Just been told pony has PSSM

[EternalVetBills]

We got the results back yesterday and my mums little pony has PSSM. We know absolutely nothing about this as never had one with it before. Out vet has been fantastic and we've obviously been doing lots of reading since yesterday.

Was just wondering if anyone with horses with this condition had any good management strategies that perhaps a vet wouldn't have mentioned?

He's been getting daily exercise for about a month now and we plan on keeping that as consistent as possible. He's on soaked hay and Pure Fibre as a feed which the vet seemed happy with, and we keep him on a track system. Is there anything else we should/could do to help him?

 

[Snow Falcon]

Which variant? Vit E is helpful in Type 1.

 

[ycbm]

Most people find they need to keep their PSSM horses very warm, to the point where others will accuse you of over rugging. This wasn't an issue with my PSSM2 horse but I think he was the rarity.
.

 

[catembi]

There are several very helpful groups on FB if you use that? Some very knowledgeable people with lots of experience.

 

[EternalVetBills]

Which variant? Vit E is helpful in Type 1.

Type 1 I believe, she said it was the genetic one.

 

[EternalVetBills]

Most people find they need to keep their PSSM horses very warm, to the point where others will accuse you of over rugging. This wasn't an issue with my PSSM2 horse but I think he was the rarity.
.

The vet mentioned that. We have noticed in winter that his muscles get really hard if he gets cold and he can get very angry when that happens, but equally he's a very hot and itchy horse. That's going to be a balancing act isn't it

 

[EternalVetBills]

There are several very helpful groups on FB if you use that? Some very knowledgeable people with lots of experience.

Oh I will look, thank you

 

[SEL]

They're all a bit different but my Appy with P1 needs to be kept warm especially on wet, windy days like this. It's those bottom muscles that need to be warm rather than checking armpits

Vitamin E and selenium are good antioxidants. You may need to buy a separate vitamin E supplement - stick with natural rather than synthetic.

I used to have to soak hay and I still do if she's going to be stabled overnight. You need to avoid glycogen building up in those muscles and you can only do that by exercise (faster work) or by feeding low sugar. If she's in a stable and can't walk about then I need to keep her sugar / starch intake as low as pos.

She seems to be at the very sensitive end of the PSSM spectrum. I lost my Ardennes last year and he also has PSSM but really had no issues. He was my equine lawnmower and never had a problem with grass. If he'd been the only horse I'd had with PSSM I'd have wondered what the fuss was but the Appy has been very tricky to manage

What led you to test?

 

[ycbm]

The vet mentioned that. We have noticed in winter that his muscles get really hard if he gets cold and he can get very angry when that happens, but equally he's a very hot and itchy horse. That's going to be a balancing act isn't it

That's a tough one.
Rock and a hard place!

 

[scats]

I think Polly has PSSM. Haven’t got round to getting her tested yet, but had massive changes with vitamin e oil, to the point that she popped herself into canter on the lunge a few days ago and happily cantered round (this pony has refused to canter in the school for 5 years… my jaw was on the floor!)
I’m trying to learn as much about it as possible but I have her on a low sugar/starch diet and added vitamin e oil (forage plus stuff)

She came in shivering this morning from the relentless rain, so she was rugged up today and I’ve rugged her up tonight in a 50g, given the forecast.

 

[scats]

The vet mentioned that. We have noticed in winter that his muscles get really hard if he gets cold and he can get very angry when that happens, but equally he's a very hot and itchy horse. That's going to be a balancing act isn't it

Mine is a hot and itchy horse too, so definitely a balancing act. I’m still trying to get it right.

 

[Lilly-Mayspookatbags]

Mare has suspected Pssm - and is a very hot horse . One of easiest things to do is to clip all year round . In summer a fly rug with waterproof strip is a god send . In winter … I’m still figuring that part out

 

[SEL]

Mine is a hot and itchy horse too, so definitely a balancing act. I’m still trying to get it right.

Mine is in 50g tonight

You'd have her down as a hot horse but she needs to be toasty. I first realised when I needed to take a rug off one morning when she was on grass livery and I couldn't get near her. I had a train to catch so had to leave her and it was 15 degrees and sunny. I thought she'd boil but she was more relaxed and forward going that evening than she'd ever been.

