Land - dream opportunity of potential nightmare

Wagtail said:
I wouldn't take it. I couldn't have my horses anywhere where there is no security. You are looking at paying getting on for £100k for a place where you have no arena, water or electric. No toilet or any sort of human accommodation and no chance of planning permission. You could get all of that by paying livery at a nice yard and have more money left at the end of it.

You also need to factor in cost of fuel for two visits a day.
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But 10yrs down the line that land will have increased in value and could be sold to help finance a house with land attached :)
 
I personally think that if you have the money to buy land, you'll never lose. Land in the right place is always at a premium and tbh the price you've been quoted sounds very reasonable to me, certainly for the area I used to live in when we were in the UK. A 5 acre grazing paddock with no buildings or services at all, went up for sale in my old village (Hants/Berks border) about 14 years ago and sold for £88,000. I suspect the cost to buy that same paddock today would be way in excess of that now.

I'd go for it if I were you, however I would be seriously considering trying to find a house much closer to the field. The water issue isn't really the end of the world as you can collect rain water or take containers up as and when needed. I'd invest in a small generator to run lights in the stables and for any electrical gadgets you may need there. If there's a flatish area in the field you could easily fence in a small grass riding area to do any schooling/jumping. I would contact a drainage company to give you a rough run down on what might need doing and the costings for that work.

Whatever you decide, best of luck to you.
 
I think it would not be a brilliant proposition tbh. Anywhere so far from home, with no human facillites would worry me. If you have a horse that is ill, not being able to get warm, or go to the loo, or make a hot drink will be a problem. When we were on livery we could use the outside loo and a kettle in the stables.Now they are at home, we can pop in and out of the house.. If you have no means of heating water, difficult for vet visits. The other thing that would worry me is the access, we none of us want to think about the possibility of needing the knacker man, but you don't want to have to worry about them not being able to get there if you need them. When we had three weeks of snow stopping any vehicle getting into our yard, last year, my main fear was our elderly girl going downhill during that time.
 
Car to sit in to keep warm or kit out tack room with comfy chair and small heater (I would worry about fire risk with a heater), flask for hot water or if have generator then kettle or camping gas stove and kettle (touch wood in the ten years I have had my own place I have never needed a kettle and have only occasionally needed a flask). You could put a porta loo somewhere but most people I know just use the great outdoors or a stable, wet wipes are always handy. I do have tap as have mains water but again you could rig one up to a water tank.

The deal breaker for me would be if the access wasn't good or couldn't be made good and also if yard flooded and that issue couldn't be resolved. Make sure you have wide enough access for hay delivery (we have Haylage rounds put straight into open field shelter on pallets, 12x24 field shelter cost less than 1k)
 
The access is the big problem in my mind .
How is that track going to look in february ,how will you manage in snow these are the things you need to think about .
Is there enough room to store enough fodder to last through bad weather if you can't get it in .
The price is the going rate and as long as all the permissions for equine use are in place it won't lose value ( well it might but then some sort of appalling disaster will have overtaken us and we all will have bigger things to worry about than land values).
Security is a consideration but then non of us are with our horses and stuff all the time it just seems worse when they are distant .
I think I would on balance go for it the good hacking being the deal maker .
My fields are clay you can manage it once you get the hang of working with your land .I would be thinking in terms of a sacrifice pasture linked to a hard standing for winter and dividing the land up so you manage it easily .
Nothing beats owning your own land but it's harder work and costs more to do than you think it will when you set out .
 
I would really want to speak to the previous renters to get an idea of how bad the land gets in winter and also find out in advance whether you are likely to get permission to put in hard standing areas. Slopping around in deep mud during a wet winter will make time with your horses an absolute misery - you only have to read some of the posts on here to see how horrendous some people found coping with very wet land during last winter. Like other posters I would also be concerned about vehicle access when it is wet too.

Is the land overlooked by any houses at all, like that of the neighbour who is trying to put you off buying it? If so, it may make it harder to get planning permission for improvements if they object. Also bear in mind that if you do decide to buy it, by the time the transaction has been completed and you have got planning for the hard standing, the weather may have turned and be too late to get it in for this coming winter.

How long have you been looking for land? If for not very long, then it is possible that something more suitable may come up.
 
