Kieffer Saddles

Firewell

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I am having SUCH a saddle nightmare at the moment in the land of no saddle fitters.

I have sold my two Kieffers which fitted my horse pretty well. I'd had them two years and the high withered/big shouldered beast has always gone well in them.

They both started to need flocking as hadn't been flocked for two years. It costs $300 to do a reflock here. One was a Garmisch and the other an Ulla Rusty dressage saddle. The Garmish just wasn't forward enough to do higher jumps in. I have a long hip to thigh and I couldn't get my stirrups short enough without my knee going over the front. I never much noticed a problem over 80cm but once we got to 1m jump offs I felt like I was being chucked everywhere and my lower leg was flying back (it likes to fly back anyway naughty leg).
The dressage saddle was very deep seated and it always felt a bit too much saddle for me as I'm fairly slight. So instead of forking out for reflocks I decided to move them on (at a profit I might add yippeee) and get ones more comfy.

I made a disastrous decision with a Barnsby Shockemohle foam CC saddle. It's not right for my boy and doesn't sit nicely on his back, it rocks. After riding in the Kieffers I felt like I was sitting on a plate and my legs just want to swing around and stick forward.

I think I have decided to buy a new Kieffer jump saddle instead. I feel better the devil you know sort of thing and the panels and tree really suit my horse. They slot onto his back like a missing piece of jigsaw puzzle.

The only thing is my new trainer and lady who rides my horse now I'm pregnant hates them. She says the leather is not good quality and that they are so bulky and make it hard to feel the horse and ride properly. She wants me to get a made to measure equipe or something like that.

Now I'm all confused! I've been down the m2m Route before (twice) and both times the saddle stopped fitting my horse and I had to sell for a wacking great loss. Also what if my horse doesn't fit equipes??

The only fitters I can get to come out are reps for brands. Equipe rep, a bliss rep, a cwd rep, a stubben rep ect ect. They just want to sell you their brand.

My horse isn't easy to fit. I don't really want to get a saddle my trainer loathes but I do know my horse likes Kieffers. It's still a risk though as to get a jump Kieffer I have to import new from Europe. Or should I do what my trainer/rider says... after all I do respect her opinion?
 
Well theres a tricky one! You either respect her opinion... and go with her advice - what experience of saddles does she have? What is her knowledge of Kieffer based on? .... or you go with your own opinion, based on knowledge of yourself and horse. How long will she be riding the horse for? If 'forever' then thats also to be considered but if you're planning on having horse back you will be the one to ride in the saddle long term. I have had kieffer saddles in past and certainly there was NEVER an issue with quality
 
I also have a high withered and big shouldered gelding and i also have a Kieffer saddle. It fits him better than anything else, & it is so comfortable for me (I'm tall and long legged) The quality is excellent so i really don't know why your instructor says the leather is inferior and I don't find mine bulky at all and have absolutely no problem in feeling his movement (good and bad)!! You'll be the one who will be shelling out for the new saddle and ultimately it'll be for you and your horse..... so don't feel pressurised into buying what your instructor wants!
 
I love my kieffer and am hoping it may be adjustable enough to fit my new horse. However I would say they are mid range/price saddles. There are several very expensive high end brands out there that in many ways may be better quality but have a price to match. So I would first want to know what saddles she rates, they may be out of your price range.

And they may not suit your horse, I know someone that had spend a fortune on a mtm Devoucoux that never suited.

The other thing is bulkiness, is she comparing like with like. Is she comparing a monoflap with one that isn't and all makes have different models some of which are more bulky than others.
 
just commented on FB but J is similar wither wise to Fig.....Fig does fit equipes.

i dont think you would need M2M even, off the peg N(which is normal, so bog standard medium) fits like a glove. He has a sheepskin pad under if he drops weight and a thin gel when he gains, as long as the panel and gullet are basically the right shape, padding it is fine :)
 
Thanks for replies.
I think tbh, the Kieffers just aren't as popular here for jumping and she is used to riding in very CC saddles so it probably does feel strange.
To me they are comfy and I have found them pretty much indestructible so don't know where she got that idea on quality. She is only riding him while I'm pregnant then I'm riding him.
My trainer is sponsored by equipe ;), so she would recommend them BUT I have also heard brilliant things about them and PS you are the 3rd person who has said they suit J's shape. I also haven't tried one... I should probably try one before making a decision!
 