Great to hear how vitamin E is working with Polly

 

[paddy555]

The vet mentioned that. We have noticed in winter that his muscles get really hard if he gets cold and he can get very angry when that happens, but equally he's a very hot and itchy horse. That's going to be a balancing act isn't it

Normal rugging rules don't apply for these horses .If there is the choice of hot or in pain I would go with avoiding the "in pain" part. Mine has a 450g varilayer rambo in winter, all winter. His muscles stay soft all winter and he doesn't roast even though he grows a thick coat which is mostly clipped. Now he is out overnight in a 100g because of the rain or risk of it. No rug and he would be stiff in the morning. If I bring him back from riding in winter the 450g normally goes straight on but if it didn't I would put a blanket over his hind quarters underneath a sweat rug/cooler.


In winter clip the front and under the belly but leave the hair on behind the saddle and down to something like a trace clip. Then rug. When exercising always an exercise sheet even if only slightly cold and always keep dry if it is raining either in the field or riding.
Track sounds great, daily exercise and bear in mind if you stable for a longer period he is at risk of stiffening up. Equally if you travel him. Some do have problems stiffening up travelling.

Everyone is different and you have to experiment. You already know that yours has a getting cold problem if his muscles get hard and he gets angry ie pain so you have a good starting point. Vit E of course.

 

[EternalVetBills]

Thank you everyone! Really appreciate all the advice. Biggest thing I'm seeing is that he'll need a desperate wardrobe update! He currently owns a sheet, 50g, and a 100g, and if he wears the 100g maybe 3 times over winter, that's a lot. To whoever said they'd rather have hot than in pain, I 100% agree! I rugged him last night when I wouldn't normally and, although grumpy and itchy, he is so much looser and happier in himself. He actually is letting me stroke him without going all twitchy and angry.

It's going to be 18° here all day today, I would normally leave him naked, but should I be keeping a rug on him now? WWYD? The other day with similar temperatures he was really stiff and angry by the end of the day. I feel like I'm back to being a novice with no idea what to do again

 

[paddy555]

Thank you everyone! Really appreciate all the advice. Biggest thing I'm seeing is that he'll need a desperate wardrobe update! He currently owns a sheet, 50g, and a 100g, and if he wears the 100g maybe 3 times over winter, that's a lot. To whoever said they'd rather have hot than in pain, I 100% agree! I rugged him last night when I wouldn't normally and, although grumpy and itchy, he is so much looser and happier in himself. He actually is letting me stroke him without going all twitchy and angry.

It's going to be 18° here all day today, I would normally leave him naked, but should I be keeping a rug on him now? WWYD? The other day with similar temperatures he was really stiff and angry by the end of the day. I feel like I'm back to being a novice with no idea what to do again

no one can answer your question I'm afraid. You rugged last night and he is looser and happier. You've got an answer from him. He is the one to ask I'm afraid. HHO can only guess!!!!
Put a 50g on today and see what happens and what he tells you.

there is no"pony club manual" for this. You just have to experiment and keep a diary. As you say you are back to being a novice (as we all were)

mine had a 100g amigo on last night, when he goes out today he will have an Aussie allrounder (a quite heavy fly rug) provided it is dry.
Tonight I won't risk the weather (in view of the forecast for the beginning of next week) so it will be 100g again.

I'm sure people look over our hedge as they ride past and think why on earth is she rugging a horse in this weather. That is cruel. He OTOH is painfree and happy. It's not easy. Must be a nightmare on a livery yard if people keep criticising.

 

[scats]

Mine was in a 50g last night and was at the bottom of the field munching today, rather than waiting at the gate, despite it being quite warm this morning. She’s come in and I toyed with putting something on her but she felt quite warm in the stable so I left her naked but I’m now wondering if I should have popped a fleece on.

 

[SEL]

Rather than replacing the rug wardrobe I can highly recommend layering! I have a 100g 7 foot Shires (she's 6'6") which I throw over her day rug in winter rather than strip her off. It means she's still got the warmth of whatever rug she's been in but with another 100g for overnight. Plus I've found layering reduces the risk of leakage in heavy rain.

In that ridiculous cold spell in Dec she was out in her 400g during the day and her 200g went over at night. I'm trying to remember if I shoved a 200g stable rug under it all too and think I probably did. I don't think her stable mate got above 200g and the native pony was naked!

