Livery hold deposit question

[jeffy]

I did look at it from the yard owners point of view and the current demand shouldn’t change their own personal ethics of how to operate and encouraging new owners to come helps the industry. I think in this case, it was just a new yard owner not knowing how to deal with customer questions. We have established from other yard owners here that hold deposits are a thing but that probbaly due to demand many yard owners aren’t doing it. If you are suggesting the mere question of a hold deposit (and written livery terms & condition) is a reason for the livery yard owner to turn me down then I’m probably better off not going with them.

 

[Barton Bounty]

Honestly ask the vicinity your in and im sure there will be options ?

 

[honetpot]

I was once at livery at DIY on a farm business, so the billing was very efficient. They split the bill in to paying for a stable, and a space at grass livery, because they had lots of year round grazing, so at one point I had four grazing spaces and one stable, the grazing was billed per day, the stable per week. Most livery yards, if they work out all their costs, need an occupancy for stable and grazing to make it pay, I think the discount you receive should be perhaps minus water and electric, unless feed and bedding is included, but they should have budgeted the profit margin on that as well.

I would just find somewhere where you can put your horse turned out, this time of year you will be lucky without facilities to be able to ride anyway. TBH you have to match your horse purchase with what realistically you can provide it. We once tried a SJ school master for my daughter, who really got on with it, but walked a way because being realistic we could not provide the facilities for it, and it needed a régime of care that we could not provide. Having been on a few livery yards of the years, there is often a huge mismatch between what people want to do, and the time and ability they have for various reasons, to do it.

 

[ycbm]

I did look at it from the yard owners point of view and the current demand shouldn’t change their own personal ethics of how to operate and encouraging new owners to come helps the industry. I think in this case, it was just a new yard owner not knowing how to deal with customer questions. We have established from other yard owners here that hold deposits are a thing but that probbaly due to demand many yard owners aren’t doing it. If you are suggesting the mere question of a hold deposit (and written livery terms & condition) is a reason for the livery yard owner to turn me down then I’m probably better off not going with them.

Hold deposits are a pretty rare thing for people who don't yet own a horse. They are usually taken while an existing owner is working out notice in another yard. A yard owner who takes a holding deposit for a horse which does not yet exist is taking a huge risk if they have other people with horses which do exist interested.

You have said yourself that if you don't find a horse in 2 months you will walk away leaving the yard owner with an empty stable.

Why on earth do you think it is a yard owner's responsibility to encourage first time horse buyers? Particularly a small private yard and not a big livery business. First time owners are probably the people most likely to give yard owners issues as they learn about how horse owning really works.
.

 

[Sossigpoker]

If it takes 6 months to find a horse and you have to pay for livery while you search you would never have any first time buyers, what am I missing?

I would look for a horse now , have some viewings , and if you proceed to wanting to book a deposit, then look for a livery space. Unless you can afford to pay livery for however long it takes.

 

[conniegirl]

Look at yards now. Choose 3 or 4 favorites. Pop yourself on some wait lists but make owner aware you are still looking for a horse.

You seriously need to adjust your expectations if you think a month is enough to find a good sound horse and get it vetted.

When you do find the horse, you then put a holding deposit pending vetting on the horse. Whilst waiting for the vetting to be done you phone your 4 or 5 favorites and take what ever stable is available until a stable on your favorite yard comes available.

 

[jeffy]

I would look for a horse now , have some viewings , and if you proceed to wanting to book a deposit, then look for a livery space. Unless you can afford to pay livery for however long it takes.

Liveries are too scarce in my area to take that option and I would be gutted if I found the perfect horse with nowhere to put them. Sure I’m checking the likes of Horsequest and horsemart, but I’m not going to waste peoples time viewing them until I have the livery secured

 

[Surbie]

Hold deposits are a pretty rare thing for people who don't yet own a horse. They are usually taken while an existing owner is working out notice in another yard. A yard owner who takes a holding deposit for a horse which does not yet exist is taking a huge risk if they have other people with horses which do exist interested.

Hold deposits happen more often where I am (South East), but these are usually when someone is between horses and already known on the yard, rather than someone who is an unknown quantity.

I would look for a horse now , have some viewings , and if you proceed to wanting to book a deposit, then look for a livery space. Unless you can afford to pay livery for however long it takes.

