Language used around horses.

Smogul said:
I agree but I also think if you take it too far, you deny that an animal has a personality. Like people, they can be having an off day and behave like a total shit or have a good day and behave beautifully, however you want to describe it.
OH had a horse I always described as polite. He was a naturally big striding horse. I have health problems and he would always adapt his walk to my pace. He was an expert at escaping from his stable as soon as the door was opened but YM said he had never once knocked over a member of staff while doing it, unlike most regular escape artists. He seemed to regard it as an amusing game.

A horse at the riding school we went to would often grab the hose as she was being washed and turn it on the person hosing her. Again, the only motive for this seemed to be for her amusement. Not being naughty, just having fun.
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Oh they do have a sense of humour alright, and some of them are quite clever with it. I knew a little Welsh who delighted in stealing hats off of people and then holding them in his teeth just out of reach. Like, if you reached out, he’d step back a couple of paces. Go from the side and he’d go forward. He’d never run away, it amused him to be close but not close enough.

And my little ancient pony will still have a drink and walk over to you with his mouth full of water before shoving his head against you and dropping the water on you.

There is no benefit to either behaviour I can see, aside from being a nuisance and having fun!
 
i largely agree, but i think it depends on the circumstances. for example, diva digging her bed up and picking up her water bucket to empty and throw around the stable is royally taking the p*ss to me, but to her she’s having a thrilling time🤣
 
Speak kindly to your little pony and soothe him when he wheezes or he may turn his back and you kick you were he pleases.

Hate horses being called it and don’t like sassy.

Mine may occasionally get called a donut 😁 but in an affectionate way.
 
LadyGascoyne said:
I said less competent. I obviously wouldn’t hire and let anyone incompetent handle my horses.

I promise you Mim is not fearing for her life.
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May not apply here but I think horses often comply for different reasons than we think they are complying. We think 'horse is dropping her head for the flymask (or bridle)' when in fact a horse may just be following a feel you don't even know you are offering her, because experienced handlers just do.

The most obvious example of this to me is the standing at the mounting block. I've seen both Mark R and Joe do this at clinics with horses who 'take the mick' by swinging their arses out to 'prevent the rider mounting'. But that is just not what is happening. They are not standing because they have not been taught to stand. And then they do stand because they HAVE been taught to stand. They weren't preventing mounting before and aren't facilitating mounting now. They are just standing. As instructed. And from there, mounting happens.
 
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humblepie said:
Speak kindly to your little pony and soothe him when he wheezes or he may turn his back and you kick you were he pleases.

Hate horses being called it and don’t like sassy.

Mine may occasionally get called a donut 😁 but in an affectionate way.
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Ooh, I don’t mind sassy as a description. Sometimes they simply are sassy. I don’t mean it in a derogatory way, but you sometimes have days when you can tell as soon as you see them that they have ‘something about them’. Be that being cheeky, bouncy, contrary whatever. You just have to adapt your plans and approach to work with the horse you have in front of you.
 
little_critter said:
Ooh, I don’t mind sassy as a description. Sometimes they simply are sassy. I don’t mean it in a derogatory way, but you sometimes have days when you can tell as soon as you see them that they have ‘something about them’. Be that being cheeky, bouncy, contrary whatever. You just have to adapt your plans and approach to work with the horse you have in front of you.
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Maybe spirited or presence are better words! Feel like a new thread for vocabulary changes!
Bolshy = fearful or not understanding
Green= naive
Sassy= confident
Take the mick= Takes the initiative!
 
Not quite what you meant in the first post @pistolpete but couple of days ago I went to pick a friend up at her yard & was waiting for her to finish her horse. Wandered over to the school to watch the lesson that was going on. One of the riders said something I didn't catch; instructor replied " no just ride through it , it was doing the same the other day, it's not lame just un-sound."
🤔
 
little_critter said:
Ooh, I don’t mind sassy as a description. Sometimes they simply are sassy. I don’t mean it in a derogatory way, but you sometimes have days when you can tell as soon as you see them that they have ‘something about them’. Be that being cheeky, bouncy, contrary whatever. You just have to adapt your plans and approach to work with the horse you have in front of you.
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I also don’t mind sassy. Tali wanted to eat grass when I’d taken her a walk. She stopped and started pawing the ground because I wouldn’t let her. She took a few steps forward and did it again. Between giggles she got called sassy and a silly goose.
I don’t use sassy derogatorily. I am usually pretty proud of my sassy behaviour 😂
 
I think there is verbal language and there is also intent and resulting body language. I frequently tell my dog he is a ‘bad dog’ or ‘fatty’ (he’s a whippet), but delivered in an affectionate tone. I could yell all I wanted to no result if he was galumphing about in the garden at night and not wanting to come in, but a short exasperated sigh from me and he would arrive in about three seconds.
 
