Kennel Club pushing Gov for new laws - what is your view on this?

Ravenwood

Ravenwood

Well-Known Member
Joined
29 November 2005
Messages
11,196
Location
Devon
Visit site
Or something like that anyway, I have only just come across this and not had time to look into it yet .............

[ QUOTE ]
The Kennel club have requested the government to give them statutory powers to enforce all Pedigree dog breeders in uk to join their accredited breeders scheme.This will mean anyone breeding and/or selling dogs outside of the kennel club scheme will be unlawful (illegal) This cannot be allowed to happen as it will give the Kennel club a monopoly on dog registrations and also have control over everyone who breeds dogs in the uk to breed and sell only under their rules.An early day motion has been passed through government already.If the kc get these powers it is taking away the publics freedom of choice and rights.All this has come about because of the BBC documentary 'Pedigree Dogs Exposed'which was very damaging to the Kennel club and now they are trying to become the 'official'governing body of the Dog world.This will put many many good breeders out of business. Please sign this petition to stop them having statutory powers now!

[/ QUOTE ]

This quote (not my words) was taken from here.......

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/STOP-KC-POWERS/

What do you think?
 
Er, do the KC not have a monopoly on registrations in the UK anyway?
My two are IKC reg and I cannot show in Northern Ireland under KC rules.

Anything that curtails irresponsible breeding/breeding from defective animals/puppy farming is a winner for me.

It seems they can't do right for doing wrong. People saw that programme and said 'oh, how awful, there must be restrictions'.
Now people are complaining when they try to clamp down.
 
They may well have a monopoly on registrations, but from what I can gather it would be illegal for anyone to have a litter of puppies if the parents were not KC registered (as I say I haven't looked fully into this yet but this is the gist of it I think).

As you mention showing, I am worried that that is all the KC are concerned with and that winning show dogs should set the standard for the breed, whereas when it comes to working dogs, most show type dogs would not have the conformation to work as they were bred.

Also, I don't know how it would work when trying to save a dying breed, such as the Working Clumber Spaniel, which had to use outside influences to create a healthy strain and the fact that a KC pedigree is only 5 generations.
 
Illegal in what way, could you be fined, etc?

I didn't even think of the show/work aspect (I belong to a dual purpose breed club - bloody Germans!) so I suppose that would have implications for docking etc too.
I don't give a toot about showing BTW, was just what I came into my head regarding that particular monopoly.

Interesting points.

Are they doing this to 'save face' after this programme following the public outcry?

Should breed organisations take the lead in eliminating hereditary disorders and overbreeding?
 
So would that mean the likes of those breeding the Patterdale terrier, which is not a recognised breed essentially be doing it illegally?

I don't think it'll ever happen.

Dog showing is a farce though, look at the dogs in the gundog class. The ones that win could never do a days work!
 
[ QUOTE ]
Illegal in what way, could you be fined, etc?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well if its passed through Parliament there must be a penalty otherwise it wouldn't be enforceable, I am assuming from the following sentence from that site

[ QUOTE ]
This will mean anyone breeding and/or selling dogs outside of the kennel club scheme will be unlawful (illegal)

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Should breed organisations take the lead in eliminating hereditary disorders and overbreeding?


[/ QUOTE ]


I don't know the answer to that - its just a shame that every person who breeds a litter couldn't be responsible - but I guess we will never have that ideal world.
 
[ QUOTE ]
So would that mean the likes of those breeding the Patterdale terrier, which is not a recognised breed essentially be doing it illegally?



[/ QUOTE ]

I hadn't thought of that - but it does say breeders having a litter of pedigree dogs that are not registered with the kennel club would be illegal - so I guess their stance would be that if the Patterdale is not a recognised breed then it is not a pedigree in the eyes of the KC and therefore exempt? - who knows!
 
the Kc accredited breeder scheme is a joke anyway. I think what they mean is all breeders will have to member of the scheme regardless of what they are breeding or if kc reg?! they dont control the members of this scheme now, there r no checks that these 'accredited' breeders are good breeders, they just pay them a fee to be on the list. all a load of rubbish just to cover up what they are ( or more to the point arent) doing. imo that is of course.
 
just re read and it says all 'pedigree' dogs. so even more of a joke, obvious their intentions are not to help britains doggies as a whole, just to stop people selling pure bred dogs outside the kennel club scheme. thus making them more money. funny that.
 
I can't see that happening in the UK - but it would be horrific and highly tragic if this were to happen.
frown.gif


I have no time whatsoever for the Kennel Club; set of jumped up little twerps!
 
I have seen some of the dog press recently, and whilst there has been a lot about the KC amending breed standards on certain "at risk" breeds, (and this includes stupid things like removing referrence to due claws
confused.gif
) there hasn't been anything about breeders who are not accredited being illegal. I think this petition could be someone getting hold of the wrong end of the stick, but you never know with the KC. I think the accredited breeder thing as it stands is a farce.
I am inclined to agree with you Tia in your opinion of the KC. The GSD breed council tried to have a meeting with the KC to discuss some radical changes to the breeding of GSD (to include working tests etc) but the KC it appears aren't particularly interested, they jsut seem to be hell bent on the idea of changing standards. Imo its not the standards that are the problem its the judges who don't seem to know what they should be looking for in a breed.
frown.gif
 
BAD idea for any undemocratic body to have control over any aspect of dogs/breeding, especially one that promotes such horrific defects as highlighted on TV recently.
Yes there should be tighter laws regarding dogs/breeding/ownership/licensing etc but it should NOT be administered by the bloody kennel club
mad.gif
 

The GSD breed council tried to have a meeting with the KC to discuss some radical changes to the breeding of GSD (to include working tests etc) but the KC it appears aren't particularly interested, they jsut seem to be hell bent on the idea of changing standards.

