedom to decide for ourselves, how we depart this life, and if it's through stupidity and not wearing Hi-viz, then so be it, is ours to make, and it must remain so. Without choice, we become as sheep, or cattle, in that we have our lives directed by others.
Again, I accept your point, but I refuse to die in a way that makes others feel a little more comfortable about my passing, or themselves. Sorry.
Alec.
Rollin
Well-Known Member
Just seen your reply. You are of course right. Horses get killed so do people let us not bother to do anything about it.
Before the introduction of seat belt legislation, trauma wards in the UK were full of people with facial injuries caused when they shot through their windscreens. They of course occupied beds in Ortho. units which could have been used by people waiting for elective surgery. Hip and knee replacement bring huge improvements in quality of life.
Since smoking was banned in public places, Scotland in particular, has noticed a huge improvement in the health of new born babies.
Do you feel that seat belt legislation and the smoking ban represent the nanny state?
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
Alec.
irish_only
Well-Known Member
Come on, the answer is so simple. No motorised vehicles on designated routes at specified times to allow all horse riders to exercise their beloved creatures.
Lizzie66
Well-Known Member
It might be common sense to where hi-viz and it certainly makes you safer, but people still have freedom of choice. They can and should be allowed to make decisions for themselves and not have them imposed upon them.
Otherwise as someone else said lets make everything hi-viz, we can have cars that should only be allowed in luminescent and fluorescent colours, we should make their engines noisier so we can here them coming, and we should make someone walk in fornt of them with a fluorescent flag whilst wearing a hi-viz vest. We'll all be safer.
A little less flippantly as far as I was aware it is a car drivers responsibility to ensure they are driving at a speed whereby they can observe potential hazards and stop before hitting them. If visibility is poor then you should slow down, and if you can't see a half-ton horse on the side of the road then hopefully the DVLA will remove your licence for you !
Otherwise as someone else said lets make everything hi-viz, we can have cars that should only be allowed in luminescent and fluorescent colours, we should make their engines noisier so we can here them coming, and we should make someone walk in fornt of them with a fluorescent flag whilst wearing a hi-viz vest. We'll all be safer.
A little less flippantly as far as I was aware it is a car drivers responsibility to ensure they are driving at a speed whereby they can observe potential hazards and stop before hitting them. If visibility is poor then you should slow down, and if you can't see a half-ton horse on the side of the road then hopefully the DVLA will remove your licence for you !
lachlanandmarcus
Well-Known Member
this, x 100!!!
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
LickettySplit
Well-Known Member
You know what, those car things are bl**dy dangerous....let's ban them and save countless lives.
As for hi-viz - if you can't see me on a 17hh grey then you need your eyes testing.
As for hi-viz - if you can't see me on a 17hh grey then you need your eyes testing.
Suelin
Well-Known Member
Liking this comment. So true.
PolarSkye
Well-Known Member
Well, actually I see this as an overall road-user safety issue rather than a horse and rider safety issue.
I routinely take a small rat run on my way home through a semi-rural residential and park-like area . . . dogwalkers (fully kitted out in dark SuperDry jackets, Hunter wellies and probably jeans) at dusk are very difficult to see in the gloom and against the backdrop of the trees and shrubs that line both sides of the narrow roads. If you are going to be using the road as a pedestrian, cyclist or rider in low-light or dodgy visibility conditions then surely you ought to take some responsibility for your own safety by making it easier for drivers to see you? Any road user not in a car is just that much more vulnerable than someone in a car . . . just seems like common sense to me.
P
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
Having started this thread, I feel duty bound to add the element of one's legal liability, which remarkably nobody appears to commented upon. Please correct me if I have missed such a point.
However there is the issue of 'fault'. In the event that there was an accident and one is wearing a high viz jacket and preferably high-viz boots on the horse then it can be argued in law, you took all reasonable steps to be seen.
In the alternative, where there is no element of High Visual kit, then your arguments may be diluted as to damages and or liability.
Whilst it is the responsibility of car drivers to drive with due care and attention, similarly the rider can be required to ride with due care and attention.
This could apply where for example, two cars are coming in opposite directions and one does not see the rider until the last moment, because of their lack of luminance. One car swerves into the path of the other car to take avoiding action.
