Leading a youngster - encouraging to walk forward - advice

E

Esme2015

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 January 2016
Messages
145
Visit site
Hi All

I have a 20 month old filly. She is an angel in pretty much every way, however I have noticed recently that she stops and plants herself when I walk her back to her field from the yard. She has to go through a small stony/hardcore area then onto a particularly muddy bit of field and I don't know if it is this that puts her off. She is also a real people pony and likes being in her stable and around us when we're there and there isn't much grass in the field. She also comes in without a fuss, so I suspect that it is all of these factors. However, she clearly needs to stop the planting. I try pull and release and if that doesn't work, rather than yank her forward, I am starting to go near her back end or give her a little tap with the lead rope on her bottom. I don't really want to do this and wondered if there was another way of getting her to go forward without shooting forward and without yanking the headcollar or making lots of noise behind her.

I am not treating her at all and I don't want to use any methods that utilise treats till she is older, if at all.

Can anyone with experience with youngsters help? She is being brought up very quietly and calmly and I want to carry on in this way.

Thank you!
 
Carry a schooling whip and tap her on the bottom with that if she stops. Give the walk on command at the same time. You can with this, stay by her shoulder and keep walking on when she does. Once she gets the message then lots of verbal praise. Good luck.
 
Esmae said:
Carry a schooling whip and tap her on the bottom with that if she stops. Give the walk on command at the same time. You can with this, stay by her shoulder and keep walking on when she does. Once she gets the message then lots of verbal praise. Good luck.
Click to expand...

Thank you! Brilliant and easy idea, can't believe I didn't think of it before!
 
I feel your pain! Generally, we get no trouble with leading as we use rope head collars from day one. They are as severe or gentle as the user makes them. Youngsters sometimes plant because they are unsure. Give them plenty of time, then gradually increase the pressure and be ready to release that pressure the instant they make a movement (even shifting body weight) in the desired direction. Basically, we are empowering them to remove the discomfort by doing the right thing. "Walk on" is the trigger warning that pressure will gradually increase and not go away until they switch it off.

Possibly the stones are uncomfortable or hurt her feet. I think I'd concentrate on leading her across that area with someone to help me walking behind with a lunge whip. Walk her over that area repeatedly and not accept any planting. This has to be done with caution because force can also fixate a problem. Lots of reassurance and praise when she does it right, and perhaps a food reward?
 
Dry Rot said:
I feel your pain! Generally, we get no trouble with leading as we use rope head collars from day one. They are as severe or gentle as the user makes them. Youngsters sometimes plant because they are unsure. Give them plenty of time, then gradually increase the pressure and be ready to release that pressure the instant they make a movement (even shifting body weight) in the desired direction. Basically, we are empowering them to remove the discomfort by doing the right thing. "Walk on" is the trigger warning that pressure will gradually increase and not go away until they switch it off.

Possibly the stones are uncomfortable or hurt her feet. I think I'd concentrate on leading her across that area with someone to help me walking behind with a lunge whip. Walk her over that area repeatedly and not accept any planting. This has to be done with caution because force can also fixate a problem. Lots of reassurance and praise when she does it right, and perhaps a food reward?
Click to expand...

Thanks for your response, gratefully appreciated. She's been halter trained from about 4 weeks, as I've had her from birth, and has been great till recently. I think she is definitely unsure, you're right. I'll try some more pull and release and the schooling whip if noone is with me, quite often I am there alone. When my OH is up there, I'll see if he can help me and walk her over these areas, up and down, as you suggest. When you say force, do you mean behind her or pressure on the headcollar? I certainly don't want to keep yanking it and 'compelling' her to move and I think that's what you're saying to avoid? She gets lots of scratches, which she adores, as rewards. I'm not too keen on the food thing unless it's in her feed bowl in the stable, but that's just how I want to do things. She really picks up on my voice keeping her calm and praising her too, so hopefully that will help :-)
 
I feel your pain Ted will happily walk out (a bit to happily some days if you ask me) and then once we are done with what we are doing i lead him back he will plant 50% of the time even is he's bored with being out but my main issue is he doesn't care/isn't fazed by whips or end of lead ropes so I have to zig zag back across the field to his field as I don't think he's realised he's going forward in his mind. Sometimes its simple as he prefers to be led from the other side and he happily goes back across but its Ted his mind is a mystery haha
 
It is a big pain but as annoying as it is, youngsters need a lot of patience. Oreo used to do it a lot because he was unsure but after lots of time and firm voice commands he's come on loads. For the few times he planted with no sign of moving I use the schooling ring of the dually, lots of praise and release when he's done as asked.
 
With mine, if she plants I use an elastic-feel on the line (like bump-bump-bump rather than a constant pressure) off to the side so she gets a little unbalanced. As soon as she shifts I release the pressure. It's just enough to un-stick her and we don't get into a pulling battle.
 
I think many, if not most, youngsters go through a stage of planting. We never try to pull them forwards, you are setting both yourself and them up to fail if you do. Try to move her sideways, just a step to 'unstick' them is often all that is needed, and then forwards with lots of praise.
 
My girl did this. I had taught her to back up from a young age so I was advised that if she plants whip her around and back her up in the direction I wanted her to go. It worked a treat! Not sure if she learned a lesson or just got so utterly confused but it worked for us. I think the most important thing is that they move their feet when you say so. The zig zag approach sounds good too.
 
Oh for goodness sakes, if she stops, just swipe a rope in the bottom area and ask to walk on. If she shoots off, stand and let the blummin thing circle and try again until you can walk in straight line. It's not that much to ask is it?

Get on with it, don't get dragged into the "You first" game.
 