I suppose if they can't tolerate any outside attraction (cue officer hiding behind a hedge at the last show I was at to try and catch people out) they're hardly going to tolerate manwork, tracking or agility as part of any grading scheme...
 
[ QUOTE ]
Er, do the KC not have a monopoly on registrations in the UK anyway?
My two are IKC reg and I cannot show in Northern Ireland under KC rules.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did you get you cannot show in NI because your two are IKC reg? You can show in NI and the UK with IKC reg dogs, all you need is an ATC from the KC.

There are also IKC governed shows held in NI, one of the first of the 2009 season is in March at King's Hall, Belfast (Newtownards All Breed).

Loads of people fron Eire show in NI and the UK.
 
All the KC want is to get more income for themselves from the Accredited Breeders Scheme which is a joke anyway. One of the founding scheme members is the St Bernard breeder who just had 99 St. Bernard's seaized by the RSPCA. For £15 it is a licence to be a KC recommended puppy farmer!
 


Where did you get you cannot show in NI because your two are IKC reg? You can show in NI and the UK with IKC reg dogs, all you need is an ATC from the KC.

Exactly, you still need to get the number before you can show. I know it' not that much, but they do have the 'monopoly' as it were.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Exactly, you still need to get the number before you can show. I know it' not that much, but they do have the 'monopoly' as it were.

[/ QUOTE ]

Look you do not even need an ATC anymore if you live in the Republic of Ireland but want to show in NI or UK mainland.

The Rules regarding obtaining an Authority to Compete (ATC) number do not apply to exhibitors or competitors from Southern Ireland or the Channel Islands.

Taken from the KC site today. I did konw they needed one a few years back as I had a dog here to handle for someone from Cork, when they changed it I do not know but now we are both the wiser¬
 
[ QUOTE ]
Oh! Righto, I'll shut up.


Can you tell I'm not desperate to jump in the ring again anytime soon?
smile.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

I do like the Irish shows though on the whole more than the UK ones. Better atmosphere, and with the FCI shows there at least you feel like you get a fair crack at the whip with a foreign judge that has no connection to the exhibitors under them. Give the European Winners show in Dublin this year a go, it will be good fun!
 
[ QUOTE ]
True - no little men hiding behind hedges waiting to catch people alerting their dogs!
smile.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

ooo.gif
You mean a leprechaun with liver bait???
grin.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
Dog showing is a farce though, look at the dogs in the gundog class. The ones that win could never do a days work!

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly what Maggie says about the Siberians!
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
True - no little men hiding behind hedges waiting to catch people alerting their dogs!
smile.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

ooo.gif
You mean a leprechaun with liver bait???
grin.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

Haha, more like grown men and women running from corner to corner at breakneck speed or popping up behind your deckchair unnanounced with squeaky toys, whistles etc
tongue.gif
 
If this went to plan then I can see the kc loosing more members than its worth, the kc on a whole is just a sham, even the chairman of the kc is none for interbreeding which shouldn't be allowed.
I've breed and showed rotties and GermanSpitz for god knows how long, Rotties are a full working breed when used right but you don't seem to see that any more in the ring.
As for judging well that's just a waste of time, if you get one with the judge and you know them well enough then what's the point in anyone else entering the ring as its a case of you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours and no one else has a look in.
I cant see how the kc can take over what people can breed or not, everyone has the right to breed dogs with out having to have the kc reg, so why would the kc want to change that.
In my opinion the kc need to look into how the kc itself is run first before it looks to take legal right of whether dog have to be kc reg'd when they say so.
Ive noticed over the year how much judging and standards have changed thanks to the kc not bothering to get off there butts and doing something that will help breeds to live for years and hold the correct standards, and show just how many breeds like most of the working breeds should be.
Thing that gets me is what about those owners out there that aren't breeders but own a kc reg'd dog will they be force in to being a member of the breed scheme??? so that the kc can control what they do with there dog/s
 
The more I think about it the more I just can't see how it will work. From what I can gather they are saying that you cannot breed a pedigree litter without registering them with KC, so I am assuming then that if you do have a litter of pups you cannot sell them as pedigree if they are not registered and would face prosecution for doing so.

So how will you word your ads for say a registered springer bitch who mated with a non registered springer dog -

"Springer pups for sale but Shssss - they are not KC registered therefore not pedigrees"?

Its just not enforceable and therefore a complete waste of time!
 
I have been asked to post this by the secretary of the Kennel Club.

We've been trying to knock this one on the head as it's a <u>complete misquote</u> - grateful if you could set the record straight if you contribute to this particular forum.

What we have said is that: We want a minimum set of standards (for example the principles of the Accredited Breeder Scheme) to be made compulsory so that ANY breeder (pedigree and non pedigree) wishing to produce or sell puppies will be required to comply. That doesn't mean that everyone has to be an AB but that if they want to breed a litter (even of cross breeds) they must do so to certain standards which everyone has to conform to - so we maintain a level playing field for everyone and don't make life 'easy' for puppy farmers.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top