It's grey here and she was naked when I went out for a ride but she was looking grumpy so now has a rug on.

 

[SEL]

Oh and the number of times on livery I had .... So you're rugging her then...in "that" tone of voice

I did use to say please don't judge your own rugging strategy based on my horse with a chronic health condition. They'd normally shut up. Although it was nice to be on livery at a yard where they did a lot of showing and they were all bundled up

 

[EternalVetBills]

They're all a bit different but my Appy with P1 needs to be kept warm especially on wet, windy days like this. It's those bottom muscles that need to be warm rather than checking armpits

Vitamin E and selenium are good antioxidants. You may need to buy a separate vitamin E supplement - stick with natural rather than synthetic.

I used to have to soak hay and I still do if she's going to be stabled overnight. You need to avoid glycogen building up in those muscles and you can only do that by exercise (faster work) or by feeding low sugar. If she's in a stable and can't walk about then I need to keep her sugar / starch intake as low as pos.

She seems to be at the very sensitive end of the PSSM spectrum. I lost my Ardennes last year and he also has PSSM but really had no issues. He was my equine lawnmower and never had a problem with grass. If he'd been the only horse I'd had with PSSM I'd have wondered what the fuss was but the Appy has been very tricky to manage

What led you to test?

The reason we decided to test is, we do yearly bloods on him for other reasons and for the past few years one of the markers has come back as abnormal. The vet said wait and see the first couple of times, but this year said she felt we should test properly as it's come up 3 times now.

 

[EternalVetBills]

Thank you all! I went with a rug in the end as I didn't take my hoodie off all morning, don't normally use myself as a gauge for horse temperatures, but guess he's going to be a bit different than normal. My mum was really happy when she came up to lunge him, said he was much happier and looked lovely and free. I did get a few raised eyebrows when I put my mare away naked and him bundled up like it's January, but if he's happy I don't care!

Does anyone know, if he has a bad episode, does bute help at all? Or is it one of those conditions that it just won't touch? I did ask my vet, but it was end of day on Friday so I guess she probably won't answer till tomorrow.

ETA: Vet said it was important if he's having a bad spell that he be exercised as much as he can cope with, hence my asking if bute would help him to cope with that.

 

[ycbm]

When my mare tied up she was pumped full of intravenous bute, so I think it might help. I would have thought a sachet or a half would be worth a try. Hopefully someone with more experience with it will be along soon.

 

[paddy555]

ETA: Vet said it was important if he's having a bad spell that he be exercised as much as he can cope with, hence my asking if bute would help him to cope with that.

I'm not a vet. I personally would give 2 sachets (horse) and expect improvement within 3 hours. If that happened to show bute's effectiveness I may carry on. If nothing after that time then I would give up.
I think it will be try it and see.

Your vet seems very much on the ball.

If having a bad spell and maybe unrideable I would exercise in hand or long rein around the roads..

 

[SEL]

Thank you all! I went with a rug in the end as I didn't take my hoodie off all morning, don't normally use myself as a gauge for horse temperatures, but guess he's going to be a bit different than normal. My mum was really happy when she came up to lunge him, said he was much happier and looked lovely and free. I did get a few raised eyebrows when I put my mare away naked and him bundled up like it's January, but if he's happy I don't care!

Does anyone know, if he has a bad episode, does bute help at all? Or is it one of those conditions that it just won't touch? I did ask my vet, but it was end of day on Friday so I guess she probably won't answer till tomorrow.

ETA: Vet said it was important if he's having a bad spell that he be exercised as much as he can cope with, hence my asking if bute would help him to cope with that.

It does help. How much exercise depends on how bad he is

I screwed up at the end of April. Heavy rain due in so I thought I'd pop them back on the winter field they'd vacated 10 days before. Under estimated grass growth and knew the minute I saw her hobble to the gate the next morning I was in trouble. Saturday and I was supposed to be heading away for the day

2 Bute in breakfast. She ate it then lay down. Got her up. Rugged her, muzzled her (you need the glycogen out of their system) and turned her out with a pile of hay. Lay down again.

