Killing a horse is not murder!

[Fun Times]

Oh, I'm not referring to any particular poster or post, but merely adding my support to the notion that the context in which words are used has a big effect on their impact. So, 'murder' used in the context of pts an animal implies that the person responsible is a 'murderer' and therefore more or less as reprehensible as a person can be.

Exactly that Broodle. And I too haven't read the post in question (although I can guess which thread it is located in) so am in no means targetting anyone in particular. I was simply responding to CPT's original question.

 

[Spring Feather]

I know, I knew as soon as I pressed the go button that I shouldn't have. It is the only post that has made me really upset and angry, all the others were people's own justified opinions and I understood completely, they had every right to express their opinions but that one just basically called me stupid!

Don't worry; there's plenty of us here who have the brains to figure out who is stupid and who isn't

 

[doriangrey]

Don't worry; there's plenty of us here who have the brains to figure out who is stupid and who isn't

Wow ... just wow. Is that stupidity in general or just stupidity because they don't have the same opinion? Doormouse, you were in a seemingly impossible position which has very happily been resolved to everyone's advantage by some lovely people, I totally see your dilemma. I don't think it's fair to call people stupid because they care about life how ever insignificant it may seem. Yes, better to cull than an uncertain future but to call people stupid because they air an opinion?

 

[Doormouse]

Could I just ask please if you have a blood test taken to check for pregnancy when you purchase a horse. Do you honestly think I would have knowingly bought a pony that was in foal when I have not the finances nor the facilities to cope.

I suggest you read things properly before commenting in a disparaging fashion towards others, your comments come across as rude and ignorant. Had you bothered to read the thread you would perhaps be aware of my turmoil and distress which people like you add to. I fully took the comments from others on the thread about their horror and sympathised with it as that is what I felt but your comment simply implies that I am irresponsible and stupid.

Dorian - this is my response to a post I replied to and my answer to which Spring Feather referred. I specifically mentioned that I believed everyone who commented had a right to their opinion and I was happy to take all of it, however the post by Moya 999 was made out of ignorance because she hadn't bothered to read my post and implied that I was stupid enough to knowingly buy an in foal mare when I couldn't afford a foal.

 

[Doormouse]

Dorian - this is the post I replied to and my answer to which Spring Feather referred. I specifically mentioned that I believed everyone who commented had a right to their opinion and I was happy to take all of it, however the post by Moya 999 was made out of ignorance because she hadn't bothered to read my post and implied that I was stupid enough to knowingly buy an in foal mare when I couldn't afford a foal.

Personally, not reading the other post but - if I did not want a foal why would I buy one in foal?? unless it was not found in foal till after I brought it. Then again most get a vet to do a pre purchase check.

Why did the buyer not find another horse not in foal as she is hard up for cash but could afford to terminate a foal, surely the sensible thing would be to buy one not in foal without the added vet bill of a termination!

Sorry, got in a muddle with multi quote

 

[FionaM12]

When I bought my mare it certainly didn't occur to me to have her checked for pregnancy. In fact I've never actually thought of anyone doing so until now!

 

[doriangrey]

Dorian - this is the post I replied to and my answer to which Spring Feather referred. I specifically mentioned that I believed everyone who commented had a right to their opinion and I was happy to take all of it, however the post by Moya 999 was made out of ignorance because she hadn't bothered to read my post and implied that I was stupid enough to knowingly buy an in foal mare when I couldn't afford a foal.

Sorry Doormouse, I'm glad things are working out for you because as I said you were put in a very difficult position. I just hate it when threads turn into ugly, personal nit-picking because someone has a different view is all.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

Has anyone used the word anthropomorphize yet? Omg, did I spell it right?!

I think, hopefully, possibly, that I'd PTS my boy if I couldn't keep him. I'd be so scared if he were sold and was ragged around.

There's a thread in AAD about a foxhound that was found with hind paralysis and has been sent to Fitzpatrick's, cried all the way. Should have been PTS, IMO, it's not murder, it's a kindness, possibly the same for an unwanted or poorly bred foal. Still, I'm so, so glad that _GG_ has come to the rescue.

 

[Pinkvboots]

Of course it's crazy - of course horses, dogs, cats etc need to get pts all the time, this was originally a post having a dig at me because I used the wrong word to describe having a not yet born foal pts because it was a bogof and not wanted

Sorry I didn't realise it was a a thread to stir up trouble, I can appreciate in an angry and upset state people use words that they would not normally use, fwiw I can totally see where you are coming from not keen on bully tactics or cyber warriors!

