Its schooling/dressage whip shopping time!!

ChristmasAngel said:
I have agopnised over replying to this thread as I so don't want to be a meanie............but I really do feel strongly that a novice rider and a schooling whip should not go together. I have watched your videos and you really do not have the control yet to be using one, let alone jump with one. If it is pink you want, please buy a pink crop.

I really do not want to cause offence here but it is something I feel very strongly about.

I don't want to knock your confidence TG, I can see you have made improvements already but please don't try to run before you can walk.
Click to expand...

exactly my thoughts - which i did comment on to someone else before. thank you for speaking up :)
 
Naturally said:
I don't agree, I learnt to ride with a schooling whip and it was much harder to accidentally hit/poke the horse with than my short crop.

Regardless of your or my opinions, shouldn't her instructors be making that decision, not us? :)
Click to expand...


Sadly I have seen too many novice riders come to grief because of schooling whips.

I would normally agree re your instructor comment but in this case I also don't think TG should have been jumping, she is simply not ready, I don't agree with that intructor call either.
 
thelwell_girl said:
I find it so much easier to use a schooling whip! Specially as all the horses I love to ride (including my beloved Bonnie!) can be, er, stubborn ;)
Click to expand...

I know how stubborn riding school horses can be and I do sympathise honestly, sadly it is par for the course.

If taking one hand of the reins causes you to lose balance, then I am sorry but you should not have a schooling whip on the flat let alone over jumps.
 
I dont think it does her any harm to be popping over a couple of very small cross poles but there is a long way to go for her.

I would say you would be better having a few intensive private lessons and maybe see if any friends have a non riding school horse to have a go on

Although im sure you have stated on here you have shared a horse before?

Also with riding school horses normally a small tap on the shoulder with a crop does the trick just to let them know to keep listening to you - this should not mean you have to take your hands off the reigns
 
ChristmasAngel said:
I know how stubborn riding school horses can be and I do sympathise honestly, sadly it is par for the course.

If taking one hand of the reins causes you to lose balance, then I am sorry but you should not have a schooling whip on the flat let alone over jumps.
Click to expand...

It used to cause me to lose balance. I have much better balance now!
 
Yes, I agree with Callyh if you could have a couple of lessons on a friends horse (minus whip! i need a smiley face here!) that would be a very good idea
 
CalllyH said:
I dont think it does her any harm to be popping over a couple of very small cross poles but there is a long way to go for her.

I would say you would be better having a few intensive private lessons and maybe see if any friends have a non riding school horse to have a go on

Although im sure you have stated on here you have shared a horse before?

Also with riding school horses normally a small tap on the shoulder with a crop does the trick just to let them know to keep listening to you - this should not mean you have to take your hands off the reigns
Click to expand...


I have had private lessons, but can simply not afford to have them every week! At the moment in my group lesson on a sunday, there is only one other girl and myself, so we get a semi-private for the same price as a group.

I did share a pony before, but I was much less confident. I couldnt canter but she was a nappy little beast who taught me loads, and as evil as could be, I still love her! I dont really know anyone who has a horse, apart from people at the yard. In the past I have ridden my instructors horse (well, large pony!) Howie, and am also starting to ride the more advanced horses at the stables (def didn't need a whip with Pally! :D)
 
I can understand that you can't afford it, they can be very very expensive! I also understand how hard it is to ride a lazy horse and sometimes you must feel 'stuck' but the fact that they are starting to put you on horses like Pally is a good sign that they think you are progressing.

My comments about the schooling whip were genuine and not in any way intended to upset you, but I still do not think you are ready to use one. I also believe that a novice should learn to use their legs, although I know how difficult that can be with aforesaid school horses. If your balance is now better, why not go back to the crop for the time being, I know that you say the whip lays across your leg, but from the jumping video you can see that it can become wayward at times.
 
ChristmasAngel said:
I can understand that you can't afford it, they can be very very expensive! I also understand how hard it is to ride a lazy horse and sometimes you must feel 'stuck' but the fact that they are starting to put you on horses like Pally is a good sign that they think you are progressing.

My comments about the schooling whip were genuine and not in any way intended to upset you, but I still do not think you are ready to use one. I also believe that a novice should learn to use their legs, although I know how difficult that can be with aforesaid school horses. If your balance is now better, why not go back to the crop for the time being, I know that you say the whip lays across your leg, but from the jumping video you can see that it can become wayward at times.
Click to expand...

Pally was amazing to ride, quite speedy but a really lovely genuine horse.

