Keeping cobs weight down is a nightmare task... any advice? Pics included.

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Ashleigh_

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Argh :(

I know that there is no point flopping about all 'woe is me' when it comes to Ronnie's weight but I really am despairing now it's nearly summer and the spring grass is coming through. I was hoping that now my confidence has improved and i'm able to work him for longer and more throughly without having a meltdown that over the winter he would have lost some weight but it doesn't seem to have happened :(

I feel like it's a constant struggle to keep his weight down, he gets barely anything as it is and I wondered if anyone had some bright ideas or plan of action? Grazing muzzle, soaked hay? less/increasingly limited turnout?

At the moment he has a handful, and I mean A HANDFUL of hifi lite just to get his vit and min supplement down him in the morning. When he comes in at night he has just one haynet, which has very small holed and is always attacked and empty by the morning. He gets about 10hrs turnout a day on a purposefully small restricted patch of rubbish grass with one other pony for company. I have already moved him away from the big herd as there was too much grass in that field.

In terms of riding, he was ridden about 4 times a week either in the school/out hacking/jumping small xpoles in the summer field/long reining. Although admittedly, in the last two weeks that's declined as i've moved and had loads to sort out etc. I'm hoping to get going again now everything is in and unpacked. We do lots of hill work when out hacking and prolonged periods of trot to get his stamina up.

Is there anything else someone can suggest? I'm taking him to our first local show on the 29th to do the cob, coloured and 'show ring experience' in hand classes and although my only expectation is for him to behave himself and us to enjoy it I'd be so embarrassed to get marked down for his weight or comments to be made about it. On the condition scoring 1-5 system he comes out as a 4, but that's probably me being kind, his neck and tummy look the worst areas as you can see :(

Sorry for the rant, but any guidance towards the next step to tackle this in terms of management would be fantastic. I love him dearly, but desperately want him to be a healthy boy and avoid, amongst other things, any grass related sickness.
:(

He's 6yrs old and 15.2hh
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Trun him out at night, not in the day. The grass is much lower in sugar at night. Feed him hay or haylage during the day that has been soaked in lots of water for at least 12 hours. Three times a week do short bursts (30 seconds three times will do it) of VERY intense exercise - as fast as he can gallop. There is good evidence in humans that that kind of exercise drastically changes the ability to use insulin, which will help him use calories instead of laying it down as fat. From my own experience it does similar things to horses.
 
He's gorgeous! It sounds like you're working hard already to keep his weight down so the only things I can suggest are:

1. To increase the hay he gets overnight (double netted if needed) but soak it well before feeding, or add straw to bulk it out so he doesn't go out hungry for fresh grass.

2. To muzzle him when he's out - and you may find that he loses more weight muzzled in a bigger area with more horses to encourage movement, than unmuzzled in a small paddock where he is able to stand still and eat.

Good luck! :)
 
Also, feed soaked hay when in. This has done wonders for my previously fatty cob. :)
Having good doers is bloomin hard work.

ps. He's lovely.
 
Bless him, what an absolute beauty!

I have a very similar mare, her grazing muzzle is a god send - you may find that he wears one happily. Definitely worth a try. She usually goes through a bucket muzzle a year as she won't wear the more sturdy Green guard.

I really do think that CPtrayes advice of the bursts of serious work is perfect. I have only had my mare for two years and the last five months have seen her on longer hacks with exciting bursts of canter and gallop, her weight is stable and she comes out at about a 3.5 on condition. Much better than last year and the only change is that I have grown in confidence and I am prepared to do some faster work with her as is her sharer.

He really is stunning. Love his little face x
 
With Frank I used to do 6 days in work, two of those being for proper fast work/interval training on a long flat stretch of turf (we don't have any hills round here anyway!), in essence I always had him as fit/slim as I could.

Given that he hasn't really been in work all winter he (surprisingly to me!) hasn't done too badly on only slightly less hay than his usual adlib and turnout on grass in the day. When the grass started growing I was proper worrying!, as we have them at home we have put them on a track system for the summer and boy are they moving about more for their grub! I think it is doing him the world of good as given the option he will just stand and stuff!
 
Be realistic with the amount of work he gets.

When you school, how long are you in there for and how much of the session is spent actually working, how much is plodding around? I schooled for an hour today, realistically I'd say 50% in walk, 45% trot and 5% canter.

When you hack, how many miles do you do? E.g. yesterday morning I did a 7 mile hack in 1 3/4 hours. We walked up a huge hill, didn't canter much, but did long sections of trotting on roads, perhaps a mile at a time. Being able to measure your route with a car or handheld GPS is useful.
 
