Lameness investigations - when to do it, what to expect

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
Hello! Looking for any kind advice, particularly from those who have relatable experiences. Mainly I am wondering at what point people generally think a vet visit is warranted for lameness/soreness, what to expect at a vet visit, and what other options there might be that might provide a bit more specialized feedback (perhaps a veterinary physiotherapist?).

I have a nearly 7 year old mixed breed dog medium sized dog who I have had since she was a couple months old. She is starting to slow down a bit, put on a little bit of extra weight (BCS is still only 5/9, she just used to always be a very lean 4), etc. over the last year or so but nothing very out of the ordinary. Weight gain was most likely due to switching foods - have since switched back and she is starting to lose a bit of weight and her energy has skyrocketed.

We haven't played with a flirt pole in a couple months because things have been quite muddy and evenings had been very dark. I brought it out a couple weeks ago and played with her for 10-15 minutes on our walk, making an effort to avoid jumps and tight circles/sharp turns. She was totally fine on the walk back, no signs of limping etc. After several hours at home when she got out of her bed she was super stiff and limping on one of her legs which has never happened before. There was nothing stuck in her paw pad, no cuts, etc. The limping would subside after she had walked several steps and returned again after laying down for longer periods of time, so figured she was just very sore. After several days of limited exercise she was back completely to normal. She has been on a couple of runs with my partner since then with no issues at all.

Today she had a really active play/wrestle session with another big dog for 15-20 minutes and this afternoon she is again very slightly limping on the same leg as last time.

In both scenarios there were no identifiable moments where she was noticeably in discomfort, yelped, tripped etc. during the play sessions (I always monitor closely) and I could find no external injury or irritation that should be causing the limping. I'll be reducing exercise again the next couple days until all is back to normal.

But, at what point for these types of things do you head to the vet? Surely dogs get sore just like people do when exercising after having been relatively sedentary for several months (especially when we get older). Where do you draw the line and say this might be something else? I'm always a bit of a hypochondriac with my dog and shelled out £300 last week for bloodwork for my own peace of mind over something else the vet was not very concerned about and that turned out to be nothing, so I'm hesitant to go full steam ahead investigating something that would again probably be nothing.

What would the vet even do? By the time the vet appointment tomorrow/Monday would roll around I doubt she would even be limping anymore. With the limping having only happened on two occasions and having gone away on its own I doubt a carprofen trial or similar would show much. I doubt this justifies x-rays at this point?

I had been planning on getting a vet physiotherapist appointment anyways to do a check over before we start up with agility again in the spring given her age. Is that the best path forward, followed by veterinary investigations if needed?

If it happens a third time in the coming weeks I'll certainly be making a vet appointment, but for now do I just wait and see what happens?
 

skinnydipper

Well-Known Member
Joined
11 February 2018
Messages
7,117
Visit site
If it happens a third time in the coming weeks I'll certainly be making a vet appointment, but for now do I just wait and see what happens?

No, don't wait, make appointment with vet.

Limp and stiffness both symptoms of pain.

What would the vet even do?

Examine your dog and prescribe anti inflammatories/pain relief if needed.
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
Thanks both @Amymay and @skinnydipper I will call. I think I just needed someone to tell me that I'm not jumping the gun at organizing a vet visit this time after having spent £300 at the vet last week for something that turned out to be absolutely nothing 😅

Re the examination - what should I be expecting? Is it similar to what you see with horses - trot ups, flexion tests, etc?

edited for typo
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
Anyone know how it tends to works with insurance? I'm fully insured, but I'm assuming that for things like x-rays the insurance would only cover it if the vet strongly recommends it, not if it's something I request on a hunch?
 

Clodagh

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 August 2005
Messages
26,654
Location
Devon
Visit site
Anyone know how it tends to works with insurance? I'm fully insured, but I'm assuming that for things like x-rays the insurance would only cover it if the vet strongly recommends it, not if it's something I request on a hunch?
Get your vet to say they recommend it. You can always check with your insurance company before you do them.
 