However... I do think its kinder to have a small flick with a schooling whip rather than the force of a normal crop. For jumping I'll go back to my short whip, but for flatwork, a long whip makes my life and the horses life a lot easier!
 
Just a thought, which I may get jumped on about, but I see a lot of persecution of TG on here recently - and all these threads getting longer and longer.

I think that whilst all the forum members who are criticising the poor girl and making suggestions (which can sometimes feel the same as criticism) all mean well, we should be very aware of how the written word comes across to others, particularly when the OP is obviously young.

Poor girl probably doesn't know who to turn to or which advice to listen to for the best, she should be having fun at her age/stage in her riding career.

I can appreciate people comment because they are concerned for her/the horses' safety, but I'm sure the people at the riding school are also concerned about that too, even if they are doing things in a different way to that which we all would - that's the horse world for you, whats "just common sense" to one is unnecessary health & safety hysteria to another.

By the way I'm not intending this to be directed at you, ChristmasAngel, nor at anyone in particular. Its the culmination of pages worth of opinions (which I do appreciate I have participated in, too) which are starting to concern me.
 
I take your point Naturally, but I get the impression from TG that she is eager to hear other people's opinions, as long as those opinions are not nasty and offensive TG appears to be listening to them.
 
Naturally said:
Just a thought, which I may get jumped on about, but I see a lot of persecution of TG on here recently - and all these threads getting longer and longer.

I think that whilst all the forum members who are criticising the poor girl and making suggestions (which can sometimes feel the same as criticism) all mean well, we should be very aware of how the written word comes across to others, particularly when the OP is obviously young.

Poor girl probably doesn't know who to turn to or which advice to listen to for the best, she should be having fun at her age/stage in her riding career.

I can appreciate people comment because they are concerned for her/the horses' safety, but I'm sure the people at the riding school are also concerned about that too, even if they are doing things in a different way to that which we all would - that's the horse world for you, whats "just common sense" to one is unnecessary health & safety hysteria to another.

By the way I'm not intending this to be directed at you, ChristmasAngel, nor at anyone in particular. Its the culmination of pages worth of opinions (which I do appreciate I have participated in, too) which are starting to concern me.
Click to expand...

Thank you for that Naturally :) However, while I am taking people's opinions into consideration (and I do thank you all for that!) obviously the 'final say' so to speak should probably come from my instructor/the staff at the yard.

fadedv said:
whoops!
Click to expand...

Oh, now you're making me wonder! PM me if you want to, I am genuinely interested in any advice people might want to offer.
 
I haven't looked at any of T_G's videos, so can't comment specifically, but from her posts, she's doing exactly what she should be doing, which is taking regular lessons and approaching things with open eyes as to her current abilities and her improvement. I didn't start using a schooling whip regularly until I had established an independent seat, but I can see the point that she finds it easier not to hit the horse accidentally with it, since it rests across the leg. Surely, her instructor is keeping an eye out, and will be the person in the best position to evaluate if she should carry it or not! And FWIW, I think it's a very nice-looking stick. Even though I favour plain black myself now, I had a bright green one when I was a kid! :)

Also, some people seem to be knocking group lessons quite a bit---apologies if I have misconstrued what you meant! With the right instructor, group lessons can be every bit as valuable as individual lessons. You learn from observing the others, and while the instructor is watching them, you have some moments of less stress to concentrate on yourself and sort out what you are being told. I take a mix of group lessons and private lessons. It allows me to take about 3 times as many lessons than I could otherwise afford.
 
It was just a comment about something I read in a horsey mag recently, where a top rider (I think it was Clayton Fredericks) was saying that he only schooled his most advanced horses with a schooling whip and preferred a short stick with the rest of them. Not really relevant to riding school horses, just thought it was interesting! I also said that I didn't think hitting a horse with a whip could ever be thought of as 'kind', because feeding them a carrot is kind, hitting them with a whip is not! However, using a whip is often 'necessary' which is quite different. I always carry a whip and am not shy about using it where necessary, fwiw! :)
 
Bit confused really.... the overall theme with people learning to ride these days basically seems to be that you should not be on a horse until you can ride perfectly. Errr...?? Also, lazy/slow horses are possibly, in my mind, THE hardest horses to learn to ride on! I did actually comment when I visited a RS with school once, and ended up on a cob (I have nothing against cobs) who honestly, I could not move for the life of me - thank god I'd borrowed a whip off someone! This was about 2yrs ago, I had my own horse and was probably past your average RS standard rider..... HOW anyone learned to ride on that animal, I honestly do not know. Anything beyond halt was actually painful to think about for me. The horse I was on in the afternoon was not much better......