He is gorgeous and honestly doesn't look as fat as I was expecting from your description. I would second the idea of giving him more well-soaked hay, mixed with good quality oat straw/chaff to fill him up, so that he doesn't gorge on grass when he gets outside.
I've never used one but would suggest a muzzle with more field to move around in would be better than restricted turnout. I find that ours stay fitter when on the hilly grazing than on the flat.
Does he really need anything in a bucket?
 
It's very hard I agree as some are just extraordinary good doers, I have the same problem as mine comes out of the winter barely having lost a kg. We were restricted to haylage at our yard. Therefore once they move onto the summer grazing I have to stable mine for 12-15 hours each 24 hour period in the summer and try and ride 5 times a week if I can. In the heat and flies though he doesn't seem to mind some time in.
Building up more trotting work is what I plan to do this summer if the ground allows as that seems to shift weight a bit and improve his fitness.

Some recent research into equine obesity showed that some 300kg ponies will consume as much dry weight/energy intake when on grass as a 500 kg racehorse! - pony types are hard wired to eat I think!

Ronnie still looking lovely though :)
 
I share your pain but have finally got a system that works for us. It is hard work though!!

I soak all hay for 12hrs plus and feed in tiny holed nets (trickle nets). Only exception is middle of winter when it is too frozen to soak. Soaked hay has made a huge, huge difference. I weigh it and she gets exactly 1.5% of bodyweight. With the trickle nets she doesn't run out though usually :)

I bring in during the day from now until Oct and turn out at night muzzled. I've not started muzzle just yet as we are still on winter field and grass not through yet - but it will be any day now. Once I start she will not be allowed on grass without muzzle at all, no exceptions. Harsh but if I take it off she binges. She only stays out 24/7 if I am away and can't get anyone to bring her in for me. I miss 24/7 turnout though :(

I ride 6 times a week from end March-end Oct, at least 2 long hacks (2hrs+), 2 short hacks (45mins-1hr) and 2 schooling sessions (45 mins ish - may include jumping) or a show. Over winter 4 times per week if weather allows (I work full time and can't hack in the week in winter)

I feed lo-cal balancer all year round with small amounts of TopChop lite chaff and her hoof supplement.

This year, first time ever she is going into Spring not fat. Not thin exactly but looking ok. I, on the other hand, am shattered!!

The combination of decent amount of work + muzzle + restricted turnout + 12hr soaked hay has worked. Individually they weren't enough :(
 
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Can you run a track system? So basically make a track out of electric fencing around the outside of a big field so he has to keep walking (with a muzzle on if there's lot of grass). This was really good for our horses last year as although fattties they're a bit arthritic so needed to be kept moving rather than being in a smaller area.
 
I tend to muzzle my fatties - that way they continue moving with their mates and can trickle graze but not gorge! You're doing well to think of it now as he is stunning and not too far gone yet ;)!
 
Wow he's gorgeous, can i steal him?
I would have the same problem but I have a 10 year old daughter who rides him fast and hard (cross country etc.) and he's in great shape, typical kid is always tearing around, me i just plod lol.
Kids riding these types really do keep their weight down, do u have this option? If not then a small bare paddock with minimal soaked hay is really your only option. These types really need work to keep them in shape, and high energy work.
 
He is gorgeouuuuuus! Really nicely marked:) My old pony used to be a barrel :D I definitely second the turning out at night and keeping in in the day, we do the same with any laminitis prone ponies as the sugar content is a lot lower, you could also have a go with the grazing muzzle but when I tried it on mine she got it off every time, it was fitted correctly but she always managed to get it off :rolleyes: however i've heard they work for many others so i'd give it a go.

To be honest i'd much rather have a good doer than having to constantly fight to keep weight on my TB :o
 
nirikina said:
Be realistic with the amount of work he gets.

When you school, how long are you in there for and how much of the session is spent actually working, how much is plodding around? I schooled for an hour today, realistically I'd say 50% in walk, 45% trot and 5% canter.

When you hack, how many miles do you do? E.g. yesterday morning I did a 7 mile hack in 1 3/4 hours. We walked up a huge hill, didn't canter much, but did long sections of trotting on roads, perhaps a mile at a time. Being able to measure your route with a car or handheld GPS is useful.
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Wow, thanks to everyone for all your advice! :)
It's difficult in terms of turning out as i'm on a rather large livery yard and as flexible and accommodating as it is if everyone had everything designed specifically around them you can imagine the chaos that would prevail! Also, not that it should be a problem but I also work up there part time mucking out etc and cover extra shifts so I don't want to be accused of getting extra 'perks'. I'll ask if Ronnie could perhaps change and go out at night with the small group of 3 that currently do, and it seems soaked hay and a tricklenet might have to be invested in.. (the price!! :o :o ) I'm reluctant to shove a grazing muzzle on him until i've tried everything else - I know I know 'cruel to be kind' but i'd rather give other options a go first.