It is all very well to say, well why cant they see me on my 17hh grey hunter.
The point is, cars are traveling at a much faster speed than the rider and therefore, it is sensible to provide as much warning for the driver in advance, so that they can take evasive action.
In the awful event you were party to an accident, albeit only as a witness and the matter went to court and or worse still the Coroner's Court. You will welcome the fact you were wearing High-Viz and you can say to the court and judge, you took all reasonable steps to be seen. In the alternative you could find yourself at the very least extremely embarrassed when somebody says you could not be properly seen.
Think about the consequences of an accident and your appearance. When off your horse, on the ground, in an urban judicial environment and lawyers swooping down upon you like vultures, you will be happy to be able to have been reasonably seen.
However there is the issue of 'fault'. In the event that there was an accident and one is wearing a high viz jacket and preferably high-viz boots on the horse then it can be argued in law, you took all reasonable steps to be seen.
In the alternative, where there is no element of High Visual kit, then your arguments may be diluted as to damages and or liability.
Whilst it is the responsibility of car drivers to drive with due care and attention, similarly the rider can be required to ride with due care and attention.
This could apply where for example, two cars are coming in opposite directions and one does not see the rider until the last moment, because of their lack of luminance. One car swerves into the path of the other car to take avoiding action.
It is all very well to say, well why cant they see me on my 17hh grey hunter.
The point is, cars are traveling at a much faster speed than the rider and therefore, it is sensible to provide as much warning for the driver in advance, so that they can take evasive action.
In the awful event you were party to an accident, albeit only as a witness and the matter went to court and or worse still the Coroner's Court. You will welcome the fact you were wearing High-Viz and you can say to the court and judge, you took all reasonable steps to be seen. In the alternative you could find yourself at the very least extremely embarrassed when somebody says you could not be properly seen.
Think about the consequences of an accident and your appearance. When off your horse, on the ground, in an urban judicial environment and lawyers swooping down upon you like vultures, you will be happy to be able to have been reasonably seen.
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benson21
Well-Known Member
I was riding in feb 2010 when we were hit by a car. me and the other rider were both wearing hi vis, The Police told us if were we not wearing hi vis, the driver could claim he couldnt see us. as it was,he couldnt claim that so was found guilty of dangerous driving.
Jess Hoss
Well-Known Member
It enfuriates me when people don't wear high viz ! Out my way it's hegde lined roads & funny little gulleys. It might not make you feel pretty smothered in bright yellow or whatever, but I do it for the sake of my horse. . . Even a hatband & a tailguard will help & there's just no excuse as far as I'm concerned !
undertheweather
Well-Known Member
AengusOg
Well-Known Member
A person must be seventeen years of age to drive a vehicle on the road. It's an offence to drive without due care and attention. It's against the law to drive a vehicle without a full licence, insurance and valid road tax. All persons within a vehicle must wear seat belts or be otherwise suitably restrained. Vehicles are subject to MOT to ensure roadworthiness, and police do roadside checks on tyres, lights, brakes, and such.
Anyone can get on a horse and ride it on the road. It matters not whether the person is competent, or whether the horse is trained to a level sensible for roadwork. They can ride in any tack they like. They do not have to pay road tax or have insurance to ride on the road, nor do they have to pass any tests on knowledge/competency/ability.
There will come a day when horse users of the roads will have to take full responsibility for their right to ride on the highways. Better that we do it voluntarily than be subject to legislation.
Anyone can get on a horse and ride it on the road. It matters not whether the person is competent, or whether the horse is trained to a level sensible for roadwork. They can ride in any tack they like. They do not have to pay road tax or have insurance to ride on the road, nor do they have to pass any tests on knowledge/competency/ability.
There will come a day when horse users of the roads will have to take full responsibility for their right to ride on the highways. Better that we do it voluntarily than be subject to legislation.
CrazyMare
Well-Known Member
Have signed and shared the petition on Facebook
Colby
Member
I have to agree...
But you are talking about hunting which is based on tradition and rituals, the law is something for logical things.
I always try to wear Hi-V when walking on roads and always wear it when riding on the roads.