I'd be more worried about the fact that RS's tend not to actually teach riders how to use the whip, long or short, so it basically does sod all anyway. RI's should teach clearly when & how the whip should be used, as well as why, as soon as the rider is capable of managing this (has decent control, can keep a reasonable contact and use their hands independantly, doesn't lose their balance easily)

Sorry for going off on one, but my randomness is nothing new to T_G, is it? :P
 
spookypony said:
I haven't looked at any of T_G's videos, so can't comment specifically, but from her posts, she's doing exactly what she should be doing, which is taking regular lessons and approaching things with open eyes as to her current abilities and her improvement. I didn't start using a schooling whip regularly until I had established an independent seat, but I can see the point that she finds it easier not to hit the horse accidentally with it, since it rests across the leg. Surely, her instructor is keeping an eye out, and will be the person in the best position to evaluate if she should carry it or not! And FWIW, I think it's a very nice-looking stick. Even though I favour plain black myself now, I had a bright green one when I was a kid! :)

Also, some people seem to be knocking group lessons quite a bit---apologies if I have misconstrued what you meant! With the right instructor, group lessons can be every bit as valuable as individual lessons. You learn from observing the others, and while the instructor is watching them, you have some moments of less stress to concentrate on yourself and sort out what you are being told. I take a mix of group lessons and private lessons. It allows me to take about 3 times as many lessons than I could otherwise afford.
Click to expand...

Spookypony you've managed to describe just why I love my group lessons! If you see some of the videos I've posted, you can hear the other people cheering me on, and it meant so much to me to have their support :o:)

And with regards to the (fabulous) pink stick... If ANY of the instructors/staff members on the yard saw me overusing or abusing the whip, they have my every permission to wallop me with it! NEVER have I or will I use a stick in anger. If I do, then that behaviour isnt worthy of the priveledge of riding.
 
Last edited:
fadedv said:
It was just a comment about something I read in a horsey mag recently, where a top rider (I think it was Clayton Fredericks) was saying that he only schooled his most advanced horses with a schooling whip and preferred a short stick with the rest of them. Not really relevant to riding school horses, just thought it was interesting! I also said that I didn't think hitting a horse with a whip could ever be thought of as 'kind', because feeding them a carrot is kind, hitting them with a whip is not! However, using a whip is often 'necessary' which is quite different. I always carry a whip and am not shy about using it where necessary, fwiw! :)
Click to expand...

I'd love to see that article! And obv the whip isnt kind... But good heavens on Dawi (a lovely blonde welsh D :D) it is necessary!!

Sol said:
Bit confused really.... the overall theme with people learning to ride these days basically seems to be that you should not be on a horse until you can ride perfectly. Errr...??
Click to expand...

Very true, Solly! How can we become better riders if we dont make mistakes/actually LEARN?

Sol said:
Also, lazy/slow horses are possibly, in my mind, THE hardest horses to learn to ride on! I did actually comment when I visited a RS with school once, and ended up on a cob (I have nothing against cobs) who honestly, I could not move for the life of me - thank god I'd borrowed a whip off someone! This was about 2yrs ago, I had my own horse and was probably past your average RS standard rider..... HOW anyone learned to ride on that animal, I honestly do not know. Anything beyond halt was actually painful to think about for me. The horse I was on in the afternoon was not much better......

I'd be more worried about the fact that RS's tend not to actually teach riders how to use the whip, long or short, so it basically does sod all anyway. RI's should teach clearly when & how the whip should be used, as well as why, as soon as the rider is capable of managing this (has decent control, can keep a reasonable contact and use their hands independantly, doesn't lose their balance easily)

Sorry for going off on one, but my randomness is nothing new to T_G, is it? :P
Click to expand...

You make valid points, Sol, and our (fab!) instructors teach everyone how and when to use the whip correctly.

And for the record I love your randomness! :D x
 
thelwell_girl said:
I'd love to see that article! And obv the whip isnt kind... But good heavens on Dawi (a lovely blonde welsh D :D) it is necessary!!

I am currently moving house and getting rid of horsey mags... PM me your postal address and you can have the magazine if you like! There are literally mountains of them which I cannot be bothered to box up, move and unbox!
Click to expand...
 
fadedv said:
I am currently moving house and getting rid of horsey mags... PM me your postal address and you can have the magazine if you like! There are literally mountains of them which I cannot be bothered to box up, move and unbox!
Click to expand...

Thanks!

