Knuckling over

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Jinx94

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Morning all!

Firstly, I have spoken to a vet about this and her opinion/advice was to not worry unless it happens frequently or doesn't resolve quickly.

I *think* it's just caused by Zazu lying on her leg funny and possibly getting pins and needles.

On two separate occasions (last Friday and yesterday) Z has got off the sofa after a nap and pretty much fallen on her face. She's then proceeded to not seem to know where her foot is? When putting it down, she then doesn't swing her paw all the way through so the top of her toes hit the ground rather than her pads.

Each time she was back to normal after about 10-15mins. Both times this was late in the evening and she had been absolutely fine throughout the day. There were no differences in exercise/terrain/handling/anything. No swelling/heat/pain reactions, she seems a little confused but not particularly bothered - it freaks me out far more!

Having a horse PTS last year due to a medical issue that I initially thought was quite innocuous (assumed something stuck up her nose), I'm having a hard time not worrying about this. It's not something I think we could replicate for a vet to see. Will film if it happens again but am sceptical about whether even with that we'd have a plan of action/investigation other than 'keep an eye on it'.

Am I being really silly? Is this actually quite common and I've just never come across it? I can't be on hand to straighten her paws out 100% of the time if she's curled them underneath herself. Should I be worried about long term effects? Z's only 2, I was hoping not to have any health issues to worry about for a while yet!
 
I would definitely film it if it happens again. It might be worth asking your vet for a referral to a physiotherapist, they are good at picking up muscular issues. I had something similar with our older heeler, once or twice a month he would get up holding up his front leg and be totally unable to weight bear, after sometimes just a few minutes and on a couple of occasions several hours, he was totally back to normal. He sees a physio regularly as he has arthritis (he's nearly 14) and she felt it was a bit of nerve impingement. He now has monthly laser treatment on that leg and , touch wood, it hasn't happened since early December.
 
Hmmm. I don't like the sound of that at all.

My late whippet had a similar problem. I will post a video I took of the very first time it happened. Her episodes lasted just a couple of minutes in the early stages.


She was seven at the time. Between the insurance and myself, we spent over £9000 trying to get to the bottom of this.

Here is another video where it is more pronounced.


We couldn't get any answers to what was wrong with her and it was simply considered to be neurological. She deteriorated and was put down at just eight years old.

Hopefully your dog just needs a physio session, but knuckling can be a neurological concern.
 
Thanks all, I'm glad I'm not being crazy/paranoid by being concerned about this!

@skinnydipper, left fore both times. Just tried knuckling both fores and she immediately corrects them. On both occasions I had a good feel of her paw and she would flex it a little in response but not as much as normal.
 
I would say find a really good physio. and just give it a try, Our dog Spud, whilst he doesnt knuckle over and he does correct if we/vet does very quickly but he is strangely wonky. It all appears to be stemming from his back, so we assume some kind of impingment. Physio really helps, especially earlier on. He would be completely back to his normal self after a treatment. He's old now and we are keeping on top of it all with the physio and pain killers/vet checks etc.
I was a bit sceptical at first but he's been going on and off now for ages.
 
Jinx94 said:
Thanks all, I'm glad I'm not being crazy/paranoid by being concerned about this!
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No, you're not crazy to be concerned.

I don't have any experience of knuckling fore paws. With my dog it was hind, knuckling and trailing feet. Unfortunately he had degenerative myelopathy.

I hope you can find the cause and that it is something that can be treated.
 
It is something that would concern me but if the vet knows and isn't worried at this stage, I would find a good physio, as it sounds as if it happens towards the end of a busy day, when it could just be caused by muscle fatigue. I hope it either resolves spontaneously or can be easily sorted.
 
What is the breed of your dog please? If a dachshund, then there may a congenital issue going on as they do sadly suffer from all sorts of issues with "knuckling".

I would suggest you try and get some video footage of what is occurring and let your vet have a look. However unless you are insured up the hilt you will find that any kind of surgery to rectify this (if this is what your vet suggests) will be hugely expensive. I paid £300 for a referral appointment at Langford vet hospital. Surgery would have left me with not very much change from £10K; let me clarify and say that mine does not have the condition that you describe OP, so not trying to frighten you here.

Hoping you can resolve this, or at least find out what's going on.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
It is something that would concern me but if the vet knows and isn't worried at this stage, I would find a good physio, as it sounds as if it happens towards the end of a busy day, when it could just be caused by muscle fatigue. I hope it either resolves spontaneously or can be easily sorted.
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The vet's immediate reaction was, "ooh, that's weird" and she looked concerned, but at the time Z was bouncing off the walls post jab and sound as a pound 🤪 not really much to investigate in that moment!
MiJodsR2BlinkinTite said:
What is the breed of your dog please? If a dachshund, then there may a congenital issue going on as they do sadly suffer from all sorts of issues with "knuckling".

I would suggest you try and get some video footage of what is occurring and let your vet have a look. However unless you are insured up the hilt you will find that any kind of surgery to rectify this (if this is what your vet suggests) will be hugely expensive. I paid £300 for a referral appointment at Langford vet hospital. Surgery would have left me with not very much change from £10K; let me clarify and say that mine does not have the condition that you describe OP, so not trying to frighten you here.

Hoping you can resolve this, or at least find out what's going on.
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She's a German Shepherd, working lines and both parents are very healthy. Her breeder is extremely particular - if there is a genetic component, it's not cropped up anywhere else in the line.

I'd rather be over prepared! She's insured for up to £6.5k which I'm hoping would cover the majority of treatment, if required! And tbh I would find a way to fund the rest, as long as the decision was in her best interest.

We have a very good canine physio nearby, so firing them a message. Hoping it's just a nerve impingement as MurphysMinder mentioned.
 
If you have a look at my posts you will find some videos of Floyd. He didn't knuckle over but wasn't right and the vet wasn't interested. Hes had physio which helped but never sorted it and osteo which made a 75% improvement from the off, and a shed load of rehab, hill work, raised poles and he's just started swimming. He had a bulging disc in his neck and lower back. It seemed to cause him no pain but he moved very oddly! Hes so much better, but still not 100%. He lays down 22hours a day which doesn't help, but when he gets up and for a few strides he looks stiff legged and odd, then he's fine. 100% sound. It seems likely that when he's laying down for so long its impinging on a nerve and he has the equivalent of dead legs when he wakes up. The back issue seems to be resolved,its the neck still lingering. I did try and get him up and moving more but it made him miserable, so we are just carrying on rehab and monitoring very, very closely.
 
My terrier cross has never been right due to being a stray and terrible conformation. Recently he was limping and collapsing left fore. Nothing on xray and examination initially but then started literally screaming sometimes. He has x2 discs in his neck which are degenerated and one is impinging on his spinal cord. Ultrasound guided steroids and underwater treadmill hydrotherapy along with traditional physio have given me my happy lively dog back. He's off all his analgesia.
My vet was unsure initially what was wrong if anything. I'm so glad they persevered. Keep on at your vet.
 
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