I also believe that the speed limit of vehicles should be lowered on country roads, I dont see why vehicles should be priority in the countryside personally.
I've lived in a couple of places where there are a few small bridges that are one way with no traffic lights, the amount of people who drive over them fast 'incase someone is coming round the corner' defys the object, crash at a higher speed and survive?
I hate to see people blasting their horns at tractors and getting annoyed trying to overtake, those roads where not created for people to take 'fast' shortcuts or gallivant about at 60mph.
It does have an impact on wildlife.
I like those bridges created in sweden to allow the traffic to move underneath to give wildlife alternative routes and to stop so many being killed or injured, I dont see why wildlife should be killed due to people driving high speeds or not caring.
In my opinion you shouldnt have the privilage of living or being in the countryside if you cannot respect it and just want to use it and drain its resources.
Things have changed alot, I use to be able to walk the dogs and come across 1-3 cars driving around 40-45mph. Drivers are getting more and more rude and dont seem to be aware or worried that they may hit somebody, in the countryside alot of them drive down the middle of the road because 'nobody else is here' I had one van driver the other day swerve out of the way of me and the dog and we took up around 1.5ft of the space of the road. People think im cocky though and that I should drag the dog onto the small amount of verge left everytime a vehicle goes past, the only time I do this is if im near a sharp corner and they had no chance of seeing me(for my own safety, they should be aware that somebody may be around the corner so not to drive so fast around it) or if the largest type of lorry is thundering along, again for my own safety.
How is it proper exercise if you have to have 50 rests along a walk?
I know the majority of people disagree with my views as they dont fit in with the world as it is right now, but none the less if I had my way I would reduce the amount of vehicles on the roads by at least 50%
But you are talking about hunting which is based on tradition and rituals, the law is something for logical things.
I always try to wear Hi-V when walking on roads and always wear it when riding on the roads.
I also believe that the speed limit of vehicles should be lowered on country roads, I dont see why vehicles should be priority in the countryside personally.
I've lived in a couple of places where there are a few small bridges that are one way with no traffic lights, the amount of people who drive over them fast 'incase someone is coming round the corner' defys the object, crash at a higher speed and survive?
I hate to see people blasting their horns at tractors and getting annoyed trying to overtake, those roads where not created for people to take 'fast' shortcuts or gallivant about at 60mph.
It does have an impact on wildlife.
I like those bridges created in sweden to allow the traffic to move underneath to give wildlife alternative routes and to stop so many being killed or injured, I dont see why wildlife should be killed due to people driving high speeds or not caring.
In my opinion you shouldnt have the privilage of living or being in the countryside if you cannot respect it and just want to use it and drain its resources.
Things have changed alot, I use to be able to walk the dogs and come across 1-3 cars driving around 40-45mph. Drivers are getting more and more rude and dont seem to be aware or worried that they may hit somebody, in the countryside alot of them drive down the middle of the road because 'nobody else is here' I had one van driver the other day swerve out of the way of me and the dog and we took up around 1.5ft of the space of the road. People think im cocky though and that I should drag the dog onto the small amount of verge left everytime a vehicle goes past, the only time I do this is if im near a sharp corner and they had no chance of seeing me(for my own safety, they should be aware that somebody may be around the corner so not to drive so fast around it) or if the largest type of lorry is thundering along, again for my own safety.
How is it proper exercise if you have to have 50 rests along a walk?
I know the majority of people disagree with my views as they dont fit in with the world as it is right now, but none the less if I had my way I would reduce the amount of vehicles on the roads by at least 50%
tankgirl1
Well-Known Member
I couldn't read to the end of the thread - got to page 7
I thought the times of the 'horsey world' being up its own ar*e had passed - Obviously not as there are a few people on this thread who's opinion beggers belief!
Why the hell would you NOT wear high viz on the roads? It's cheap, doesn't restrict your riding, or the horses way of going, and it may well save lives!
And it's not only your own personal safety at risk, but that of your horse and other road users.... Oh sorry, it's not cool, or the done thing to wear high viz? Please!
I'd like to see it mandatory for all road users to be visible in poor light - cars, walkers, horses, cyclists... its just an accident waiting to happen if not!