FrankieCob said:
But 10yrs down the line that land will have increased in value and could be sold to help finance a house with land attached :)
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I'm not sure that is strictly true, paddocks sell at a premium, but investing in poorly draining clay land is not necessarily going to increase. You also have to consider the affect that APR is having on land prices, if it were relaxed for any reason in the near future, land prices would fall through the floor and give OP many more desirable options to purchase.
 
I'm not sure I would be keen on clay/drainage issues, no water supply, limited access and being a reasonable distance away.

The price doesn't shock me, I'd struggle to purchase small acreage for that where I live - last land I saw round here was 20 k an acre, no fencing/leccy/water
 
I'd have a search through the local planning for the planning for the existing stables. Might contain some interesting insight that can help you make your decision.
I'd also search the local planning for mobile homes at equestrian or agricultural establishments to see if there's a precedent for that.
Remember you can always sell it in the future and it's unlikely to be worth less.
 
As an investment could be a good - land is finite (this thinking is why my dad has parcels of land dotted all around and miles away from his house - great when he had sheep - now just taking hay off it all). Lack of electric and water can be overcome, I think security of animals would be my concern.
 
Thanks again for all the input. I've just found out they've had an offer for 80k this morning. I'm going to not to panic into anything, spend some time looking at my finances and expenses (I wouldn't plan to put my horse on it this winter anyway), and if it's sold in the mean time I'll treat it as fate. I am in love with it though, such a gorgeous little spot.
 
I'd check it had PP for equine use.If it is classed as agricultural grazing,in theory,you are not allowed to ride your horse on your own land.My winter field is clay and gets churned up to a mudbath without fail every winter,and it has land drains.
 
I've just checked the planning history for the place and it looks like the current stables have never had planning permission granted, which is a shame.
 
KatPT said:
I've just checked the planning history for the place and it looks like the current stables have never had planning permission granted, which is a shame.
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Find out how long there have been stables there after a certain number of years there's nothing the planners can do .
Ps,memory tells me it is 15 .
 
The price is right and do not take too much notice off the neighbours as they may have an interest in dissing the quality of the land. BUT your money would be better put towards a house with land already built. If you ever did get planning the costs are incredible and there are spots avaliable for less money if you saw what you wanted elsewhere you could loss it while you waited to sell the land you had bought.
 
What is APR?

I bought a 3 acre field with a good amount of hard standing and 4 wooden stables 4 years ago for £30k. It has water, no electricity. I have a small caravan on there for somewhere warm and dry, with a gas to make drinks. I have arenas to hire a few minutes away and good hacking. We grow lots of veg and fruit on it too.

I am also on clay, and part from the first winter when I moved on in December after the previous owners trashed it it's been fine. I have 2 on there both 15.2. I section off a quarter when it starts getting wet and they can trash that. They live out with access to the stables and they have a big shelter with ad lib haylage on the hard standing so spend most of their time on there out the mud. Most of the poo goes on there too. Then spring and my trashed field gets intensive repairs and rests for the rest of the year.

I would not go back to a livery yard. I like doing things my own way too much. I have lots of horsey neighbours and a couple of sharers so don't get lonely.

A 2 acre field next to mine with one stable and a tack room sold instantly for £55k last year. I'm hoping my field will be a decent investment in years to come!!
 
Go for it! As you say, worst comes to the worst - you can sell it on - land is always in demand. If we could afford it I would jump at the chance to have my own land. It does sound as though you have nothing to lose, esp if you can afford to keep your horses where they are for a while at least - then you can get the land sorted/prepared in advance. I'm sure it wont be all plain-sailing but its got to be worth a try
 
I would do a lot more research and as you say, if it sells in the meantime, treat it as fate.
Get a drainage contractor in for a quote and advice.
Talk to field neighbours - if they've had a quote for getting water in there would they be prepared to share costs of getting a supply to both fields, if this is possible?
I wouldn't be so worried about electricity as solar etc these days is excellent and you could have a small generator if you could build somewhere secure to keep it. You could also have a little gas stove in a tackroom if you needed to boil a kettle etc
Toilet isn't that big an issue, but there are some good composting toilets out there now if you wanted one.
Talk to your planning officers about what could go there - You've not mention expressly wanting one, but could you get an arena there and use that for turnout as well as riding? Are the stables that are there now sufficient or would you need to rebuild them? Is that possible?
If arena is possible planning wise, I'd price this up it may not be a huge amount more than a turnout area as would think drainage is the big thing and that would need to go in anyway?
Maybe keep an eye on it over the next few weeks if this rain continues and see how it holds up?
 
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