Lady, One Week After The Move

I am 19, have non horsey parents and I bought a poor doer.
This is what she looked like at the end of winter..
BuffyAprilMay012-Copy.jpg

FAT!!! :D

While part of me thinks there is no excuse for a horse to get so thin, I also understand how hard it is to get non horsey parents to listen to you when your horse needs something!
I have read what you have to say Jade, and I hope you take the advice on board. You do have pics of that mare looking fab, hopefully this winter, armed with more knowledge from this thread you will be able to keep ontop of her weight.
Good luck, I look forward to updates of the mare looking better in a few weeks!
D :D
 
RuthnMeg said:
Oh, for christs sake! Some people are being unnecessarily harsh. Lady looks fine, and far from 'poor' in reality. So, we can see her ribs, she is short of muscles/lack of fitness and her coat hasn't come through properly in the first pic, but thats not nearing deaths door! .......
Jade, you are doing a fab job and Lady IS looking well.
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*head explodes* :eek:

If that horse looks 'fab', then I'm the queen of Sheba!
 
Im not getting into a slanging match here but want to post some useful advice. My daughters elderly pony with hardly any teeth was fed 4 times a day throughout the winter, he was also rugged even though he had a thick coat because when he got wet he never dried. I weight taped him once a week which is essential and took off and adjusted his rug every day.

last summer I took on 2 ponies from a rescue site for 6 weeks as they had barely any grass, had my vet out who did teeth and advised Panacur worming which was done. They were also fed 3 times a day as being elderly they had hardly any teeth so the fact we had grass was immaterial.I also put lightweight rugs on them when we had any prolonged period of rain as one had bouts of rainscald and I didnt want anything to drag them down. They were also weight taped once a week and a written record was get. They made steady gains and when they went back they looked a picture.

the point Im trying to make is a lot of time and effort is required to keep weight on and increase it. There are many food manufacturers out there who will do you a special menu for want of a better word who have a wealth of experience and anyone would be daft not to use it.

I look forward to seeing the progress on Jades horse in the future and Im sure Jade will take on board all our useful advice.
 
Unlike normal, I have NOT read through all the posts, just to page 3.

I would like to have up to date (on both counts) pictures of Carrot and Spud and Lady to compare condition.

I think Lady's confo doesn't help at all, and her age is quite possibly 'optimistic' as opposed to accurate.

If the Bransby place where C&S are is doing everything right and C&S look like Lady, then either Bransby need pulling up or Lady is doing fine under the circs.

I withold my judgement and can't believe there is no-one on here out of visiting distance to check the story out and stop the 'remote advice' until it is clear everything is in fact exactly as Jadey says it is.

I did exactly this with another poster who was called everything from TROLL to idiot and personally observed and weighed up the situation, which turned out to be actually BETTER than anticipated!

The horse itself was of very doubtful quality but to say that its every need had been meticulously catered for was an understatement and I couldn't fault the management.

So, until there is an actual, first-hand assessment of the horse, situation and owner, can we please leave the speculation out of it?

Also, we bought a horse the previous owner, who was brilliant, cautioned us we'd struggle to keep weight on her in winter. Errrr, no we don't! Quite the reverse, but that doesn't make the prev owner negligent.
 
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brighteyes said:
Also, we bought a horse the previous owner, who was brilliant, cautioned us we'd struggle to keep weight on her in winter. Errrr, no we don't! Quite the reverse, but that doesn't make the prev owner negligent.
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I beg to differ on this point. I think your statement proves she was negligent. Too many people are not prepared to provide te extra care and feeding that is needed for a horse (especially a poor doer) during the winter. There seems to be a (thankfully outdated) perception that horses can be EXPECTED to lose condition over winter and balloon during summer. Proper management of horses ensures that there are are no sudden changes in body condition. Sudden changes either way are worse than anything.
 