I don't mind the term 'it' in general from people who don't own or ride the horse regularly, as I don't believe people are using the word to be derogatory.
But yes I'm not a fan of the *hitevernters unite type terminology.
We need to watch our words, both in how we describe our horses and ourselves. I've been working on this for 10 years and will continue to work on it.
I've written up every ride I've had on Amber, and I'm very careful to use positive comments every time. It still doesn't come naturally, but I'm definitely better for it.

I will say in my early 20s, I had a fairly combatitive time with a new horse. I knew what I was getting, and I stuck with it; I'll use the word feisty; she really didn't have time for poor riding.
I had a jacket with Chloe vs. Ali sewn on the back, and people did not like it, but it helped keep me in the game, and I loved her dearly. I kept her to the end, and we did all sorts of things together.
Would I approach that situation differently now? Yes, I would because everything about training and horse care has moved on, but I did the best I could at the time.
She still saw a vet, physios, chiros, dentists, etc we had regular lessons with good trainers.

So someone using a word I wouldn't doesn't bother me, how they act is what influences me.

Apparently, the word hate is now a terrible thing, and hate is now worse than despise; that's a change to how I understood the terms growing up, but I'm happy to adapt to it.
 
In general I am not a fan of policing language - it's intent that matters to me. But language shapes thinking so am careful in any kind of environment where my words might infuence others, to not use words that can have loaded meanings.

Lucinda Green's phrase: 'feet on the dashboard and teeth all over the field' to refer to the firm 'make stopping happen aid' after 2 ignored aids makes me utterly cringe. She says in the video 'I know you all know what I mean' but it is still violent/harsh imagery which changes how people feel as they apply the aid.

I also hate 'ride it like you hate it' for the same reason, but have nothing against 'ride it like you stole it'. Though I prefer Mark Rashid's 'Ride like the cows are getting out!'.

All 3 phrases are meant to signal riding with increased urgeny and intent which is fab. A real 'focus on the feeling you give' instruction. But without the adversarial element. An RI told Katie on Dolly to 'ride her like you hate her' and Katie just said 'Noooo I can't do that' and had no idea what she even meant, because the word hate just got in the way of what the instructror was trying to impart.

But people can call their horse names affectionately. Dolly was frequently a sh1tbag because she literally loved lying and rolling and smearing her face in sh1t. And Oscar was a 'Little Toad' for lots of intellgient opportunism moments that left my daughter eating dirt.

I don't get 'it' for your own horse. I simply cannot imagine referring to any horse of mine as 'it' apart from ironically.
 
Oh, I like ‘Ride like the cows are getting out’, I can envision that, and it would certainly make me ride with more purpose!

I was told to ‘Ride him like you stole him’ by the proprietor when the pic in my HHO avatar was taken, instead of proceeding at my usual very steady old ladies’ canter. I’d have revved him up another gear again if the cows were after me 🤣.

I do refer to a horse as an ‘it’ if I’m not sure of its gender, but always as a him/her if I know.
 
I call Dex 'kn0bhead' all the time and often in greeting, but in a very affectionate manner/tone. I also call a lot of my friends the same thing as do they, I; it's become a term of endearment in our group for sure. It may upset some people who hear it, but I don't care and neither does he, he knows he's loved.

He would be far more upset by inconsistent handling or me being high stress/anxiety when I am with him or not rewarding when he tries - all of which I pay great attention to and prioritise over some gentle verbal ribbing from me through habit.
 
I’ve seen in a lot of ads recently ‘a great piece of kit’ - it angers me SO much. No wonder people think they’re just something to use and upgrade or toss away and replace when no longer winning rosettes for them.

It makes you wonder what’s happened or who’s influenced this persons equestrian journey to go from being a horse-mad kid that we all started as (and many of us still are as adults!) to calling the animals we all adore so much an ‘it’ or ‘piece of kit’

I think lots of it comes from removing emotions from the situation so it’s easier to ignore what they’re telling us.
 