 

[Spring Feather]

Wow ... just wow. Is that stupidity in general or just stupidity because they don't have the same opinion? Doormouse, you were in a seemingly impossible position which has very happily been resolved to everyone's advantage by some lovely people, I totally see your dilemma. I don't think it's fair to call people stupid because they care about life how ever insignificant it may seem. Yes, better to cull than an uncertain future but to call people stupid because they air an opinion?

It was nothing whatsoever to do with whether to kill a foal or not. No idea what on earth gave you that idea? If you re-read the above, it was the fact that Doormouse felt the response from another poster telling her basically that she was dim to have bought a mare in foal if she didn't want a mare in foal and why did she not have the mare preg checked prior to purchasing. So yes I will absolutely stand by my comments that most people (except for me and other breeders) would not have a mare preg checked when they are buying it as a riding pony for their child. So imo no, Doormouse was not stupid, as was implied by the other poster.

 

[Illusion100]

To me, murder is a willing intent and action to take the life from another. Us being humans of course, must have our own definitions so we can justify or appease our actions.

Execution is of course not murder because that human was deemed fit to die for their crime. Therefore those that intentionally took the life from that human are not murderers, just executioners doing their job. However, if it isn't their job then they are murderers and may be executed by executioners, which isn't murder.

Animals aren't as important though, they are just property after all so we can kill them with whatever frequency we wish. Of course we can do it humanely, say with an unsuspecting bullet to the head. Phew, glad we have different laws for humans or we might be headed for execution, which obviously will not be carried out by a murderer, but an executioner.

Maybe, murderers could just claim they were putting another human to sleep, or euthanise them via a humane method. No fault there then, call off the executioners.

Perhaps slaughter is a better term for animals, but not for humans of course, I recall Hitler got into trouble for that.

All right let's just call it 'put to sleep', that makes people swallow the whole ending an animal life thing much easier.

All of the above may be taken with a big pinch of salt.

 

[cptrayes]

sorry i didn't realise it was a a thread to stir up trouble,

it wasn't. Someone else's post might have been, but my thread wasn't.



I can understand why people use the word out of sheer emotion, but my own feeling is that it really should be reserved for taking the life of a human who knows what you are taking from them (the rest of their life) and not to any animal no matter how they are killed.

But then, literally doesn't mean literally any more even in the dictionary. It's now dictionary correct to say a man is literally as fat as a house. So what word we use when we mean 'in a completely literal sense' I don't know.

I don't think anyone used it deliberately to make anyone else feel bad, but I don't if they'd ever use it that way again if they were close to someone who had been murdered.

 

[ladyt25]

No read all the replies but, really what does it matter? Everyone feels differently about these things so, if they feel a word is appropriate to them as that's how they feel then so be it.
It doesn't mean they cannot look after animals or would not euthanase an animal in the appropriate circumstances.
Just because some people are more matter or fact about such things they can't expect others to not feel differently.
For what it's worth I do not feel the specific situation equates to murder but, if that had have been the outcome I would not have agreed with it.
As for the comment made about the dairy industry, not all destroy bull calves but yes it does happen and I think that's pretty horrible, more so for the cows.

 

[Dry Rot]

The idea that spoken English is fixed and the meaning of words can simply be looked up in the dictionary is a bit quaint to say the least! The dictionary is merely a guide. Books still have to be edited by human editors. They've tried machines and they generally make a nonsense of it! English is a living language and so long as the meaning is clear, the words are not that important. I have put several 16th century books into modern English. I also have a "modern" dictionary and a copy of Dr Johnson's dictionary published in 1755 and if they were the same I wouldn't need the more recent copy!

So, if a writer wants to use the word "murder" for killing an animal I would say they are perfectly correct in doing so as presumably they use the word to emphasise the emotional content which is exactly what it does! But in a couple of years time, it might mean something completely different!

 

[Maesfen]

whilst not a cheerful thought, the OP in the original post was IMO right to consider PTS an option as she could not guarantee the foal a quality of life for a long period of time.

with un known breeding and lack of facilities stacked against it, the little mite had a low chance of finding a long term loving home in a world where even well bred and pro produced youngsters are going for a pittance.

there are worse fates than a clean quick death and some people need to wake up and grow up.

Couldn't agree more. It's hard enough finding the right homes for animals that were planned for with very good breeding so I think they did it a huge favour myself.

What really annoys me are those that try to impose their own views on everyone else and if not agreed with get childishly vitriolic.