laminitis....

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Bananarama

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Last Tuesday my shetland cross pony was very lame on his near fore. He had been on and off mildly lame for the past few weeks on various days but this was the worst he'd been. Vet came and was a little worried about laminitis but in the end he decided bruised sole (found haemorraging after pareing) and gave danilon. Now pony is lame on both fores, shifting weigh from side to side and when turning leans right back on his hind legs (like laminitus stance) but other than that does not do typical lami stance. He is eating fine and seems happy enough. Does it sound like laminitis? If it is what sort of prognosis and treatment is it?

I can't get the vet tonight as I live on an island and ferrys stop in the evenings. Vet will probaly be coming tomorrow.
 
YES!! It sounds like lami!

Frosted grass is highly stressed and a very common cause of lami.

Treat him as a laminitic anyways. Box rest, minimal soaked hay (add straw to keep him occupied) and a deep shavings bed or decent frog supports. No grass, hard feed or sugars of any kind (inc carrots and apples). Vet may give you more bute and possibly ACP (sedative which also immproves blood supply to the lamina) but there is no other treatment. Xrays (not as expensive as you think) later will tell you the extent of the damage.

Prognosis depends on how bad it it. Just immflamation of the lamina (actual 'laminitis') without any stretching or breaking of the lamina will heal well and grow out without much hassle. Rotation (lamina breaks at the toe and the pedal bone starts to point downwards) or foundered (lamina breaks all way round and the whole bone drops down) is much more serious and required many months of recovery. He will always be more prone to it in future.
 
It does sound like it could be laminitis - as a precaution I would bring the pony in and put on a deep shavings bed and only feed soaked hay until the vet has been.
 
I wouldn't rule out laminitis although he could be incredibly unlucky and have another bruise or abscess on the other/both feet
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Lami can be caused by the horse bearing more weight on the opposite sound leg and if your boy has been lame on and off for a while this may be the case. I hope the vet can get to you tomorrow. Can you stable him on a really deep shavings bed and maybe bandage both fores? Good luck and let me know the outcome
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I can't stable him as he only has rubber matting down and no where to get shavings on island. I am going away first thing to get some. I'm so unprepared
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He has been getting a handful of stable mix with his danilon. How else can I feed this without food?
Also is haylage ok? Thats what he has had tonight.
Also what do you mean bandage? With stable bandages of vetwrap?

Thanks for replies and fingers crossed
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Cut the mix right out - cereals are definitely not good for potential laminitics. Have you got access to any other type of food to put the Danilon in - HiFi Lite or Speedibeet would be good. Or have you tried feeding it straight from the hand - it is palatable enough that some horses will eat it that way. Or mix into a paste with water and syringe into his mouth.

I suppose he is better in on mats than out eating frozen grass, but really some sort of bedding that would pack into his feet to help support the internal structures would be good.

Soaked hay (soaked long enough to remove the sugars) would definitely be best - whether the haylage is safe depends on when it was cut and what grasses it has been made from. What sort of haylage is it? High Fibre or Timothy Horsehage would be OK.
 
It does sound to me like laminitis. Some ponys don't show the normal signs. When Lucy got lami she was just abit pottery to ride for about a week and i thought she was being lazy. Then i went to get her in from the field and she couldn't stand up it took about an hour to get her the 100 yards to her box she would move one foot then try to lie down. It turned out she had rotation in all four feed. I felt so awful i hadn't realised it was lami before but no one did. She pulled through against all the odds.
Haylidge is not the best thing to feed him. Is it hoof kind haylidge as that would not be so bad but hay soaked for several hours is the best thing to feed. When lucy had lami she was fed half a section of hay and straw that had been very well soaked. To be honest if your rubber mats are soft ones i would prob get him in and restrict his food if i suspected lami also he would not be eating the frosty grass. Do you have any chaff you could give him his medicen in that instead of the mix.
I hope my rambelings are of some help to you and i have everything crossed that your boy is ok.
 
It sounds like lami to me too. Interesting your pony got worse after the vet had prescribed danilon. Danilon of course is coated with sugars to make it more palatable but the last thing you want to give a laminitic horse is more sugar. There are brands of bute without fructans/sugars which your vet should be able to supply you instead of danilon.

When you say he pared the hoof do you mean he pared the sole and found haemorrhaging? This can be a classic sign of a laminitic event. Just as the laminiae will be damaged during an attack so will the solar corium, producing haemorrhaging in the solar plates.

As the OPs have advised - bring him in off grass, make him as comfy as possible, rubber mats are better than concrete but the sooner you can get some shavings or straw the better. Hay is better than haylage as it's lower in sugar but it's also important not to starve him as he needs his gut to be working efficiently to prevent more toxins being realeased into his system. Cut out the mix altogether. To give him his Danilon mix it into some low fat/no sugar yoghurt and syringe into into his mouth.
 
Yes another one to whom this sounds like Lamiitis! So sorry for you and the little fella.

Shavings (deep 4ins if possible) over all the box not just a bed.
Speedibeet if you can get it is a good way to give the danilon but the yogurt sounds like a good idea especially if you can get a live yogurt.
Soak the hay (sorry) if possible in this weather. Hay can actually be high in sugars depending on where when and how it's made and without testing soaking is the safest way. Constant supply of hay is needed as others have said. Use small holed nets or paddock pillows to slow him down if he eats loads.
A good balancer and loose salt will be all he needs imo on top of the hay. Some ponies/horses need magnesium oxide (if forage is deficient) supplementation too and it has been found to be beneficial in acute attacks.

