Jeep Cherokee 2002-2007 (also posted in Club House)

Got the reply today and they (vehicle safety branch at vosa) are currently collating information on this subject and will respond in due course.
They then suggest in the meantime contacting Jeep customer service.
 
Thanks for the info....as I say I am doing nothing until Jeep can put my vehicle back to how it is - WITH a towbar, otherwise the car will be useless to me. No way am I letting a dealership near it at the moment as they don't seem to have a clue what is going on. I'm sure this will come under some clause of the sale of goods act too. At the end of the day if we are forced to do this I will have to more or less scrap the car and I will get shot of the trailer too as I cannot justify the expense of another car as I spent the cash on this one! I am delighted with the car and will be gutted if it has to come to this. What Jeep are offering is simply NOT good enough and they will have to sort something out.
 
Totally useless bodge job fix....If Crysler want to push this I will be expecting them to put a fully operational tow hitch on orreimburse me for the cost of my vehicle, so I can get a new tow car....the reason I bought the car was for towing and I fully expect it to do that job, how can you have a car that has tow bar fixing points to not be able to be fitted with one???
 
I am absolutely fuming at all this and have been following the thread since it started.

My good friend saw this thread and pointed it out to me prior to any letter being sent to me but the letter has since arrived.

My Jeep is now booked in on the 10th December - I am trying to stall it to see what the hell is going on but also I'd rather not have this hanging over me either :(

My Garage just told me on the phone that they have run out of the cross beam part and that they have it on back order. They said they have done 20-30 Jeeps and not one has 'passed'.
They said my option was to either have the tow bar removed or sign the famous waiver.

I spoke (anonymously) to my insurance company to try to see where the land lay and was told that the cover would not be affected.
I will probably now ask my insurance company to put something in writing that insurance isn't affected if I decline having the towbar removed but I'm also reluctant to flag it to them.

What a complete and utter farce.
 
I am really grateful to have found this thread. I have a 1998 GC and have received a letter. Again it is diesel and has a Witter towbar.
The towbar tapers in from the rear and clears the tank adequately except at the rounded corners.

I had it "booked in" in Milton Keynes, but decided to clarify the "clearance" rule. I was told that it had to clear at "all points". This is not mentioned in the Jeep spec/instructions for the N45 recall http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/cs/jaxrs/download/doc/UCM462517/RCRIT-13V252-7854.pdf and so is another garage's interpretation.

When I tried to "unbook it" (saying that I needed it for towing) I was rudely told that I "have to" have it checked because it a recall and if I wanted to tow with it I would have to sign a waiver.

The interesting thing that she let slip was... " then if enough people sign the waiver and complain to Chysler they should do something about it"
I read this as the dealers wanting something to clout Chrysler with.

This I see as a sign of hope, but I told the lady on service reception that my car would simply not be available on the booked day, when she reluctantly cancelled the appointment.

I am an engineer and look after the car myself and so I can't believe that we have to put up with this totally unscientific nonsense.

I plan to hang on now to see where this goes.
 
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Ex
malcbw said:
I am really grateful to have found this thread. I have a 1998 GC and have received a letter. Again it is diesel and has a Witter towbar.
The towbar tapers in from the rear and clears the tank adequately except at the rounded corners.

I had it "booked in" in Milton Keynes, but decided to clarify the "clearance" rule. I was told that it had to clear at "all points". This is not mentioned in the Jeep spec/instructions for the N45 recall http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/cs/jaxrs/download/doc/UCM462517/RCRIT-13V252-7854.pdf and so is another garage's interpretation.

When I tried to "unbook it" (saying that I needed it for towing) I was rudely told that I "have to" have it checked because it a recall and if I wanted to tow with it I would have to sign a waiver.

The interesting thing that she let slip was... " then if enough people sign the waiver and complain to Chysler they should do something about it"
I read this as the dealers wanting something to clout Chrysler with.

This I see as a sign of hope, but I told the lady on service reception that my car would simply not be available on the booked day, when she reluctantly cancelled the appointment.

I am an engineer and look after the car myself and so I can't believe that we have to put up with this totally unscientific nonsense.

I plan to hang on now to see where this goes.
Click to expand...

There seems to be a lot of confusion in UK garages as to the interpretation of this inspection.
When we took our jeep in they had a copy of the Pdf quoted above and we did get to see it. It seems to be a bit vague in the section about clearances, the clearance in the centre seems self explanatory but then there are two lines pointing off to the sides. There is no explanation as to whether these lines are pointing to the gap at the side of the tank or the corners where the bar bends around.
There were three measuring tools. One for the centre clearance, one for cars with a tank skid pad fitted, and another one.
Trawling around the net I found a mention ( don't ask me where) that the clearance at the side of the fuel tank should be 20mm - this would fit in with the size of the third tool. I don't know if this 20mm applies to the corner of the tank but I guess it makes sense that it would.
I really can't see Chrysler-Fiat taking any notice of the number of waivers, they'll just be pleased to be relieved of any responsibility.
 