Wagtail said:
I beg to differ on this point. I think your statement proves she was negligent. Too many people are not prepared to provide te extra care and feeding that is needed for a horse (especially a poor doer) during the winter. There seems to be a (thankfully outdated) perception that horses can be EXPECTED to lose condition over winter and balloon during summer. Proper management of horses ensures that there are are no sudden changes in body condition. Sudden changes either way are worse than anything.
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Agreed. My first winter at a 'proper' livery yard saw my lad dropping a huge amount of weight. Having always had him on my own fields previously with copious grazing and of course being at home so able to feed as and when needed I'd never realised the impact that poor grazing and a hard winter would have on him. Needless to say the next winter I ensured he was getting 2 good feeds a day, adlib haylage and the correct rugs...didn't drop a kilo of weight..in fact think he put on due to less work!!! I had no one to blame for his weight loss in the first year except myself and hang my head in shame for allowing it to happen. No excuses we buy a horse we accept responsiblity for it's care...if that means 2 visits a day to ensure it's welfare so be it.

OP suck it up, take responsiblity you are not a child (as much as some people seem to think you are) and look after your horse correctly. If it's too far to walk and you can't drive buy a bike.
 
Sanolly said:
Ah but Fii this isn't the first time the mare has come out of winter looking this poor:
Beginning of last year: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=355730
Last summer, still looking poor and no grass in the field or any signs of hay/haylage: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=391138
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OMG! I cannot believe this horse was being ridden! I had an old pony of 30 who I had to feed 3 times a day, was in a deep bed with adlib hay, she was rugged etc. She looked well and she was not a good doer. If you have a horse you have to meet it's needs. Too many excuses are made for bad horsemanship, if you can't look after them, don't have them. Might seem harsh but only thinking of horse's welfare.
There is a wealth of information on forums like these. Hopefully advice will be taken.
 
amymay said:
If you have bothered to read the thread, rather than jumping on the general bandwagon, you will see that it's aim was to advise people that the horse has been moved to the OP's village - and so is located a mere walk away from here house.

The rest has been covered.;)
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I did all the posts but for some reason I still had to get it off my chest!

I've worked at rescue centre so I've seen it all, but we had RSPCA cases in that looked much better then that mare at the end of the winter.

It pulls the heart strings ESP since I've delt with it first hand on a number of horses.

My point was why put the horse so far away in the first place? Why wasn't she taking responsibly of her from the start. And not blaming everyone else for not looking after the horse
 
Would just like to point out that the horse's owner's age is irrelevant. I was 16 when I first got Dibbs, having loaned, shared and worked at the RS previously.

I took on advice from wherever I could get it and would have been deeply distressed had my horse looked like that at any point.

Anything else I would like to say has been done to death on this thread. Hopefully the OP takes the more useful advice on board, some really good suggestions. Would very much like to see an update in a month, as there can be such a difference in one month.
 
Wagtail said:
I beg to differ on this point. I think your statement proves she was negligent. Too many people are not prepared to provide te extra care and feeding that is needed for a horse (especially a poor doer) during the winter. There seems to be a (thankfully outdated) perception that horses can be EXPECTED to lose condition over winter and balloon during summer. Proper management of horses ensures that there are are no sudden changes in body condition. Sudden changes either way are worse than anything.
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In fact, it was because she is a worrier and didn't want to stay out with her friends nor be inside either, so no, not negligent. We just have the facilities which enable us to keep her from fence running. Not negligent in the least and she didn't mean hatrack. In fact she meant the weight we like to have her generally! I know all the facts, you don't. But see how easy it is to have an opinion (and quite a condemning one) if you don't know all the circumstances. Thank you.
 
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joeanne said:
Wagtail, what gets me is that Jade had a very kind offer from a very experienced forum member who is down the road. She offered to help Jade look at her overall management, and help her change what needed changing......and Jade refused her help!
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Oh damn! - I should have read all the previous posts as I usually do! :o
 
brighteyes said:
In fact, it was because she is a worrier and didn't want to stay out with her friends nor be inside either, so no, not negligent. We just have the facilities which enable us to keep her from fence running. Not negligent in the least and she didn't mean hatrack. In fact she meant the weight we like to have her generally! I know all the facts, you don't. But see how easy it is to have an opinion (and quite a condemning one) if you don't know all the circumstances. Thank you.
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I would argue that if a horse was fence running something has to be done about it, and if it isn't then that is still negligent. Facilities are irrelevant. You change them to suit the horses needs. I've had to do it plenty of times.