*scampers off to PM :D*
 
Sol said:
I'd be more worried about the fact that RS's tend not to actually teach riders how to use the whip, long or short, so it basically does sod all anyway. RI's should teach clearly when & how the whip should be used, as well as why, as soon as the rider is capable of managing this (has decent control, can keep a reasonable contact and use their hands independantly, doesn't lose their balance easily):P
Click to expand...

I think it really depends on the RS! Both of the ones where I have spent the bulk of my time learning, have placed great emphasis on timing and precision with sticks of either kind. At the first place (in Canada, run by an Austrian dressage rider), all lessons were group lessons, with mixed abilities in every class. Beginners were taught on a lead rein from another pony with an assistant instructor, and as you learned, the main instructor might well take you aside for a portion of the lesson for a quick canter session on the longe line. It was a huge chaotic mix, but oddly enough, it worked very well, because the instructor was so flexible with his techniques. I still remember being so super-chuffed when I "earned my spurs", being judged to have a quiet enough leg to use them on a specific pony...

At the RS I go to now, one instructor in particular will often have us working with the horses in hand on lateral movements before doing them mounted, explaining in detail the theory behind what we are asking, and the use of the stick as an aid. There have also been lessons where we longe our classmates, and are asked to work with them on their positions, and lessons on long-reining. I do get the impression that this might not be standard at most riding schools, but I'm sure there are others!
 
Sol said:
I'm good at valid randomness ;) It's one of my strong points (which makes it sound like I have many.... xD)
Click to expand...

Aww Solly :D:D

spookypony said:
I think it really depends on the RS! Both of the ones where I have spent the bulk of my time learning, have placed great emphasis on timing and precision with sticks of either kind. At the first place (in Canada, run by an Austrian dressage rider), all lessons were group lessons, with mixed abilities in every class. Beginners were taught on a lead rein from another pony with an assistant instructor, and as you learned, the main instructor might well take you aside for a portion of the lesson for a quick canter session on the longe line. It was a huge chaotic mix, but oddly enough, it worked very well, because the instructor was so flexible with his techniques. I still remember being so super-chuffed when I "earned my spurs", being judged to have a quiet enough leg to use them on a specific pony...

At the RS I go to now, one instructor in particular will often have us working with the horses in hand on lateral movements before doing them mounted, explaining in detail the theory behind what we are asking, and the use of the stick as an aid. There have also been lessons where we longe our classmates, and are asked to work with them on their positions, and lessons on long-reining. I do get the impression that this might not be standard at most riding schools, but I'm sure there are others!
Click to expand...

Your group lessons sound amazing, so much fun! The first lot sound a bit too chaotic for me!
 
Seriously TG your posts really confuse me.

If I were you Id listen to your riding instructors advice as you seem so positive this is good advice and not constantly post on here for advice.
 
CalllyH said:
Seriously TG your posts really confuse me.

If I were you Id listen to your riding instructors advice as you seem so positive this is good advice and not constantly post on here for advice.
Click to expand...

Why do they confuse you?

I ask for advice... Might ask questions about what people have said, to fully understand where they are coming from.

Also, I dont post constantly asking for advice. If you feel I do, and it annoys you so much, then put me on user ignore and you wont have to see my posts! *simple meerkat noise*

~
Edit: Sorry if that sounds rude! Its just I dont know any other 'horsey' people, other than those at the yard. Who else can I ask?
 
Last edited:
Because you said you used to share a horse and to do that I would want my sharer to have quite a bit of competence and also you are now posting about buying XC colours which at your level i would have seriously not even considered doing
 
CalllyH said:
Because you said you used to share a horse and to do that I would want my sharer to have quite a bit of competence and also you are now posting about buying XC colours which at your level i would have seriously not even considered doing
Click to expand...

Right:

1. I shared a 13.2 pony. Two years ago. I only did w/t on her. The owners house adjoined the stable gates, and she watched me as I rode, or my parents did if she was in the house. The YM and the other parents also helped me out. I had lessons when I could.

How else can we learn to ride/become better if we dont get a chance? I was incredibly lucky to be offered this share, and wasnt going to turn it down because I felt nervous.

2. I WAS posting about XC colours because I thought I was going to do some XC with my riding school. However the fenced are quite big this year, so obviously I'm not going to go tearing round them! I'm going to wait till next summer, when I'll be a better jumper and when my instructors think I'm ready.
 
cougar said:
I personally think if people come on here asking for genuine advice, if any of us can do so, we should. After all, we all started somewhere. TG ask away.:)
Click to expand...

Hehe, I will! I have had loads of very useful help and advice from here (and some pointless comments ;)) and will continue to bother you all and force you to look at my humorous photos :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top