Legally, how’s best to cover this?

[SpotsandBays]

So I have a verbal agreement with my neighbour. In exchange for me helping with her horses, she allows me to use her grazing.
(She’s elderly, and has more grass than her two native ponies need).
It helps me out and it helps her out!

However, without going into too much detail (as it’s not my business), she’s having some issue with some family members regarding her late husband passing away/wills and stuff.
Shes getting abit panicky about people thinking she’s got an income from the land/me when she doesn’t. No money changes hands between us.

Is this agreement going to cause any issues for her?
Shes mentioned me signing what she calls a Peppercorn rent/contract (like a very very small rent amount) which I’m happy to do, however would just a written contract stating that no money changes hands not suffice in this scenario? Or do we even need anything at all?
She’s upset by the situation (of course) so just want to make sure it’s all as easy as it can be for her, whilst being protected.
Any thoughts appreciated.

 

[Abacus]

Poor lady. You could draw up a grazing agreement which shows the cost as 0 but the agreement being that you look after her horses (and specify what this means). I rent some land locally and although it's a standard rental arrangement the agreement is pretty simple. The owner had it drawn up by his solicitor. I can send it to you if you PM your email address.

 

[SpotsandBays]

Poor lady. You could draw up a grazing agreement which shows the cost as 0 but the agreement being that you look after her horses (and specify what this means). I rent some land locally and although it's a standard rental arrangement the agreement is pretty simple. The owner had it drawn up by his solicitor. I can send it to you if you PM your email address.

Thank you, that would be great! Have PMd ?

 

[Cowpony]

In order to have an enforceable contract you need valuable consideration. That's why you have a peppercorn rent - it has a value, but doesn't cost a lot.

 

[ArklePig]

Consideration doesn't need to be monetary, it can be services such as you looking after her horses. Assuming you are in England/Wales!/NI. Scotland may differ.
The contract abacus mentions sounds perfect for what you need, but equally a peppercorn rent would work too. However, I would think the lady would be better protected in terms of your end of the bargain by the grazing contract (but I know that's not the issue at the crux here as you have a trusting relationship between the two of you).

 

[Goldenstar]

I think perhaps someone is planning for how they get rid of you in the future and has been planting seeds of some sort .

 

[Polos Mum]

Aren't people horrible.

For her piece of mind I'd cobble together 2 contracts based on what you can find on the internet.

1- land rental contract for £1 per year (given yourself notice if it's important to you)
2 - provision of freelance services for £1 per year - just listing out what you do for her.

then everyone and everything is clear and she can show them to whoever is stirring

 

[SpotsandBays]

I think perhaps someone is planning for how they get rid of you in the future and has been planting seeds of some sort .

Sorry, not sure what you mean?

 

[SpotsandBays]

Thanks all, I’m happy to sign whatever she needs, peppercorn or other! I’ll send her a couple of templates and see what she thinks ?

 

[Abacus]

Aren't people horrible.

For her piece of mind I'd cobble together 2 contracts based on what you can find on the internet.

1- land rental contract for £1 per year (given yourself notice if it's important to you)
2 - provision of freelance services for £1 per year - just listing out what you do for her.

then everyone and everything is clear and she can show them to whoever is stirring

I don't think this really works for you legally as it makes the two parts of the actual agreement separate and not dependent on each other.
@Rosietaz I haven't forgotten to send the agreement, but it's on my old laptop which for some reason is struggling to start... bear with me!

 

[SpotsandBays]

I don't think this really works for you legally as it makes the two parts of the actual agreement separate and not dependent on each other.
@Rosietaz I haven't forgotten to send the agreement, but it's on my old laptop which for some reason is struggling to start... bear with me!

Thank you! No rush!

 

[Birker2020]

So I have a verbal agreement with my neighbour. In exchange for me helping with her horses, she allows me to use her grazing.
(She’s elderly, and has more grass than her two native ponies need).
It helps me out and it helps her out!

However, without going into too much detail (as it’s not my business), she’s having some issue with some family members regarding her late husband passing away/wills and stuff.
Shes getting abit panicky about people thinking she’s got an income from the land/me when she doesn’t. No money changes hands between us.

Is this agreement going to cause any issues for her?
Shes mentioned me signing what she calls a Peppercorn rent/contract (like a very very small rent amount) which I’m happy to do, however would just a written contract stating that no money changes hands not suffice in this scenario? Or do we even need anything at all?
She’s upset by the situation (of course) so just want to make sure it’s all as easy as it can be for her, whilst being protected.
Any thoughts appreciated.

My partner who had POA for his late Mum still pays a peppercorn rent to the owner of the land next to his late Mum's house where some of his brothers still live.

His brothers store farm machinery on there that used to belong to the Dad and the farm further up the road use it FOC for some months of the year for their sheep so it doesn't grow out of control and it means that the land won't ever be built on which is the big plus for all involved as its a lovely private culdesac road and all the neighbours are keen to keep it that way.