I'm going to stand up for "it", as a German, since the (linguistic) gender of horse is "it" unless specified as a mare or a stallion or a gelding. A child is an "it" too, by the way, and it's not derogatory in the language; it's just that gender doesn't come into it until the sex is relevant. I call babies "it" in English, because their sex is usually irrelevant at that point (one hopes!), but call my mare "she" when her sex is relevant (e.g. she's in season, and can't concentrate on Leg Yield when a boy is in the arena), and "it" (in German) when her sex is irrelevant (e.g. she needs to have a rug on, because she is shivering. Note that I'm gendering in English, whereas I wouldn't in German). To illustrate the subtleties, "person" is "she", and "human" is "he", and "being" is "it" om German. One might read a lot into that, but possibly less into "table" as "he" and "lamp" as "she". (I find it hard to start on where the whole discussion around "gendered" language is (almost) complete nonsense in German, but there we are...)

I often use phrases like, "you idiot creature (blödes Viech)! Just walk 2 more strides, and you can have your bucket!", but I try to be conscious of not calling my horse an idiot creature more than I would call my friends idiot creatures. I figure that as long as the language is about at the same level, it's probably ok...
 
Trot_on said:
I’ve seen in a lot of ads recently ‘a great piece of kit’ - it angers me SO much. No wonder people think they’re just something to use and upgrade or toss away and replace when no longer winning rosettes for them.

It makes you wonder what’s happened or who’s influenced this persons equestrian journey to go from being a horse-mad kid that we all started as (and many of us still are as adults!) to calling the animals we all adore so much an ‘it’ or ‘piece of kit’

I think lots of it comes from removing emotions from the situation so it’s easier to ignore what they’re telling us.
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That is a disturbing turn of phrase. Horses aren't "kit". Skis are "kit". I guess for me, the limit is if I would use the phrase on my friends. E.g. teasing that I would expect to be understood as teasing. My horse doesn't know the difference (other than tone), but I do.
 
Having sort of com back to horses properly when I bought D 2 years ago I have really noticed a change in my understanding and management of language around horses a lot due to this forum and further research etc.
Our journey together has not been smooth and I have had quite a few moments when I wondered what I was doing. D could quite easily and I think has in the past been labelled as bolshy, wizzy etc. what I've found is she's actually quite worried about change and she doesn't like being rushed about. She has opinions as she's native with a strong sense of self preservation. Any difficulties in handling her have been because she's stressed and anxious or lack of education now she's fab and any issue are my deficiencies as a trainer, handler. I could so easily see it being different in the past for me if I perceived her behaviour as difficult or out to get me.
 
Rigs has a sense of humour, and I sometimes call him a little hit with an s in front. Example, if you leave the door unattended, even with a barrow in front. He will escape with GLEE! No, he doesn't want to GO anywhere. He will hoon around the yard, then run right back into the stable. If you have gone to the end of the yard, the door is once again unguarded, so... yep, he'll run out again.

I have taken to going just outside his box and ordering him back in from there. Or, mostly, I always bolt the door now.

Rigs was away at a friend's last weekend. He did the whole barrow run thing. He didn't climb it or jump it, more walked right through it. Then hung round, waiting for an opportunity to run back in.

I believe he takes the mick, just to amuse himself.

I think it is indicative that if he has someone truly inexperienced or weak, he won't do it.
 
For a very lively horse I don’t mind spicy as I think it’s quite clear what it means without being derogatory. I am so happy to see my previously fearful pony pinning his ears so much less. He’s used to get called schizophrenic as he’d be nice one minute then pin his ears but I understand now it was all fear based. Bless him. He’s really quite jolly now! I rarely suggest he’d make a lot of sausages ;-)
 
My friend has endurance racing Arabs. One of them is 16hh, acts like an overgrown toddler despite being 12ish now. Purely because he thinks it's funny.

He gets called many names 🤣
 
When Ishela used to feel lively I always used to say oh heyup I've got a live one here🙂 I wouldn't use spicy it seems to be the word of the moment like sassy used to be. Ishela's called my little princess and Rory's called Swampy at the moment both just terms of endearment. I'd never call anyone a good piece of kit. That's a horrible term to use.
 
I referred to my horses as potentially spicy just this weekend. I was asking a friend for help to bring them in from the fields as I thought they "could be a bit spicy".
Not meant in a derogitory way at all, just acknowledging that they had had a miserable night & day out in a storm and were very eager to come in.
 
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