Moving from foot to foot like you've described is called trenching ( I think!) and is a sign of laminitis or pain in both front feet.
 
My mare showed none of the typical signs of laminitis, the vets also thought it was a bruised foot or a abscess. Please don't get caught out like I did, treat it as though it's laminitis xx
 
it sounds like laminits to me and if he was in any pain at all say it was a bruised foot this can bring on an attack of laminitis. Padding the feet or bandaging would be good be a good idea especially untill you get some shavings if you get some dressing like gamgee or cotton gauze pack the feet well and then wrap it up with vet wrap it will give him some comfort
 
As xsara1 says, if you absolutely can't beg, borrow or steal a couple of bags of chavings, you need to support your pony's feet in some other way. Taping baby nappies would be better than nothing. Definitely needs to be treated as laminitis.
 
Yep sorry , I have a shettie in too with lamintis, although he is never on frosty grass
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many causes , could just be the hard ground.
But like others have said, off grass completley; mine will be in for at least 6 weeks.

Best of luck.
 
Has your pony got pulses as well? Dont mess around with lammi its to serious put any thing on to help support the hoofs deep- bed soaked hay no noy haylege. No mixes or grass you need them on feed with very low sugar starch fructans levels. Yes danilon is good but go with some acp or sedalin paste that will help with blood supple as well as hawthrone and nettle herb!x
 
How is he today? After reading some of the replies.........leave the ACP and co to the vet. Ive lived all of my life with horses and refuse to home medicate without the advice and go ahead from a qualified vet. Even when I have a horse in colic I will phone the vet to talk it over and have him tell me what I already intend to do via bute/Finadyne/Buscopan and co. Cuts and bruises I will treat myself when possible. Not getting at anyone in particular but seeing as vets have studied for years and have qualified in their chosen field I would rather pay them to cure my horse and then maybe sue them if they cock it up
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OK, spoke to vet this morning and has told me what to do. He isn't coming over as thinks I am capeble of sorting everything out at the moment but is sending more danilon. He is in a deep shavings bed with soaked hay (how long do I need to soak this for?) and I am to fit frog supports (vet told me how to do this). He is still very lame and I am pretty sure it is lami. We have put up signs on his stable and gate asking people not to feed him as alot of people give him carrots ect. Vet will probaly be coming in a few days if he is still bad.
Thanks for all the advice!
 
Soak the hay for as long as possible - minimum 1 hour.

With my pony this Summer I got into a routine of putting hay in the bin of fresh water when I took the first one out so it was soaked for 12 hours. It doesn't need to be this long but the longer it's in there the more you can give him.

Weigh him if possible and calculate 1.5% of his body weight then weigh the hay you give him. 1.5% is a daily maintenance ration for unsoaked hay so you can give him more than that if it's soaked. It depends whether he needs to diet or not. Keep an eye on his weight and increase the soaked hay if you need to.

I hope your pipes aren't frozen like ours are and you have somewhere warmish to soak your hay.

Good luck. It's hard work.
 
I always think its worse not knowing whats wrong with them than knowing.At least now you know what you're up against and can 'do something' to make him better
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Wonder why the shitty things happen in the winter when its dark, cold and generally bloody awful to work in
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Im really curious to know which island you live on! I lived and worked on the Isle of Bute many many years ago and am still in love with the place. Best wishes.
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Aka Aran
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Nope not Arran! You can practically see Arran from my window however! It is just across from Largs.

Here is Raff today for any one interested. (Excuse stable 'door' as shelter did not have one so we did what we could.)

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Oooooooo the wee man! He does look sore
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. Im sure he will be fine and will be back being himself soon. Sorry if my geography is crap.My Dad would be ashamed of me-he kept his wee boat at Largs and was always sailing up round and all over the place. I suffer from sea sickness on wee boats so never went with him. I can remember going back to Bute on the mail boat after a night out on the mainland and boy was I sick-not always the booze and Indian may I add
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Glad your getting the little man sorted i have been wondering how he is all day. (He looks so cute by the way). As has been said above soak the hay for as long as poss. Have you got any straw you could feed him as well to make it last longer? When Lucy had lami she was only aloud about half a section of hay twice a day so i also fed her straw to keep her ocupied. I am sending him lots of get well soon ((((((((vibes)))))))) from Lucy and I.
 
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What excellent stable door improvisation!

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Ha well it's not too bad is it!
Thanks so much for all the advice and support everyone, it really has helped.

How long should it take till he is sound? Does it vary alot from horse to horse? Are we talking sound in a week of lame for months? Thanks x
 
It varys from horse to horse and depends on the severaty. When Lucy had lami a friends horse got it at the same time Lucys was much worse than the other horse (She had rotation in all four feet). The vets thought i was going to have to have Lucy put down. But after a few weeks box rest She was able to start walk exercise and she was back in full work after a few months. My friend was very upset by this as her horse was still on walk only exercise and her horse didn't have it as bad as Lucy. (My pony is one tough cookie though so i think she is the exception not the rule!)
 
He looks really sweet in his stable
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Well my shettie is in the same boat! he will be kept in for two weeks ( not even getting him out to muck out) I will walk him out; If he is sound on the hard ground ( no stiffness) he will be kept in for another 30 days.
I will then start letting him out for half an hour, then gradually buid it up.
Eventually he will be out again at night and in during the day.

Best of luck!
 
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