Thank you for confirming that you also think that the clearance information is vague.

Sorry, I was not clear in my original post, but I think our local dealer was hoping that Chysler would get fed up with complaints rather that waivers.

I suppose what is uncertain and why many of us are concerned, is what is the difference legally (and in the eyes of the insurance companies) between signing a waiver and not taking the vehicle in the first place? Is it illegal not to take a vehicle in for recall, particularly one that has been quite safe for 16 years?
 
Would just like to say thank you to HHO members for this thread, needed to replace a pick up and was really interested in a Jeep Cherokee having had one many moons ago. This thread made me change my mind and there is now a replacement Ford Ranger on my driveway!

Do hope that Jeep owners can get this problem resolved though, it sounds like a nightmare
 
Thanks for posting the above link, it makes it easy to see what is being (not) fitted. (Though without the hitch)
It does seem very vague, you'd think they'd have devised a definite yes/no method.
The other link further back about the very low uptake of recalls in the US is interesting too as they would be getting the proper hitch. I don't think there will be many owners in the UK calling into dealers to get the cross member fitted.
 
malcbw said:
I am really grateful to have found this thread. I have a 1998 GC and have received a letter. Again it is diesel and has a Witter towbar.
The towbar tapers in from the rear and clears the tank adequately except at the rounded corners.

I had it "booked in" in Milton Keynes, but decided to clarify the "clearance" rule. I was told that it had to clear at "all points". This is not mentioned in the Jeep spec/instructions for the N45 recall http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/cs/jaxrs/download/doc/UCM462517/RCRIT-13V252-7854.pdf and so is another garage's interpretation.

When I tried to "unbook it" (saying that I needed it for towing) I was rudely told that I "have to" have it checked because it a recall and if I wanted to tow with it I would have to sign a waiver.

The interesting thing that she let slip was... " then if enough people sign the waiver and complain to Chysler they should do something about it"
I read this as the dealers wanting something to clout Chrysler with.

This I see as a sign of hope, but I told the lady on service reception that my car would simply not be available on the booked day, when she reluctantly cancelled the appointment.

I am an engineer and look after the car myself and so I can't believe that we have to put up with this totally unscientific nonsense.

I plan to hang on now to see where this goes.
Click to expand...

Same here....can't afford to replace the towing car so will probably sell trailer as may end up having to scrap what is a lovely little car because I won't even be able to give it away...So furious. Will carry on as I am for now, but does anyone know where we stand regarding the MOT?
 
That's the paradox, it will pass the Mot because it really is not dangerous in terms of the guidelines of an MOT inspection.
It passed the MOT last year and the year before...and ...... The car has not changed, nor have the MOT regulations.
I have a series 3 Land Rover with a petrol tank protected only by a thin aluminium side panel (and it runs on petrol). This tank is much more likely to fracture in a (side) collision. It passes the MOT and I don't expect it to be recalled.
I am as annoyed with this nonsense as you are.
 
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Totally ridiculous isn't it? So what is this "waiver" all about then? My thinking is that it would absolve Chrysler of responsibility if my DIESEL fuel were to ignite after an accident...ever tried setting the stuff alight?? All it would do is turn the road into a skating rink....and then you would have to be hit very hard from behind.

In my vehicle brochure there is a whole section on towing, therefore it IS suitable for towing and therefore Chrysler should be sorting these cars out properly as they will no longer be fit for purpose.

I am with you on this malcbw, and will be seeing how it pans out, until I recieve something from VOSA themselves or my insurance company....
 
Thanks for your support maisie06, I am totally confident from an engineering point of view that the car is safe, but in this artificial health and safety world we are in, I am more worried about getting into legal trouble.
 
The problem is that this is being driven by the US arm of Chrysler.
They have known of the issue with the petrol jeeps but have fought a recall for about 5 years. They got to the point where they potentially faced being sued over it and the costs of that plus bad PR would have taken them down completely.
So they decided to offer the recall we are facing. Because it's been done voluntarily the vehicle safety authorities aren't interested in the viability of the solution for us consumers as Chrysler has responded to what they have been trying to achieve so their mission has been accomplished.
Jeeps were never available as diesels over in the US its an alien concept to them so our vehicles will never have been considered in the whole scheme over the pond at HQ.
 
If they are offering a tow hitch for US customers then they will have to offer a solution for UK customers, or sort out the recall so diesels are exempt. I'm sure as Chrysler are trading in the UK that we will be covered under the sale of goods act too. I have a feeling the waiver is so if you leave the towbar on you cannot sue Chrysler for the fuel tank exploding, but my independant garage have said that the Witter towbar I have is actually better than the Jeep crossbeam on offer. As I say I'm going to see how this pans out. After all as someone else said the streets are NOT littered with the debris of burning cherokees!!!! Legally, lord knows but surely insurance companies would be jumping a bit and sending letters asking to see if the recall has been carried out??