 

[Goldenstar]

Sorry, not sure what you mean?

That your friend is old and has some land and someone does not want a Tenant with no contract on the land .

 

[SpotsandBays]

That your friend is old and has some land and someone does not want a Tenant with no contract on the land .

Oh right I see what you mean.
I don’t think the issue would be there being somebody on the land, but more that there might be an income that these people believe they are entitled to, even though there isn’t. (It’s all £££. The delights of family!)

 

[Goldenstar]

People are horrid , I am sure you can sort it out .
God luck with it .

 

[Fransurrey]

That your friend is old and has some land and someone does not want a Tenant with no contract on the land .

Yup. Similar happened to me when I was renting from an elderly lady. When her sister passed away (they lived together), 'helpful' relatives put in into her mind that I was a 'sitting tenant' as I'd been there for over ten years. Caused a lot of heartache. When she herself died, she stuck two fingers up to her relatives and left the lot to a lovely neighbour, but they were still all fighting for their cut. They had to be pointed out to me at her funeral as I'd never seen them in the 13 years (by then) that I'd been there. Money grabbing bottomholes.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Oh right I see what you mean.
I don’t think the issue would be there being somebody on the land, but more that there might be an income that these people believe they are entitled to, even though there isn’t. (It’s all £££. The delights of family!)

And in the event of the death of the elderly person, it is much harder to get rid of a tenant who has no written contract, which could be said to have an end date, than one with a contract. The family orobably think they will be able to sell the land for development.

 

[Polos Mum]

It depends on how difficult the family want to be. Do they own / have a share in the land - if not I'm struggling to understand why it has anything to do with them at all.
If I choose to rent my fields out for £millions - tough on my sister or my kids, my fields = my rent

If they do own a share and are really painful they could look at the services you provide and seek to 'calculate' the cost of buying those in from a third party. That would be equivalent to the rent you are saving.
So say an hour a day x 7 days a week at £10 an hour = ish £4k

If she paid someone to do the work that what it would cost so (if I was being a total pain) that's what I'd say the 'rent' is worth and if they owned 50% of the land I'd ask her for £2k - if I really hated my family and wanted to fall out with them permanently of course !

 

[SpotsandBays]

It depends on how difficult the family want to be. Do they own / have a share in the land - if not I'm struggling to understand why it has anything to do with them at all.
If I choose to rent my fields out for £millions - tough on my sister or my kids, my fields = my rent

If they do own a share and are really painful they could look at the services you provide and seek to 'calculate' the cost of buying those in from a third party. That would be equivalent to the rent you are saving.
So say an hour a day x 7 days a week at £10 an hour = ish £4k

If she paid someone to do the work that what it would cost so (if I was being a total pain) that's what I'd say the 'rent' is worth and if they owned 50% of the land I'd ask her for £2k - if I really hated my family and wanted to fall out with them permanently of course !

Thankfully, they have no shares in the property!
Theyre after a large sum of money. It’s really rattled my neighbour, so I think although they have no input on the property, she’s just wanting to be doubly sure about everything!

 

[Polos Mum]

That is all very odd then. If they have no ownership of it - what has it got to do with them whether she rents it for £1 or £1m
Her land = her rent and they can poke it !

What could she possibly owe them money for? Old people can be really vulnerable to scams (and no reason horrible family members shouldn't try to scam her)

Maybe see if she'll speak to the police about it? My policeman OH spent lots of time with older people who "paid" for things they shouldn't have

 

[SpotsandBays]

That is all very odd then. If they have no ownership of it - what has it got to do with them whether she rents if to £1 or £1m
Her land = her rent and they can poke it !

What could she possibly owe them money for? Old people can be really vulnerable to scams (and no reason horrible family members shouldn't try to scam her)

Maybe see if she'll speak to the police about it? My policeman OH spent lots of time with older people who "paid" for things they shouldn't have

Her husband was their father (but they’re not her children). Basically he passed away and this left everything to her, and although they are written on her will, they are after his money now. So she believes they will try to get what they can now, and again when she passes away.

Shes just very worried bless her. She’s in her late 70s and lives in the house on her own (although daughter on sight and her family pop in regularly), she has a lot of time alone to think/get down rabbit holes of worry.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Perhaps you need to suggest that she talk to her daughter about the harassment that the stepchildren re subjecting her to. Daughter might want to accompany her to talk to the police. While she is alive what she does with her land/house/money is nothing to do with anyone else unless she wants it to be.

 

[SpotsandBays]

Perhaps you need to suggest that she talk to her daughter about the harassment that the stepchildren re subjecting her to. Daughter might want to accompany her to talk to the police. While she is alive what she does with her land/house/money is nothing to do with anyone else unless she wants it to be.

Yes I’ll definitely suggest that she has a chat with the police about it!

Thanks everyone!