So, as you are obviously so much wiser than the rest of us, what circumstance could possibly excuse an owner from allowing her horse to get so poor over winter? Obviously it is not a medical condition or she wouldn't be able to gain condition at any time, even in summer. It can b seen quite clearly that she does regain her condition.
 
Just wondering,and it really is a wonder if a welfare officer,or someone in authority could work with and advise Jadey on basic horse care and management???
 
hunting mad said:
Just wondering,and it really is a wonder if a welfare officer,or someone in authority could work with and advise Jadey on basic horse care and management???
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Ha! I was thinking exactly the same thing while doing the vacuuming this afternoon!

There should be a BHS welfare officer local to Jade, I'm sure that they'd be willing to visit regularly and give advice, especially over the winter months when it seems that Jade struggles, that would be the best thing I think? I'm sure they'll be helpful rather than critical too but also be able to take action if needed, and step in before this mare would be likely to get in the same state.
 
Wagtail said:
I would argue that if a horse was fence running something has to be done about it, and if it isn't then that is still negligent. Facilities are irrelevant. You change them to suit the horses needs. I've had to do it plenty of times.

So, as you are obviously so much wiser than the rest of us, what circumstance could possibly excuse an owner from allowing her horse to get so poor over winter? Obviously it is not a medical condition or she wouldn't be able to gain condition at any time, even in summer. It can b seen quite clearly that she does regain her condition.
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Yes of course, how silly of me.
 
RuthnMeg said:
Oh, for christs sake! Some people are being unnecessarily harsh. Lady looks fine, and far from 'poor' in reality. So, we can see her ribs, she is short of muscles/lack of fitness and her coat hasn't come through properly in the first pic, but thats not nearing deaths door! Jade works hard at this mare, yet she is proud of her too and some of you are the sort of people who puts real dampeners on horse ownership.
My elderly mare, in comparisson to Lady, at one point looked very thin coming out of winter in mid march time. She had been fine all through the worst of the winter and suddenly dropped off like no tomorrow. Yet, when I posted a pic of her, I had comments of her being 'fat'! It doesn't add up, and Lady being the type of horse she is, is never going to be 'well covered'. Also, have to note, why are people questioning the first photo, when clearly the horse has improved? Should you not be applauding Jade on the right choices she has made for the horse in order to get her looking better?
Jade, you are doing a fab job and Lady IS looking well.
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Are you joking? I would hate to see a horse you think IS poor, Buzz is the same age as Lady and to compare the two you would say she is in her 30's and he is a youngster!! Jade is an unrealiable and irresponsiable horse owner and hopefully Lady will be removed from her care!
 
The photos on FB are indeed as concerning as those that have been posted on here in the last couple of years. :(

Jade, I think it would be a good idea to have Lady tested for cushings, given her coat and other symptoms.
 
TheEquineOak said:
*FACEPALM*

Feed it.

Feed it, Feed it, Feed it.

Alfa A oil, vegetable oil, veteran/buildup mix and ad lib HAYLAGE.

Over the winter our grass was covered in snow and then ice for 11 WEEKS. None of them looked as poor as this.

Weight tapes cost a couple of quid, buy one and use it EVERY week

I look forward to seeing some pics of her in the summer up to weight and looking healthy

PS. there are so many contradictions on this thread I have gone cross eyed :eek:
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Ours came out looking FATTER! We had to reduce their intake, the greedy devils! :D

There is no point in trying to reason with a person who obviously has no real clue of horse ownership....all she wants to hear, is everyone saying 'oooooo....aren't you super, working so hard for this poor horse....'...

It worries me, as others, to see so little grass, and not a scrap of hay in sight.....
 
Right, enough is enough.

I went up to the new yard with Jadine today and I can assure you that things are much better than they seem. Lady isn't at all "skin and bones" and if anything she's becoming a little porker. Jadine treated the cuts on Lady's leg with recommendations that she'd heard/been given on this forum by members I know. (The cuts are from frolicking with the other horses.)

The new yard is extremely good quality compared to the old one, the horses have good quality grass and also hay and for those of you who've asked, they get put into another field if the grass were to gets low in the current one. Lady ate her 2nd feed today and when I offered her hay she refused it, does that really sound like a starved horse?

