Knowing when to call it a day - do you just "know"...

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pnap

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Sorry if this seems a morbid post for the weekend.

Some of you may have seen my post that Jack has a fractured front leg, above the knee. At the moment he is bright and happy enough on his box rest, vet is happy with the way the "bad" leg is healing and progressing. But, he is not happy with the muscle wastage at the back end. Physio for the next 4-6 weeks has been arranged.

Ultimately - if I can't ever ride him again that's one thing, but in my mind they cannot be stable ornaments, so if he's never going to be sound enough to go out and enjoy the field or company of other horses again then I don't want to put him through months of rehab only for the same outcome. Vet says he cannot make that call at the moment (6 weeks in).

I'm happy to keep him going for as long as he seems to want to. Since I've never had to make that decision I just wanted to get others experiences. So do they "tell" you when they've had enough generally? Or am I being selfish?
 
I believer they do let you know yes - we all know our horses generally and it's very hard to explain but you can see it when they have truly had enough.

I think, although it may seem like a long slog at the moment that there's a very good chance your horse will make a good recovery. Bones tend to heal very well (in comparison to tendons/ligaments etc) and once healed are no weaker than they were beforehand.

I helped rehome a horse through word of mouth who fractured his cannon bone racing. He had a plate put in but the owner couldn't ind him a suitable home and was on the verge of having him PTS (I am not really sure why actually) anyway a friend of mine took him (for free), he actually went back to hurdling training although really it wasn't his thing. They sold him to someone as a general RC club doing jumping and all sorts. He is loving it!

I would assume with such an injury that muscle wastage is quite common and I am sure physio would help. Maybe further down the line some hydrotherapy would be useful.

As said though you will 'know' if he does get to the stage where he's had enough but form the sounds of it, he hasn't reached that yet. Hopefully it won't come to that either. Best of luck.
 
Thanks Lady T. It's very hard to try to explain everything on a forum like this and I don't think I explain myself very well a lot of the time.

I don't think he's ready to give up yet. He did collapse in his stable in the first two weeks and we had to dismantle half the stable wall and get the fire and rescue crowd out to sling him back onto his feet with the aid of a mobile mini-crane. Thankfully he made it through that and is not evidentally distressed in anyway at the moment. I guess I'm just paranoid that I'm keeping him going purely cause I don't have the guts to make the decision - but I don't think he's decided enough is enough yet.

This all sounds very pessimistic, like I'm just waiting for him to give up. It's not like that though, I'm just harking back to my old school teaching that horses with broken legs never make it. I know this isn't the case now with modern treatments etc but it's a almost easier for me to err on the side of worst case scenario.
 
I think its reasonable to call it a day with an unsound horse if it has a less than 50% chance of ever getting better, but that's just me and you have to draw the line where you think best. IMO, no, horses don't really ever say "I want PTS" but they do let us know when they're unhappy or uncomfortable, and if they are likely to struggle with the same problems for the rest of their lives, its up to us to do what's best for them.

You have to do what you think is right for yourself and your horse. I don't think anyone else is qualified to tell you what that is.
 
Well, so far we've had a donkey and pony we've had PTS - mainly due to old age really, the donkey (we think) must have had a stroke or two and after we'd gone through the odd day of havng to heave him back up after he'd fallen, and he was back to himself in a short while, one day he just didn't want to get up -w e got him up but all his fight had gone. He wasn't interested in food, he seemed confused and enough as enough.

Same with pony, also old but under vet supervision who advised as long as he was still happy and eating - he'd come running for food - that just to monitor him and see how he went. one day though he just gave up - he didn't want to eat any more. There's something in their eyes I think when they get to that stage.

Broken legs theses days do not mean the end but sure, some horses do not make good patients as cannot be kept on box rest for long periods so it's maybe the kindest thing to end the suffering and stress, Other horses however cope amazingly well and, once the bone is healed can return to normal work. All depends on the break and how it heals I guess.
 
Thing is the vet would've referred him onto dick vet hospital by now if he could travel. The mobile x-ray machine cannot get deep enough to determine how severe the fracture is - all it shows is a straight line break but we've no way of knowing how deep the break goes.

Someone has suggested upping his painkillers and making him move, I personally don't think he's ready for that yet and would like to give him a couple of weeks of physio to free up the back end before moving him more than he wants to. Similarly though he cannot stand in there for ever without making any effort to move more than a couple of steps - regardless of how happy he seems at keeping still and eating.
 
Look - this is a horrid story and i apologise now if it is upsetting.