Clodagh

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 August 2005
Messages
26,654
Location
Devon
Visit site
Thanks both @Amymay and @skinnydipper I will call. I think I just needed someone to tell me that I'm not jumping the gun at organizing a vet visit this time after having spent £300 at the vet last week for something that turned out to be absolutely nothing 😅

Re the examination - what should I be expecting? Is it similar to what you see with horses - trot ups, flexion tests, etc?

edited for typo
Video her now, while she is lame. Mine are never lame at the vets as Adrenalin kicks in. Try for a clear video of her getting up and walking.
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
Thanks @Clodagh and @CorvusCorax I took videos last time it happened and took notes on how long it took her to get back to normal so I've got those as well luckily. Tried taking some video when I first noticed it today, but it's much more subtle this time and my partner is at work so no extra hands. I'll try setting up the phone somewhere and stick her on lead so I can get a better angle and video. Now that I've decided to bite the bullet and get an appointment I hope they can get me in over the next couple days 😅
 

AmyMay

Situation normal
Joined
1 July 2004
Messages
66,617
Location
South
Visit site
Anyone know how it tends to works with insurance? I'm fully insured, but I'm assuming that for things like x-rays the insurance would only cover it if the vet strongly recommends it, not if it's something I request on a hunch?

I phone the insurance company and give them a heads up that I may be making a claim- get the form and go from there. The vets will xray if they feel it’s warranted, and will therefore form part of any potential claim.
 

SilverLinings

Well-Known Member
Joined
12 August 2017
Messages
3,170
Visit site
I've never had trouble with the insurance company paying out when my dogs have had lameness x-rays; the vet said they needed them as the cause of the lameness wasn't obvious. I hope that it turns out to be easily fixed and that it isn't too very complicated to get to the bottom of and your dog is ok.
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
Oof, a bit of a hard hit today. Vet suspects arthritis and suggested we do full xrays of fronts and backs. Eye watering max-end estimate of nearly £900 for x-rays (potentially up to 20 exposures needed in total, though she said this would be absolute high end and it would likely be lower). She mentioned surgery if recommended would end up being 2-3k starting point for a single joint, with it potentially being much more expensive. If surgery isn't an option then librela would be the most likely course of action. She thinks if it is arthritis we likely caught it quite early which would mean she may actually be a better surgery candidate.

I'm am trying to read up a bit before the x-rays are done.

NOTE - Of course I will ask my vet all of these things as well, my brain just wasn't quite quick enough at the vet's office and it would be nice to get some input from others with arthritic dogs.

Librela: I've seen mixed reviews on the forum in past posts re librela, but consensus seems generally positive. If anyone has anything to add beyond what they have posted on previous threads please do!

Age: My dog is only 6.5 years - while I know some dogs get arthritis very young, it seems most tend to be diagnosed closer to 8 or 9. Can anyone provide insight into what progression has looked like for their own dog, in particular re reducing exercise? We were going to start up again with agility in the spring but I take it that is now off the table... will have to look into finding a nosework class nearby.

Surgery: Has anyone here done surgery for their arthritic dogs? Any thoughts?

Let's hope it's just arthritis and manageable with librela and not anything more ominous...
 

AmyMay

Situation normal
Joined
1 July 2004
Messages
66,617
Location
South
Visit site
Personally I’d start with Metacam and weight loss (and a very good joint supplement).

Surgery for arthritis? That’s a new one on me.

20 X-rays to diagnose (they’re taking the p!ss).

However I would have the leg xrayed to rule out anything more sinister.
 

Clodagh

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 August 2005
Messages
26,654
Location
Devon
Visit site
I was quoted £300 for head to toe x rays under GA. But that’s in rural Devon.
I wouldn’t operate for arthritis, but that’s just me. I’d go as AM says and keep him slim. Good food. Joint supp. Then see.
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
We are unfortunately central London, which I image impacts pricing considerably. 20 did seem like a lot of x-rays given the size of the dog so I'll see how many they feel is the minimum and have them request for permission if they feel they really need more once on the table. I've been considering doing a bit of a call around though I know in London especially many practices won't take on a new client just for x-rays.

It's very reassuring to hear that others say they would not go the surgery route.