Jadine cares a hell of a lot about this horse and I honestly think some people have gone too far with their assumptions because before you go down there and see for yourself what rights do you have? I'm sure if anyone wanted to see for themselves Jadine would be happy to show you.

I can't answer all of the accusations because it isn't my horse but I think everyone needs to calm down and be slightly more understanding. I myself work for and have worked for various Equine Chairties and welfare organisations so please don't tell me that I'm underreacting but I've seen cruelty and what I saw together was someone who was trying their best.
 
equestrianabbie said:
Right, enough is enough.

I went up to the new yard with Jadine today and I can assure you that things are much better than they seem. Lady isn't at all "skin and bones" and if anything she's becoming a little porker. Jadine treated the cuts on Lady's leg with recommendations that she'd heard/been given on this forum by members I know. (The cuts are from frolicking with the other horses.)

The new yard is extremely good quality compared to the old one, the horses have good quality grass and also hay and for those of you who've asked, they get put into another field if the grass were to gets low in the current one. Lady ate her 2nd feed today and when I offered her hay she refused it, does that really sound like a starved horse?

Jadine cares a hell of a lot about this horse and I honestly think some people have gone too far with their assumptions because before you go down there and see for yourself what rights do you have? I'm sure if anyone wanted to see for themselves Jadine would be happy to show you.

I can't answer all of the accusations because it isn't my horse but I think everyone needs to calm down and be slightly more understanding. I myself work for and have worked for various Equine Chairties and welfare organisations so please don't tell me that I'm underreacting but I've seen cruelty and what I saw together was someone who was trying their best.
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The fact that this is the second year running the horse looks the same is concerning.

Anyone making a statement of '..oh, but she loves the horse' is delusional.

Ignorance is NOT an excuse.
 
amymay said:
I agree EA she may not want any hay if she has plenty of grass. Onwards and upwards eh?
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Yes definitely, I do understand that people are concerned but Jadine isn't unfit to look after a horse. I also know the girl who owns the field Lady's in now and she's owned horses for years, so has her mother, so they're passing on their experience too.
 
I don't think any one is concerned for the horse right now. They are concerned about the coming winter after seeing pictures of the horse looking poor coming out of the previous two. She is obviously a poor doer and Jade intends to feed her ad-lib hay and 3 feeds a day. That is great. The problem as I see it is that the other liveries may not want/need to feed so much. If they don't, their horses will eat Lady's hay, therefore negating any of Jades well intentioned efforts. The problem I have not heard addressed is what Jade intends to do about this inevitable situation as I have asked twice and received no reply. Of course, Jade is perfectly within her rights to ignore people's questions, but it does worry me, and when people post up pictures of their horse looking so poor, they have to expect that some people may be concerned.
 
Wagtail said:
I don't think any one is concerned for the horse right now. They are concerned about the coming winter after seeing pictures of the horse looking poor coming out of the previous two. She is obviously a poor doer and Jade intends to feed her ad-lib hay and 3 feeds a day. That is great. The problem as I see it is that the other liveries may not want/need to feed so much. If they don't, their horses will eat Lady's hay, therefore negating any of Jades well intentioned efforts. The problem I have not heard addressed is what Jade intends to do about this inevitable situation as I have asked twice and received no reply. Of course, Jade is perfectly within her rights to ignore people's questions, but it does worry me, and when people post up pictures of their horse looking so poor, they have to expect that some people may be concerned.
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I was thinking about this today, i will have a word with my friends and ask if it will be possible to section Lady off as she is a poor doer and i want her to have ad lib hay. Im sure they wont have a problem with this, so i will ask next time i see them :)
 
JadeyyAndLadyy said:
I was thinking about this today, i will have a word with my friends and ask if it will be possible to section Lady off as she is a poor doer and i want her to have ad lib hay. Im sure they wont have a problem with this, so i will ask next time i see them :)
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That's great Jadine. It sounds that you finally have this thing in hand. :)
 
Wagtail said:
That's great Jadine. It sounds that you finally have this thing in hand. :)
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I hope you are right.
Seriously Jady,you have lots of offer of help from experienced horse owners please take it,and if you find out that you really can not look after the mare,for what ever reason,lack of money,time etc,please do the right thing by your mare,and dont let her suffer anymore
 
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