Horse on my old yard in Durham was on box rest for 18 months, due to a leg issue - tbh i never knew what the inital cause was.

Owner was told to build her up slowly - this horse had only been on BOX rest - not even out of the box at anytime in the months prior.

Owner was so pleased to hear horse could soon go out...., she did not comprehend just how slowly slowly the build up to going out had to be.

Horse was bandaged up and she was put in the field - she galloped and broke both front legs in front of our eyes. She was shot within the hour.

Poor thing - she had endured the worst 18 months of her life only to loose it in the end anyway
 
Ok, well I am no expert in fractures by any degree but surely, if the break is straight does it make any difference how deep it is? Wouldn't the initial treatment be the same anyway?

I thought ordinarily they have to wait til the swelling has gone down anyway before they can really tell how bad the break is.

At the end of the day you can only do what you can do but if a clean, straight break that hasn't broken the skin then I would imagine it has a very good chance of healing well.
 
we had a horse who was on 3 months box rest and things didnt heal as hoped, vet then suggested 3 -6 months field rest. This horse didnt like being in the field and I had said to the vet at the outset if the recovery was going to involve field rest it wouldnt work with this lad. The vet assured me he would be fine, sadly 3 days into his field rest he suffered an accident in the field and had to be pts.
I wish i had gone with my initial gut feeling and not put him through the pain, surgery, box rest etc.
Sometimes you have to let your head rule your heart.
 
Sorry to hear about your horse.

My story: my mare was injured in the field, playing with another horse, they were cantering around, my mare stopped, other didnt and ran into her backend, grazing inside of hocks.

Next day horse was lame, IMO more lame than she should have been for injuries that were apparent. Scaned and xrayed, showed nothing. Box rested, brought back into work, but knew on first day she still wasnt right. Became progressively more lame, bute had no effect. Box rested for a further 2 weeks, but 10 days into it I knew she couldnt go on, she stayed lying down in her stable when I got to the yard (had never seen her lying down in the 2 yrs that I had had her). Went in the stable and she lay with her head in my lap, her eyes had changed, they had lost their "life". She sighed and seemed to beg me to help. (I am not a pink and fuffy owner!)
When she got up she was barely able to move, got vets out and they agreed to PTS without a diagnosis.
Had a PM done, she had an area of dead tissue deep in her hock, where the blood suppply had been cut off at some point. It wouldnt have shown on xray, or scan and wouldnt have been able to have been operated on.
I have got pics of her on her last day, but wouldnt post them, they are just too sad.
If the time comes I think you would know.
 
Dear JMB my heart goes out to you & Jack. I am no expert regarding fractures & breaks but I have read many an article both positive & negative. However the one that stands out in my memory was that of a stallion that broke his front leg, the prognosis was not good, however the owner felt it was not "his time" to go as the horse showed good survival spirit. The horse made a good recovery went off on hacks and even jumped small fences. Don't let your heart rule your head but let there be a combination....I think your lovely equine friend will let you know if it's time to call it a day....love & hugs to you both xxxxxx
 
I really sympathise for you and best wishes to you and Jack. However, it is very difficult to diagnose or give advice on a forum when you only have black and white text to guide you and you're not in front of the horse. If he's happy and healthy at present - and only you can judge this - I'd say give him a chance and see where HE takes you. Does your vet give you any reason why he's concerned about muscle wastage in the back end? Or what the long term prognosis may be?

I would say if he seems happy and healthy give him a chance but you know your horse at the end of the day. If he starts to look dull in the eye and he's not enjoying life anymore, that's when you need to make a decision regarding his long term welfare - and life. But, if he seems like he's coping ok then see how he goes - he will let you know when he's had enough. Good luck, this is a horrible situation to be in and my thoughts are with you both. x
 
I sadly lost a mare on wed night. She had had colic surgery in november and we had had a few hiccups over the last 10 weeks. But the mare always looked willing to fight and she was at the stage where she wanted to start going out again. Banging on the door when the others went out etc. We were so relieved that she seemed to had won the fight and we had made the right decision to operate.
Untill wed am when she had a bad day. She was down with mild colic as she had been a few times over the recovery period only this time she was diffrent. She was telling me she didnt want to fight any more. As another poster stated there eyes tell the story she had a distant look her sparkle had gone.
I gave her till 7 pm that night but she hd given up. It was time. I now wonder if it would have been best to let nature take its course in the first place. But then again i was so happy at the thought of her making a full recovery that it all seemed worth while towards the end.
If i hadn't have tried i would never have known my girl wasnt ment to survive i would always have wondered weather she could have lived on. You have to try.
 
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