Very, very annoying as I am faced with being left without a towcar....I am now wondering if I can get a refund from witter as they knew about the recall several weeks before pulling their bar from the market, I must have got one of the last ones...
 
The tow bar produced and fitted in the US does not meet EU standards therefore won't be available here.
ive also seen on one of the U.S. forums that jeep made a change to the recall after it started over there and started fitting the same cross beam we are being told to have here.
Interestingly over there the authorities are pushing them to step up efforts to recall the vehicles as so far they've had a very low response rate. Sure that probably has a lot to do with the loss of towing ability. Wonder if VOSA will review the stats here?
 
It was only after inspecting the tow bar, that I realised how strong and well designed the Witter tow bar is. I really don't want it changed/removed at all, if I can get away with it.
 
This has been forwarded to me from another forum that deals with 4x4 there are many discussions on various forums both here and abroad regarding this debacle but this piece of information just made my heart sink a little further - it does not make for happy reading:

I did some research on this for a friend who was having issues with the dealer doing the recall, and came across some info that may explain why the european recall doesnt allow for the installation of a towbar in the recall.

First, i came across this, As of the 1st of August 1998 all Passenger Carrying Vehicles up to 3500 kg Gross Vehicle Weight (M1 Vehicles) can only be fitted with European Type Approved towbars if the vehicle has received European Whole Vehicle Type Approval. Non M1 vehicles, Light Commercial Vehicles and private imports from outside the EEC are not required to use Approved Towbars.

Then, i came across this in another article, The Liberty, Patriot, and Cherokee have never been tested, and have not recieved (ECWVTA) certification. This is a direct quote from the article when they discussed the Patriot, Despite being launched here in 2007, the Patriot has never been tested. The ageing offering is set for replacement by a new compact SUV that will fill the role of both the Patriot and its edgier Compass sibling from 2016. Later in the article they also mention the Cherokee and Liberty as not being certified either.


I may be understanding this wrong, but, if i am understanding it right, because those jeep models have never recieved the certification, then under European law, they cant be fitted with a towbar of any kind, which is why the recall doesnt allow for it in europe.
 
Email I have this evening sent to Jeep Customer Relations and Jeep Chairman Steven Zanlunghi

"I am disappointed that despite further emails to you I have still not received a reply. I have also been made aware of further information which infuriates me even more: I have provided the new information I have received below:

"I did some research on this for a friend who was having issues with the dealer doing the recall, and came across some info that may explain why the European recall doesn't allow for the installation of a towbar in the recall.

First, I came across this, As of the 1st of August 1998 all Passenger Carrying Vehicles up to 3500 kg Gross Vehicle Weight (M1 Vehicles) can only be fitted with European Type Approved towbars if the vehicle has received European Whole Vehicle Type Approval. Non M1 vehicles, Light Commercial Vehicles and private imports from outside the EEC are not required to use Approved Towbars.

Then, i came across this in another article, The Liberty, Patriot, and Cherokee have never been tested, and have not received (ECWVTA) certification. This is a direct quote from the article when they discussed the Patriot, Despite being launched here in 2007, the Patriot has never been tested. The ageing offering is set for replacement by a new compact SUV that will fill the role of both the Patriot and its edgier Compass sibling from 2016. Later in the article they also mention the Cherokee and Liberty as not being certified either.


I may be understanding this wrong, but, if i am understanding it right, because those Jeep models have never received the certification, then under European law, they cant be fitted with a towbar of any kind, which is why the recall doesn't allow for it in Europe."

As this debacle is allowed to rumble on with many, many people complaining about the poor or non-existant response from Jeep Customer Services, I feel it will only be a short period of time before a class action is brought against Jeep to rectify this situation that we find ourselves in through no fault of our own. This vehicle is advertised as having good towing abilities yet this fault will prevent us from doing just that.

Yet again I wait your response."
 
When I contacted my local jeep garage about the recall, they said that they were only interested in ones that didnt have a towbar. So on that basis i am doing nothing until I get something else in writing. .
 
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Puddleduck said:
http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKCN0IZ0WA20141115?irpc=932

Sorry havent worked out how to post proper links.
Click to expand...

Could get messy for the guy.
I wondered about the Fiat take over, so Googled it found that the US and Canadian government have 10% each so 20% same as Fiat( rising to 35%) and this bit is interesting
"Consumer groups and individuals with product-related lawsuits also contested a condition of the Chrysler sale that would release the company from product liability claims related to vehicles it sold before the asset sale to Fiat. Compensation for such claims would have to come from the parts of the company not being sold to Fiat. But those assets have limited value and it's unlikely there will be anything to pay out".
Did they see it coming?
 
I've just got back from the dealer. I was given 2 options- remove towbar fit beam and not be able to fir another towbar or sign waiver.

It's total rubbish. They should not be able to render this car unfit for purpose. I also rang customer services and they said there is no towbar authorised for use on this car. :/ so I'd be interested to know if anyone knows where i can buy one that will pass?

I'm delaying work for as long as I can while we get this sorted out.

Not happy today
 
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