Kacey88 said:
My girl did this. I had taught her to back up from a young age so I was advised that if she plants whip her around and back her up in the direction I wanted her to go. It worked a treat! Not sure if she learned a lesson or just got so utterly confused but it worked for us. I think the most important thing is that they move their feet when you say so. The zig zag approach sounds good too.
Click to expand...

I also taught mine to back up too!! I might try this trick. I also like the zig zagging and actually without knowing it, this is precisely what I was doing today.

Thank you all for your advice, I shall also check out the rump rope, I've never heard of it before!
 
tallyho! said:
Oh for goodness sakes, if she stops, just swipe a rope in the bottom area and ask to walk on. If she shoots off, stand and let the blummin thing circle and try again until you can walk in straight line. It's not that much to ask is it?

Get on with it, don't get dragged into the "You first" game.
Click to expand...

If you read my post you'll see that I was using a rope on her rump and I wanted to understand if there was another way of doing it. I did precisely what you said today actually, including the circling, but it isn't how I personally wish to do things, hence me asking for advice on here. Thanks for your input though.
 
Dry Rot said:
I feel your pain! Generally, we get no trouble with leading as we use rope head collars from day one. They are as severe or gentle as the user makes them. Youngsters sometimes plant because they are unsure. Give them plenty of time, then gradually increase the pressure and be ready to release that pressure the instant they make a movement (even shifting body weight) in the desired direction. Basically, we are empowering them to remove the discomfort by doing the right thing. "Walk on" is the trigger warning that pressure will gradually increase and not go away until they switch it off.

Possibly the stones are uncomfortable or hurt her feet. I think I'd concentrate on leading her across that area with someone to help me walking behind with a lunge whip. Walk her over that area repeatedly and not accept any planting. This has to be done with caution because force can also fixate a problem. Lots of reassurance and praise when she does it right, and perhaps a food reward?
Click to expand...

I second this, even just shifting her weight in your direction is a positive! I also like the zigzagging idea as it does seem to unstick them from the plant... obvs massive praise, scratches etc when she moves her feet in your direction.
 
I wouldn't use whips, excessive pressure or any other sort of negative reinforcement personally - It's all about making it a positive experience when she finally does as you ask, not about giving her no other option
 
tankgirl1 said:
I wouldn't use whips, excessive pressure or any other sort of negative reinforcement personally - It's all about making it a positive experience when she finally does as you ask, not about giving her no other option
Click to expand...

Yep!! And that creates an understanding which will make future issues easier to deal with. The thing with using pressure is that there comes a day when the horse turns round (metaphorically) and says 'Is that the best you can do?' and you are left with no other tool in the box. Positive reinforcement creates trust in the handler and you have a horse who wants to please rather than has to please.
 
tankgirl1 said:
I wouldn't use whips, excessive pressure or any other sort of negative reinforcement personally - It's all about making it a positive experience when she finally does as you ask, not about giving her no other option
Click to expand...

I had this advice with my first youngster, an Anglo-Arab with a mind of his own! The breeder suggested using a bowl of oats to entice him along when he planted. But that seemed like rewarding bad behaviour to me and I only tried it once. We don't always have a bowl of oats handy, for a start!

Then one day I had to go out and there was a severe storm warning on the radio. I lived in the hills of the Scottish Highlands and that was serious. I had to get him in. He planted when I tried to get him into the stable and time was passing. But I'd set everything up for just such a situation! I rigged up my block-and-tackle, stuck a very sharp knife into the door frame in case of emergencies, and started taking up the slack. When his feet began to slide, his face was a picture! :) Finally, he just gave up and walked in.

He was too much horse for me and, when we'd backed him, I sold him. The man who bought him asked if he had ever travelled. I told him he had never even seen a trailer but he would load OK. The man gave a deep sigh of disbelief. The horse walked straight onto the trailer without hesitation. If I had a piece of string, I could lead that horse anywhere.

I don't use such crude methods these days and only did back then because I lived alone and had no one I could ask for advice, but the one thing a horse should never know is that it is stronger than you are. I realise this advice will be controversial, but applying superior strength by way of gadgets can be done humanely and with sympathy. Just make sure you set the scene so you don't fail -- and if you have no confidence that you wil suceed, leave it to the professionals. Applying pressure via a rope halter is not about negative reinforcement but giving the horse a choice and putting it in charge. The handler merely orchestrates the situation and defines the script. Tactfully done with youngsters, the 'fix' is permanent -- unless genuine fear takes over, then it needs patience.

Now I am unsure whether to post this or delete it... Asbestos suit time I think.
 
Esme2015 said:
If you read my post you'll see that I was using a rope on her rump and I wanted to understand if there was another way of doing it. I did precisely what you said today actually, including the circling, but it isn't how I personally wish to do things, hence me asking for advice on here. Thanks for your input though.
Click to expand...

Ooh yes reading my post back it does read like I'm being flippant with you but I write as I feel and I was feeling annoyed about petulant youngster horses :D

I have youngster and she gets like this you just have to deal with it and it will eventually disappear.
 
tallyho! said:
Ooh yes reading my post back it does read like I'm being flippant with you but I write as I feel and I was feeling annoyed about petulant youngster horses :D

I have youngster and she gets like this you just have to deal with it and it will eventually disappear.
Click to expand...

Ah I see, no problem!! Ha, thank you :-) she is really good in every other way at the moment, so I feel I can allow her this one misdemeanour, as long as it doesn't continue forever, we find ways around it ;-) and It doesn't get any worse! I am quite strict but fair with her so hopefully it will be ok in time.

Thank you all for your input, some really good suggestions and ideas that I shall utilise. This site is invaluable!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top