Phoned OOH vet and triage vet was flapping about sycamore poisoning - I knew it wasn't - but finally put me through to a practice vet. The Appy was on her feet by now and eating hay so vet said she'd be fine so long as she was moving. It's important they move at their own pace, not be chased about, but the Bute certainly helps get them over the ouchy bit and walking around - it just takes a while to kick in. By that evening she was moving ok and furious at the muzzle but got another Bute (she's 650kg) just for safety.

Walked out gently in hand for next two days but not far and not pushing her.

You'll find canter is usually the first pace to go if they're struggling although a PSSM trot can be interesting - if you don't know what's going on it's like they're lame all round.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I'm wondering about Arabi and pssm he was really not quite right this morning he was out in a 50g last night, it was 9 degrees and windy and wet and his got a fine coat I should have put a 100g on thinking about it.

I get up this morning and part of my fence had come down I think possibly Louis had pulled it as Arabi won't go near the fence generally, when I get them in to sort it out I notice Arabi was not walking properly almost like his legs were just not hardly moving like shuffling.

I think he looked a bit tucked up and his back end looked rigid to me and he seemed a bit too quiet, I thought maybe he was just a bit stiff from possibly running about last night,vthe ground was a bit cut up in places so they had obviously been silly in the night.

I kept him in all day and gave him 2 bute and he looked better so I've just put him out for an hour and he was walking much better, he will be kept in tonight and if not right tomorrow will get the vet.

But just reading this thread makes me wonder if something else is going on or if its just a case of a bit stiff and got a bit cold last night.??

 

[SEL]

My friend's Arab has tied up twice - stress being the cause each time. She doesn't appear to have a myopathy but she's had laminitis so is off grass anyway.

But I have a lot of friends who believe in keeping horses without rugs and every winter when they start wondering whether their horses have a PSSM variant I suggest a rug. I think the weather recently has been more like Nov so hopefully that's all that's up with yours.

 

[paddy555]

My friend's Arab has tied up twice - stress being the cause each time. She doesn't appear to have a myopathy but she's had laminitis so is off grass anyway.

But I have a lot of friends who believe in keeping horses without rugs and every winter when they start wondering whether their horses have a PSSM variant I suggest a rug. I think the weather recently has been more like Nov so hopefully that's all that's up with yours.

I see that so many times and it beggars belief that they can't stop worrying about what they believe in and consider the management of their one particular horse who may not be the same as other people's horses.

PB has he ever tied up?
Have you considered experimenting for a couple of weeks (assuming we don't have a heat wave) and rug in 100g and give or increase your vit E. Just to see if there is any change. It may well be they had a barney last night, he got slightly hurt and then just stood and stiffened up.

The weather is just all over the place ATM. It's difficult to tell which month we are in so for some (non PSSM horses as well) it will be a case of reconsidering their rugging. Others will be fine.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

My friend's Arab has tied up twice - stress being the cause each time. She doesn't appear to have a myopathy but she's had laminitis so is off grass anyway.

But I have a lot of friends who believe in keeping horses without rugs and every winter when they start wondering whether their horses have a PSSM variant I suggest a rug. I think the weather recently has been more like Nov so hopefully that's all that's up with yours.

I just put him out for an hour earlier got him in about 8 and he marched in and didn't look so tucked up and looked his normal self so I put a fleece on him and will check on him about midnight, so hopefully it might have been a rough night for him with the rain and fence.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I see that so many times and it beggars belief that they can't stop worrying about what they believe in and consider the management of their one particular horse who may not be the same as other people's horses.

PB has he ever tied up?
Have you considered experimenting for a couple of weeks (assuming we don't have a heat wave) and rug in 100g and give or increase your vit E. Just to see if there is any change. It may well be they had a barney last night, he got slightly hurt and then just stood and stiffened up.

The weather is just all over the place ATM. It's difficult to tell which month we are in so for some (non PSSM horses as well) it will be a case of reconsidering their rugging. Others will be fine.

His never tied up had him all his life his 19 now I can see by the field they have scooted about, I'm hoping he just had a rough night he seemed more himself when I got him in.

I am going to get him some vitamin E he has pro balance but his not been eating it so not getting the right amount, I'm going to up his rugs slightly as well his hardly got any coat anyway.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Should you feed oil with vitamin E they do have micronised linseed most of the year is that enough they only get about 50 to 100g a day, I ran out last month and didn't buy one as it was summer as Louis can get too fat on it but can get some.