Thanks for replies.
I think tbh, the Kieffers just aren't as popular here for jumping and she is used to riding in very CC saddles so it probably does feel strange.
To me they are comfy and I have found them pretty much indestructible so don't know where she got that idea on quality. She is only riding him while I'm pregnant then I'm riding him.
My trainer is sponsored by equipe ;), so she would recommend them BUT I have also heard brilliant things about them and PS you are the 3rd person who has said they suit J's shape. I also haven't tried one... I should probably try one before making a decision!

I am going to agree in part with your instructor. I had a Garmisch for years - and hunted and evented in it up to Novice level. I am also very tall with long legs, and once I swapped it for a CC saddle I'm afraid that I could never go back. It's totally different to the flat seat/no blocks saddle I have grown accumstomed to. I had no issues with leather quality though.

I'm not sure whether you should be buying a saddle particularly to suit your instructor ;) and appreciate that you're in a tricky situation, but I'm not sure I'd go down the Kieffer route unless designs have dramtically changed recently and if you're still likely to want to be jumping bigger fences in the future.
 
http://www.kieffer.net/jumping/

It is a tricky situation...
Above is the jump selection of Kieffers right now, some of them are really nice I think.
I need to stick with the ones that have the gusset flock panels.
The equipe fitter is hopefully coming next week and she has some to try and some Amerigos. I'm still being pushed to get a m2m one but luckily I know enough that if the standard ones don't fit I am not getting a m2m... he's not that hard to fit!
 
Personally I couldn't give a stuff what my trainer thinks! You aren't pregnant for that long and it won't be that long before you're riding again and it's YOU that has got to enjoy the saddle not her....
 
I have 4 ottb's, all different sizes and shapes, and 2 standard, medium Equipe Synergy jump saddles - they are interchangeable and the horses go brilliantly in them. I sold the first one I had and regretted it so got another. Now I've ridden in them I don't want to sit in anything else. For me they are worth the hype... :)

I do have a couple of thicker pads for adjustment if needed, and the saddles are adjustable to an extent so you do have some leeway.

I used to like Kieffers, now they just feel like too much saddle for me.
 
What a nightmare for you!!

I think you simply cannot go ordering saddles off the peg or going with certain brands until you know *exactly* what tree shape your horse needs. The problem with Equipes, Bliss etc is that they're all basically the same tree shape within the brand so are simply not going to fit every horse well. However brands like Amerigo ,& I hear PDS as well- they have different models to suit different back shapes.
Amerigo was a total lifesaver for me because none of the conventional brands were fitting my horses shape & was giving her a sore back. Despite many saddles telling me that conventional brands would work- they didn't !!!
If you email Sara Morrison at pro saddles with pictures of your horse, then she can tell you exactly what Model of saddle your horse needs& what brands of saddles would suit. Obviously she know ps the Equipes as well as they are sold by Amerigo & she will tell you wether the equipes would fit your boy& work for him. Or she may say something like he needs a prestige or Albion in this style- whatever brand she thinks will fit. Or it may be that Amerigo is the only saddle maker that would do a saddle that fits his shape. ( as they do 12 different tree shapes for different horse shapes)In which case you could be very confident ordering from them online as their motto is not 'one type of saddle fits all' they really understand & appreciate the different horse shapes & conformation& sizes unlike other saddle companies. The saddles are adjustable in width as well. If you became a Amerigo rep in the states you would make a fortune! I'm not an Amerigo agent but I was so happy to finally find a comfty saddle for me & my horse after years of struggling!

http://amerigo-saddles.com/index.php/en/why-choose-an-amerigo-saddle
 
I have a Keiffer dressage and jump saddle. My jump saddle is an Excellence (quite old now!) would be a similar shape to the London. I've got mine on a high withered, big shouldered, 5yo very wobbly TB and I love how secure it is but considering how lazy and unresponsive he can be I never feel like I can't get my message through!
It is worth remembering that Keiffers can of course be adjusted to fit your horses template. The lady who does it lives local to me and is great to get advice from.
Don't know how easy it would be to buy a Keiffer here and have it adjusted to J's template before shipping? Just a thought :)

On the trainer note, I think it should be a saddle for you not for her. However, having had a break you might forget what it was like riding in your old saddle. Or on the other hand you find out you hate riding in it but have had it for several months and it's taken some wear and tear decreasing it's value?
 
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