Liver problems please read

L

Louis

Well-Known Member
Joined
18 July 2002
Messages
66
Location
Surrey
Visit site
How many people have had horses with liver disease since the beginning of 2012. Can you please add how many horses and county! I want to see how bad this is!

I had 5 in Surrey with a total of nine locally
 
I had 1 die from liver failure caused by chronic liver damage from suspected hepatitis- his biopsy showed no signs of poisoning. He died in June 2010 so possibly not any use to your statistics. I also have one at the moment with a GGT of 1600(ish) he was last tested last February and is on a restricted diet and doing ok. At the time my first wee guy was diagnosed I had all 3 of my ponies tested - pony that died had a GGT of 1000+, pony that is now ill was 40 and my other pony was 15.

My own personal opinion is that the mycotoxins in hay are playing a part in this with my pony, he was tested August 2011 and had a result of 236, then again in February 2012 and he was up to 1600. For the majority of this time he was in at night with a haynet and out through the day in a turnout area with hay, no grazing.

ETA: I'm in the Glasgow area
 
Last edited:
Mine has suspected liver problems after having an impaction on Sunday, and the bloods coming back as high liver enzymes. She's being retested on Friday, but she's not been eating anything dodgy just a basic fibre diet so not sure why at all! But all symptoms are pointing towards liver problems right now (more info on my thread if anyone's interested)

I'm in Kent
 
I'm in Kent

Had 4 together on one field, one died, rest were tested, initially came back normal but when same bloods were re-checked the liver enzymes were high. Re-tested 2 weeks later, coming down, 6 weeks later normal.

The one that died had his liver thoroughly examined at post mortem and no cause for liver disease was found.

My friend had two 2012 foals die in November from liver problems, again no cause found. They were in Hampshire.

Another lady who I only 'know' through a group on facebook had 7 young horses affected with liver problems, she first suspected mycotoxins in hay but after expensive testing now suspects something on the land to be the cause. I think she is in Hampshire too.
 
I sold one in 2010 who died a few months after of liver failure (7yo gelding)

... and currently have a 2yo on yard with suspected liver "problem" - going to big equine clinic for further investigation :(

ETA: in East Sussex
 
Could it be that with our climate changing these possible problems with hay etc, increase in grass sickness, EAM etc are resulting from that bigger problem that we can't control effecting grass/land/crops? I don't know I'm just pondering.
 
My 5 year old had raised enzymes after vaccinations in October....he has had all manner of treatment and is now back to normal (ish!)....

Another of mine was tested for cushings, but I asked the vets to run a full blood screen. Her GGT (is that it!? or GTT!?) level was 120 when I believe it should be 87.....though not high enough to be concerned.....

ETA I'm in Cambs
 
Last edited:
I'm in Kent.....currently have my 3 rising 4 yr old gelding with unknown cause of liver diease. Have already moved yards where he did pick up but results appear to show enzymes have raised again>!
 
I have 7 with raised enzymes. All with very high GGT, One over 3000. Yes that's thousand. Another over 2000, rest in the 100's.
No idea what's wrong, been going on for months. Biopsies on Monday. Mycotoxins all but ruled out. Vet now thinking it's a post viral problem, but the truth is we just don't know.
All horses seem well and you wouldn't know there was an issue with any of them.
 
Monkers, how have they ruled out mycotoxins? Tests for these are so expensive and you would need to test pasture, feed and hay.
 
Last summer, 11 with a liver virus and next doors pony had severe liver damage signs and improved with rest. Previous year, my young horse collapses through malabsorption from severe ,liver virus, next doors expensive horse contracts a neurotoxin related stringhalt possibly as a side effect from a sarcoid treatment. Friends horse in village has truly bizarre enzyme levels which are circulated globally to vets as horse should have been dead, of standing and grazing. Yearling at nearby stud collapses with severe kidney and liver infection. I'm tempted to have my lot wearing face masks when we go anywhere with other horses so they can't catch anything else!
 
Rebels,

How did the vets confirm the cause as "a liver virus", or was that just their best guess?

Similarly, how did the vets confirm "a neurotoxin related stringhalt"?

And what was the particular enzyme, and enzyme level, which the horse has who should apparently be dead?

Sorry to be pedantic on this, but I do think it's important that we are clear on what were positive diagnoses and what were just a guess at a possible cause.

Thanks,

Sarah
 
Liver virus diagnosed through bloods both times with mine. When the whole lot had it we has skewed white blood cell count (very high) and high enzymes levels. Vet ran complete blood counts of 3 horses and specific enzyme level tests on the others. She linked the enzyme levels to the protein levels of their diets, concluded there were protein digestion issues and felt it was a virus affecting the liver. For my horse that collapsed he had loads of tests including all the neurological tests and fluid taken from the gut, thousands of blood tests etc which showed other organs to be healthy and the liver to be extremely stressed.
Neurotoxin stringhalt was neighbours horse. The horse had a flat disc sarcoid on his belly. Vet injected what he claimed was a liquid nitrogen treatment straight into the sarcoid. This then swelled until the lump drooped to hock level. The swelling went down very quickly but the horse showed severe stringhalt symptoms within a week. Vet could only suggest back issue. Horse was then removed abroad to a yard where vet investigated and decided horse showed signs of neurotoxins and treated accordingly. By the end of the day the stringhalt had gone. Foreign vet said that it was a common issue if a certain plant was ingested but that plant doesn't live over here.
Will ask friend about her horses levels. It was sufficent to have a queue of vets waiting to whisk any body away for research. Horse had several liver biopsies too.
 