Weight loss is already underway though she is just a bit above her ideal weight as is
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
I was quoted £300 for head to toe x rays under GA. But that’s in rural Devon.
I wouldn’t operate for arthritis, but that’s just me. I’d go as AM says and keep him slim. Good food. Joint supp. Then see.

mind if I ask what the cost breakdown was (GA, interpretation fee and per exposure cost specifically)? Maybe I'll rent a car and drive out of London for a long weekend 😅
 

gunnergundog

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 August 2010
Messages
3,390
Visit site
Not sure what breed you have but teach the stop whistle. Stop often works when recall fails and gives you the chance to catch up with the reprobate. In the eyes of the dog, it is still getting a small reward as it can still watch the prey away, which it can't do it if it turns and recalls to you.
 

AmyMay

Situation normal
Joined
1 July 2004
Messages
66,617
Location
South
Visit site
Not sure what breed you have but teach the stop whistle. Stop often works when recall fails and gives you the chance to catch up with the reprobate. In the eyes of the dog, it is still getting a small reward as it can still watch the prey away, which it can't do it if it turns and recalls to you.

Wrong thread 😉
 

irishdraft

Well-Known Member
Joined
13 November 2009
Messages
1,836
Visit site
One of my dogs has recently been diagnosed with an arthritic hip, he is 13.5 so a much older dog but vet just examined & put on metacam he's now much improved. So appreciate your dog is much younger but metacam & joint supplement would be my go to but my dogs are not insured.
 

CorvusCorax

'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Joined
15 January 2008
Messages
59,302
Location
End of the pier
Visit site
Ok so as well as having sport dogs I have a breed prone to HD and ED and those quotes are outrageous, even by London standards.
You do not need 20 scans.

My last set of 'MoT' x-rays (hips, elbows, spine, stifle) were £300 in 2019.
Just for guidance, it costs all in (vet plus official assessment in Germany) much, much less than £900 to diagnose or rule out HD/ED/spondy and OCD/arthritis via x-ray with the scheme run for my breed.
The equivalent system run by the BVA would be a fraction of the price.

I wouldn't bother with surgery, just keep the dog lean, light/low-impact exercise, medicate if necessary. If it comes to that.

PLEASE ask for the x-rays to be taken by someone experienced in submitting to health testing schemes such as the BVA, SV, OFA, Penn Hip.
And also ask for a digital copy or take a picture of the plates on the light box.
 

EchoInterrupted

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 March 2021
Messages
157
Visit site
UPDATE - X-rays were done this week, and while we are still waiting on feedback from a specialist, our vets have said that for now they actually see no signs of arthritis, hip dysplasia, or any other issues, which is quite honestly shocking. I'm very happy, but also quite surprised as I went into the x-ray appointment with the vet saying they suspected arthritis. I was convinced there would have to be signs of arthritis because of how much she has slowed down the last couple months, the recent limping this month, etc. that all line up with what you would expect to see from arthritis or similar. But x-rays are clean as a whistle except for possibly some very slight remodeling on the non-limping elbow.

So now I'm wondering if it really was all due to the diet change causing her to gain weight? Perhaps that in turn caused her to slow down, become less athletic/out of shape, resulting in a soft-tissue injury/pulling something when we did pick up more exercise again? We're on a period of limited exercise now just to make sure whatever was going on with the elbow has a chance to fully heal. After that I'm going to seek out a physio and start doing canine conditioning exercises before starting up again with more intense physical exercise. I am almost letting myself hope that maybe we can eventually return to agility over the summer after all? I had completely accepted that she would be effectively "retired" from anything more strenuous, but this may open several possibilities I thought has been closed off to us. Good news, though surprised and still feeling slightly cautious!
 

MurphysMinder

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 November 2006
Messages
18,141
Location
Shropshire
Visit site
If you ask your vet to refer you for physio the insurance should cover it. My younger heeler has regular physio after leg surgery when he was a pup and he has started his agility career successfully. My older heeler has maintenance physio sessions (not under insurance) and at nearly 12 he is still winning in agility, albeit veteran classes.
 
Top