Great introduction to the hunting forum... Bloody hell some of the posters on this thread would put me off it altogether if I didn't realise they were in the minority!
I thought the times of the 'horsey world' being up its own ar*e had passed - Obviously not as there are a few people on this thread who's opinion beggers belief!
Why the hell would you NOT wear high viz on the roads? It's cheap, doesn't restrict your riding, or the horses way of going, and it may well save lives!
And it's not only your own personal safety at risk, but that of your horse and other road users.... Oh sorry, it's not cool, or the done thing to wear high viz? Please!
I'd like to see it mandatory for all road users to be visible in poor light - cars, walkers, horses, cyclists... its just an accident waiting to happen if not!
Great introduction to the hunting forum... Bloody hell some of the posters on this thread would put me off it altogether if I didn't realise they were in the minority!
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
How angry you are people don't have to hold the same view as you and are allowed to express them, if you get so angry that you feel the need to resort to bad language on your first post I think the hunting forum mightn't be for you .
Personally I think there's far too many laws as there is and it would be all together better if the world was not full of people strutting around making things mandatory .
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
Agree, any policeman, driving instructor, etc will tell you that if you cannot stop in the distance you can clearly see, you are going too fast. It's every driver's responsibility to not kill people with their cars, be them pedestrians, cyclist or riders. Of course, there are always idiots and no amount of hi viz (always makes me think of the comic, that!) will save you from the likes of them.
tankgirl1
Well-Known Member
This is a forum, you are allowed to express your opinion, I am equally allowed to express my opinion
'Arse' and 'Bloody' are positively polite terms in the veterinary world
Don't worry, I won't allow your rude welcome to a newbie put me off either having a bash at hunting, or visiting this forum.
I still personally hold the opinion that high viz should be mandatory for road users.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
This is a forum, you are allowed to express your opinion, I am equally allowed to express my opinion
'Arse' and 'Bloody' are positively polite terms in the veterinary world
Don't worry, I won't allow your rude welcome to a newbie put me off either having a bash at hunting, or visiting this forum.
I still personally hold the opinion that high viz should be mandatory for road users.
I gave my opinion on an open forum as you did I was not rude to you I expressed my view as I would to any one being new does not give any special privileges in my book .
Why should people agree with you ?
I don't quite follow the coherence of your post but am I to infer you are calling me a Bloody Arse in your irrelevant reference to the veterinary world.
Of course you still hold your opinion why would you not .
But resorting to using language like completely unnecessary .
tankgirl1
Well-Known Member
I didn't call you a bloody arse lol
I wasn't rude to you either - we were both just voicing opinions on a public forum
Veterinary world is where I grew up - from age 17-now... swearing is rife in stressful life or death moments - rightly or wrongly - it just is!
Don't want to offend anyone - I'm a happy hacker who hopes to hunt next year. I just feel the issue of hi viz is important, and we should all wear the silly yellow stuff to keep us and other road users safe.
End of.
benson21
Well-Known Member
But surely its also every pedestrians, cyclist or rider (or anyone else for that matter) to help prevent being killed by being as visable as possible?
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
Since the Hunting Act 2004 anybody riding on a public road, assuming they are connected with hunting (I accept a large number are not) nevertheless, in the eyes of the public there was a general cutting down to size, in the eyes of the non-riding public.
Clearly that was the intention of the last Labour Government, any illusions or notions about animal welfare are secondary.
However hunting as such, now operates in a somewhat 'twilight' world (oh dear was that a pun in the thread subject) and therefore the whole subject and presentation needs to be seen with a revised overall (oh dear another one) generality.
Consequently if one is on one's horse on a public road wearing high-viz, even if one is following hounds, or not, it is likely your acceptance by society and or other road users will be more welcome.
Clearly that was the intention of the last Labour Government, any illusions or notions about animal welfare are secondary.
However hunting as such, now operates in a somewhat 'twilight' world (oh dear was that a pun in the thread subject
) and therefore the whole subject and presentation needs to be seen with a revised overall (oh dear another one) generality.Consequently if one is on one's horse on a public road wearing high-viz, even if one is following hounds, or not, it is likely your acceptance by society and or other road users will be more welcome.
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