I've just had the same problem with my horse. He wasn't responding to medication and we couldn't find a cause for his problems. Apprently there has been a huge rise in them lately. We were considering having him pts but vet put him on medicine that helps regenerate red blood cells (I think its all very confusing.) This alongside blood liquid and milk thistle his bloods were getting better each time and now he is back to normal and a may even be able to ride him again soon.
 
It's scary how much of this is happening! Had my mares blood test results back today and she's still high :( best guess so far is some kind of virus. She's on danilon for the next few days and if when that stops she goes downhill again the vet wants to put her on a liver supplement and have her retested in a month.
Would just like to know the cause at the moment, and which way is forward :(
 
Both of mine had raised liver enzyme levels on their annual health check last year.

I consulted a very good nutritionalist and was advised to stop feeding Alfalfa of any kind in chop, so switched to Ready Grass or Grazeon (dried grass) asa this is easier for the liver to digest.

This year, their levels are back to normal, so will continue to exclude Alfalfa, although cushings horse cannot now have the grass due to laminitis.
 
I've been told a possible cause is all the wet weather we've been having has made natural oils come to the surface and the horses consuming these is what is causing the problems. You might see the oil in field puddles I definitely saw it in mine.
 
Happyhooves, I have had my pasture and my hay analysed for mycotoxins. The samples were sent to the USA for analysis. I used alltech for the analysis and yes, it is expensive at £220 per test. There are other companies in the uk that are a little cheaper but their tests are not as thorough. I have also been feeding a mycotoxin binder since October last year. My pasture had low mycotoxins generally with moderate levels of Zearalenone, which would not cause the liver issues. My hay was very low indeed in mycotoxins, lower than average. All hay and pasture will have some readings. I can't rule them out completely, but common sense says its far more likely to be something else. If my horses live through this, then I will be feeding a binder always from now on as mycotoxins are a very real threat even if they are not a problem for me this time.
Biopsies taken today from the two worst animals. One is only 10 months old. Results in a week.
 
I meant to add that all of mine have been kept off pasture since just before Christmas, so they have not been exposed to any possible nasties from the wet grass. That was coming up for 3 months ago and they are still getting worse. They have all had hay from different sources and they are all on different feeds from different companies, yet they are all sick bar one. There is no common factor linking these horses at all, other than they have all either directly or indirectly shared a water trough. The only 3 that didn't show symptoms ( one still here, two left yard a couple of weeks ago) had their own water supply. Two in their own paddocks as they are unsociable and one on box rest due to injury. All horses could snog over the fences though. If it is a virus, it will be passed through the water when horses share troughs. That much I'm convinced of so far!
 
Mine had liver problems late 2011 / early 2012. Biopsy showed it wasn't ragwort and wasn't permanent damage. Never found out what caused it but a course of steroids cleared it up. She was back to normal liver enzyme levels in June 2012.
Several other horses in the yard also had high liver enzymes but I don't know how they got on because they left soon after diagnosis.
This is in east Somerset.
 
My mare had high liver enzymes 2011-2012.

Forage analysis showed hay was very high in Iron & Manganese and high in Selenium.
Once we got her onto hay with better levels and with minerals balanced to it the enzymes came down.

High iron is very common in this country and most feeds/supplements contain Iron and not enough copper.
 
I don't currently have any problems - I think - but as I understand it the liver can absorb a lot of damage and continue functioning reasonably well, so by the time any symptoms are evident it is pretty well advanced. So that begs the question how MANY of our horses are having their liver affected in some way by something?
 
Have people tried using a flukecide on these horses such as triclabendazole? Liver fluke is becoming a lot more common in horses, and is difficult to diagnose
 
MONKERS - what a problem and still no answers. The biopsies will show what the damage is but wont tell much about what caused it will it? Abscess or bile production problems show on blood test. The only thing that sounds as if it could be a cause is the water source. Are the three without the problem being protected from something by drinking from a different source, or are the other sources the cause, and the three are avoiding it, I wonder. Or is it just co-incidence? I wonder (as mentioned by SATURDAYGIRL) if the fluke is a probelm - it does cause liver damage.Were your horses on land previously grazed by sheep or cattle or adjacent to it? But were the three OK horses on the same/adjacent pasture? Easy enough to use a flukicide anyway, as long as your vet feels that the liver damaged ones can cope with that.

You say that you had your hay and pasture analysed - but what about your feeds? If you got mycotoxin testing for about £200 then it was VERY cheap since all tests are for a single mycotoxin and there are 200+ that are problematical.

I agree with the mycotoxin binder- I too am now feeding this. What rate do you use? And I agree with JILLA that we none of us know what damage we are doing with the feeds, and supplements not to mention hay and pasture! The testing of raw stuffs for concentrates is done for moulds and probably by the supplier of the raw stuffs. What about the storage of that raw stuff prior to production to a concentrate for example - is it still mould free? Any heat treatment will kill off the moulds but it seems that the mycotoxins that they have formed remain. I even read somewhere that animals can metabolise/ produce toxins from the remnants of detroyed moulds!

The research is still going on and there are now more questions than answers. A lot of work is done in Ireland; the cost to the equine racing world of poor performance and breeding problems means that there is funding, and anything that affects a race horse will effect the ordinary dobbin!
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top