Leasing/loaning a schoolmaster

[tobiano1984]

I have 2 horses, and as I work in London during the week I’m looking at loaning one out. He’s kind of a spare - I rescued him years ago and he miraculously turned into an epic horse. 15.1 cob x and has done BE80 and 90, always clear. I can never sell him due to his past, I just couldn’t live with myself and want to ensure he’s always happy and cared for.
He’s a total schoolmaster now aged 14. A friend part loaned him for a few months and he got her out eventing again. Ideally I want to find him a kid to have fun on him - I’m hoping I can keep him at his current yard as there are a few interested parties there who all know how awesome he is.
Anyway - long winded way of getting onto money, what’s the scoop? Should I expect someone to cover all his costs? Pay to lease him? If he’s loaned by a kid I’d probably still ride him occasionally to keep him up to scratch.

just not sure what the done thing is - my main aim is to give him a job as he’s a proper workaholic but also financial help would be nice given I’m paying a ton and hardly riding!

 

[Wishfilly]

Leasing isn't that common in this country still- I've seen a lot of people mention it on the forum recently, and I know it's common in America, but I've only ever seen it happen for really top level horses. If he's always clear at BE90, someone might be interested in leasing, but I think you'd have to accept if they were paying you money, you'd have to let them do pretty much as they liked (within the terms of the lease, obviously). And it *might* be harder to keep him at his current yard.

To loan at current yard, I'd expect someone to cover all costs except possibly insurance- I would always keep insurance in your own name (if you have it), sometimes the loaner will transfer the monthly payment to you depending on what is agreed.

If you full loaned, I'm sure you could put in a clause that he would be occasionally schooled by you, but it would probably be best to set days and times for this and accept that this couldn't interfere with their ability to compete etc. Bearing in mind, most children have more time at the weekend, and may want to be out and about, it might be best to see if you could manage either a weekday evening or try to time it with school holidays when losing a weekend day wouldn't be such an issue.

I'd suggest loaning from current yard only (so you can keep an eye on the situation) and loaner covers all costs. If you've got a few interested parties, I'd definitely go with someone known, but do put a full contract in writing so that everyone is clear on where you stand.

 

[Red-1]

He sounds like someone will snap your hand off! I think with a horse like him, you could pretty much set your own rules.

I would look for someone where you would feel like you were sharing the adventure. I would maybe call it a part loan, so you retain one day a week? If you want to keep control that is, so they pay a weekly fee and it would work if he is on livery, that if you weren't there he would simply have a day off where staff do him. If you get the right people, they will appreciate the wonderful opportunity and it will be seamless.

I would always pay insurance, and arrange it myself.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

As one who has been both a loaner AND a loanee, you need to be clear as to exactly what you want and what your expectations of any "loan" or "share" are.

This is why you need to decide what you want for your horse and how you might achieve it. For instance you may stipulate "to stay at current yard", or if you feel he'd benefit from being with someone else, you may permit him to move. You may decide on a "share" arrangement, or a straight "loan". But whatever you do you will need to be firm and fair about the arrangement and this is where a "loan agreement" is helpful.

Loan agreements however (like yard contracts) have NO clout in law even if drawn up by a legal, whereas tenancy and land-letting agreements do as there is legislation to support and to deal with any breaches. BHS do a template which you may find is a good starting point.

Insurance is something you will need to consider, as well as access to your horse and who pays for what. Also (hate to say it) but you will need to consider putting a "Euthanasia Clause" in which basically gives the loanee (and/or any vet at their yard) the permission to PTS if your horse is badly injured and/or colics and the only humane thing to do is PTS. This gives the attending vet the right to proceed even if the owner/loanee cannot be contacted....... I'm a YO and keep my horses at home on my yard, and we've done a contract for that here, just in case, including my own horse.

Also you need to have a clause in any "contract" for immediate removal for welfare reasons if you have any reason to believe that your horse is not being treated as you would wish.

Key words in any loan relationship are Trust, Transparency, and Communication. All parties in the loan arrangement need to communicate regularly and keep talking. No decisions such as saddle fitting should be made without discussion.

Ideally you need a loan situation where you know someone else at the yard (if your horse goes elsewhere) or in the area who can look over the fence regularly to make sure your horse is OK. There is a horse coming to my yard at the end of next week (hopefully) where there is a Third Party who is known to both the owner and ourselves on the yard - this is helpful as it gives a sense of security, particularly as the owner lives nearly 3-hrs drive away. She has also followed up references from vets etc., and come to visit the yard. All vital.

Anyway, hope this helps.

 

[tobiano1984]

Thanks - yes I’ve got him insured under my name which won’t change. I’m hoping I’ve got someone at the yard interested, which would be pretty seamless

 

[Leandy]

Loan agreements however (like yard contracts) have NO clout in law even if drawn up by a legal

Not sure why you say this. They are just as enforceable as any other contract provided the terms are clear and the agreement can be properly evidenced.

 

[Pegasus5531]

I would say every loan is different and has to suit the owner, the horse and the loaner. He sounds a lovely sort that people would be queuing up to ride so you can to an extent decide now and set conditions and then people will come to you if they're happy with it. Think about how much you would like to still be involved and ride yourself. I would say if you're going to offer him as a part loan for a set amount of days a week at the current yard then you can charge a set weekly rate. If you want someone to take full responsibility and you not ride at all then I wouldn't expect them to pay you anything to you but I would expect them to pay for the upkeep of the horse. If you'd prefer to keep him at your yard see if you can find someone who will do that but then again if the loaner is the most important thing you might find someone more suitable who wants to move him. Either way whatever happens get a loan agreement drawn up that you'r both happy with and be clear of boundaries.