Re: Straw - How much do you mix in with the hay? Does it have to be soaked too? Does it have to be a certain type of straw?
I have heard of this method before, but having also heard about horses eating their straw beds and then having colic i've not pursued it, if someone can give me some more info on this then it's definitely an option. thank you :)

Nirikina - I'd say that most of our schooling sessions don't really include much plodding around (I wish they did sometimes! :D ) Ronnie's quite strong and forward going so if I were to try and make him plod along on a loose rein we wouldn't stay there for long. I find that lots of trotting in circles/serpentines/fig.8 keeps him listening which means he's not so strong and also allows him to have a good stretch out but at a pace i've agreed on. We have also been working loads on his outline. Whilst obviously not being the most experienced, or confident of pairs ( :p ) i'd say I expect quite a lot from him. My recent previous threads have included pictures of our schooling, and also a video of our canter hacks so you can see on there the sort of stuff we do. If i'm feeling particularly nervous on certain days I tend to stick him on the long reins (pics also on recent past posts) so I can include lots of canter work too as i'm aware that his exercise requirements should be met, regardless of how bad my nerves i'm feeling that day. I'd say we spend about an hour in the school, or out in the summer jumping field. Our hacks vary a lot as it depends who else i'm hacking with and what sort of time limit they are on, it can range from 30mins round the village to 2hrs canter hacks, but normally if they are short I go in the school after. I hope that helps, thank you though :) x
 
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A trickle net has worked a treat with Mr Cob! He is ridden 6 days a week, 2xschooling, 1xjumping/light hacking, 2xsmaller hack and 1x longer hack. OH is currently schooling once a week with him and really makes him work! He's living out on a night now and lives on shavings as we came to yard everyday for a week to find him tucking into a decent amount of his bedding! He also gets a handful of chaff with his supplements. He's got a tendency to be a barrel, havnt been as cruel as to muzzle him just yet lol!
 
Well I don't know anything about keeping your cob's weight down but what I do have to say is that what a lovely coblet you have there. Absolutely stunning :D
 
**Vanner** said:
He is gorgeous and you wont be laughed at showing!

Soaking hay really helps and I was told for my big lad once he's out grazing no more than 2kg per night!!!!
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Wow !!, if he moves straight and is a well mannered ride - pop him in the post to me. I will leave his weight where it is, hog and clip him to within an inch of his life and ..................see you at HOY's maxi cob.

On a serious note, the others have helped you. Good luck
 
Ashleigh_ said:
What's in the field? :s
Do you mind phrasing it a little better, sorry :( :o

Our grazing is really good, hence why I moved him onto a smaller patch which had already been used and eaten down :)
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Oh sorry. What I mean is do you have meadow plants in there or just grass?
 
Ronnie is very handsome - and weight wise is very similar to my 15hh hw cob. I am also struggling with his weight, so will be reading all these replies carefully for ideas. We have so much grass at the moment, that even his small starvation paddock is just too much :(
 
cptrayes said:
Trun him out at night, not in the day. The grass is much lower in sugar at night. Feed him hay or haylage during the day that has been soaked in lots of water for at least 12 hours. Three times a week do short bursts (30 seconds three times will do it) of VERY intense exercise - as fast as he can gallop. There is good evidence in humans that that kind of exercise drastically changes the ability to use insulin, which will help him use calories instead of laying it down as fat. From my own experience it does similar things to horses.
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There was a documentary recently on BBC, I think it was called the truth about exercise. They looked at all aspects of diet and exercise and tested things like insulin levels. The conclusion was that short bursts of exercise were less effective than constant activity - not sitting down and being on the go all the time.

I am sure this is true of our horses too. I have a CB who is a nightmare to keep trim. We are doing endurance next weekend. She is worked every day - a variety of activity lunging, schooling and hacking. All last winter her hay was weighed, she gets safe and sound with non-molassed s/b and looks like she is about to foal!!! We don't have a flush of spring grass as it has been very dry.

Most of our native breeds worked hard for a living in harness or as ridden transport. I think it is very difficult for riders today who have jobs and families to give a horse the amount of work it needs - 4 hours a day.

I wonder if a pasture mgt system where the horse has to walk a long way to find his feed might help you. I think it is called pasture paradise?

I really do sympathise it is very difficult.
 
Ashleigh_ said:
Just grass :)
I hadn't really given it much thought about whether meadow plants would make a difference, probably a stupid question, but do they?
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I must write about this again sometime. But a field should have meadow plants in it not just lush grass. Nurtients from horse dung make the fields very lush which is why it is recommended that horse dung is picked up out of fields.

We often say that travellers dont have a clue about where they graze their horses but they often put them on wild meadows, that havent been grazed or fertilised for a long time. This is actually great for the horses (obviously ragwort free) as they are grazing on natural meadows that have wild flowers on them.

I tell you its a massive thing field maintanence and if people actually got into it a bit more they would have an idea that they are actually damaging their horses and causing problems to them by not giving them the correct grazing.

This is often down to YO's and how they manage their grazing etc. I could go on but as I am currently looking into different ways of grass management I will report more on this later.
 
Kaylum said:
I must write about this again sometime. But a field should have meadow plants in it not just lush grass. Nurtients from horse dung make the fields very lush which is why it is recommended that horse dung is picked up out of fields.

We often say that travellers dont have a clue about where they graze their horses but they often put them on wild meadows, that havent been grazed or fertilised for a long time. This is actually great for the horses (obviously ragwort free) as they are grazing on natural meadows that have wild flowers on them.

I tell you its a massive thing field maintanence and if people actually got into it a bit more they would have an idea that they are actually damaging their horses and causing problems to them by not giving them the correct grazing.

This is often down to YO's and how they manage their grazing etc. I could go on but as I am currently looking into different ways of grass management I will report more on this later.
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Thanks for the information :)

Firstly, i'd just like to say that Ronnie's field is poo picked and kept clean and incidentally, most of the grazing does have wild flowers in - it just so happens that his current patch doesn't.

I do however reject the opinion that my lack of knowledge beyond the basics of field maintenance/ the current lack of meadow flowers in Ronnie's field is doing him huge harm.

I take good care of my boy, and his grazing is just fine.
 
Ashleigh_ said:
Thanks for the information :)

Firstly, i'd just like to say that Ronnie's field is poo picked and kept clean and incidentally, most of the grazing does have wild flowers in - it just so happens that his current patch doesn't.

I do however reject the opinion that my lack of knowledge beyond the basics of field maintenance/ the current lack of meadow flowers in Ronnie's field is doing him huge harm.

I take good care of my boy, and his grazing is just fine.
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You have misunderstood what I am saying. Its a common problem. Its why a lot of horses are overweight and get lami. Its something all horse owners should look into but hardly any do. You wanted some advice and thats my advice. Look into how you are managing your grazing. BHS even teach a little of this in stage 1. As for his grazing is just fine you didnt even know about meadow plants and you say his grazing is really good. The field is your friend not your enemy. Not being nasty just saying a little time to get some knowledge about what your putting into your horse naturally can help with his weight.

BTW he is lovely.
 
Kaylum said:
You have misunderstood what I am saying. Its a common problem. Its why a lot of horses are overweight and get lami. Its something all horse owners should look into but hardly any do. You wanted some advice and thats my advice. Look into how you are managing your grazing. BHS even teach a little of this in stage 1. As for his grazing is just fine you didnt even know about meadow plants and you say his grazing is really good. The field is your friend not your enemy. Not being nasty just saying a little time to get some knowledge about what your putting into your horse naturally can help with his weight.

BTW he is lovely.
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Well as I said, thank you for the information. I will take heed and discuss it with my YO :)

If I am ever in the situation where I am able to pick and choose my own grazing then it is obviously something I will look into thoroughly. At the moment, with Ronnie being my first horse, it was a conscious decision to go onto a livery yard/or at least under the watch of someone with an experienced eye so areas of horse ownership such as this are not over looked, can be brought to my attention and learned... nobody is perfect. As previously mentioned, the other areas of turnout do actually have meadow flowers, but perhaps I was wrong in thinking that it is better for him to be off lush grass and onto an area with less? Oh and the reason that I described Ronnie's grazing as 'good' was that there is plenty of it and it drains well. My YO is always quite proud of the good grazing, they cut their own hay for the yard too.

I agree, it is something I should and will take a more active role to understand, I just thought it seemed a little brash in tone.
I apologise for taking your comment the wrong way, and also a thank you to everyone for your suggestions :) :)
 
He has the most gorgeous legs! I also have a fat cob, unfortunately he only gets ridden about an hour a week as hes a b***ger to get out on his own and we have no one to ride with. I bring mine in during the day in summer, its a pain really as I would like to have a bit of a rest from mucking out, and two visits very day.
 
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