This sounds more sensible tbh. It can take longer than you think to find what you want. I'd also get around more yards and put yourself on a waiting list on ones you really like if you can. You might find that you don't find a horse till spring/summer when grass livery could be a temporary option till a stable comes free.

 

[jeffy]

Look at yards now. Choose 3 or 4 favorites. Pop yourself on some wait lists but make owner aware you are still looking for a horse.

You seriously need to adjust your expectations if you think a month is enough to find a good sound horse and get it vetted.

When you do find the horse, you then put a holding deposit pending vetting on the horse. Whilst waiting for the vetting to be done you phone your 4 or 5 favorites and take what ever stable is available until a stable on your favorite yard comes available.

Already put myself on several waiting lists, my expectation from speaking to them is I could be waiting well over a year for a space, there is NO point in looking for horses now.

 

[YorksG]

Liveries are too scarce in my area to take that option and I would be gutted if I found the perfect horse with nowhere to put them. Sure I’m checking the likes of Horsequest and horsemart, but I’m not going to waste peoples time viewing them until I have the livery secured

This is why the owner of the yard you like is wanting full payment, there is no shortage of customers, so no reason for yo's to need to encourage first time buyers at the yos expense.

 

[Rowreach]

Already put myself on several waiting lists, my expectation from speaking to them is I could be waiting well over a year for a space, there is NO point in looking for horses now.

You really are determined not to listen to good advice from knowledgeable people!

If, when a stable comes free and you are top of the waiting list, you do not have a horse, then the stable will go to someone who does.

 

[Sossigpoker]

Already put myself on several waiting lists, my expectation from speaking to them is I could be waiting well over a year for a space, there is NO point in looking for horses now.

Then perhaps get a grass livery or DIY lined up that you can pay for while you look for a horse.

 

[Sossigpoker]

Already put myself on several waiting lists, my expectation from speaking to them is I could be waiting well over a year for a space, there is NO point in looking for horses now.

Spaces always come up in the summer , that's when people tend to move around.

You have three options :
1. Pay for full part livery or whatever while you look for a horse
2. Look for a horse and once vetting is organised, look for even a temporary place
3. Find a cheap grass or DIY and pay for it while you look for a horse

 

[jeffy]

You really are determined not to listen to good advice from knowledgeable people!

If, when a stable comes free and you are top of the waiting list, you do not have a horse, then the stable will go to someone who does.

Not determined at all, I was originally looking for a horse first and then charged strategy after doing more research and listening to others, there are always contrarian views on everything. If I need to pay a couple of months livery so be it.

 

[ycbm]

Not determined at all, I was originally looking for a horse first and then charged strategy after doing more research and listening to others, there are always contrarian views on everything. If I need to pay a couple of months livery so be it.

You will probably strike lucky and prove us all wrong, but you are a first time owner looking for a first adult's horse for an older which is not too young (ill advised for a first time horse keeper) or too old (not enough miles left on the clock) and, most difficult of all, sound.

You say you aren't looking for a Unicorn, but in many ways not only are you looking for a Unicorn but so is half the rest of the horse buying population and there simply aren't enough of them being bred.

It can take a year and multiple failed vettings to find this paragon of virtue, but I hope you do find him/ her soon and can enjoy your first horse owning summer in a nice yard.

Yards are often not listed and only known about by word of mouth. We might be able to help with other places you can try if you let us know what area you are looking in?
.

 

[jeffy]

I have ridden some pretty tricky horses including exercising race horses for the Baldings when I was younger, I really don’t expect finding a horse will be too difficult. I do have a couple of people that work at yards keeping an eye out for me, thats how the private yard came up.

 

[Starzaan]

I have ridden some pretty tricky horses including exercising race horses for the Baldings when I was younger, I really don’t expect finding a horse will be too difficult. I do have a couple of people that work at yards keeping an eye out for me, thats how the private yard came up.

I really hope you do find one quickly and easily, but those of use who have purchased a lot of horses are just trying to prepare you for the reality.
For most, it takes a long time. I have purchased literally hundreds of horses, both for myself and for clients, riding schools, etc. it is almost never, ever a quick and simple process. Even when you have a six figure budget and a rider who doesn’t mind any level of quirks.

 

[Auslander]

I@m jumping back in, as perhaps I didn't quite read the OP properly. As previouly mentioned, I take a deposit, and don't charge for livery til the horse moves in, but I haven't been in the situation where it would be an indefinite amount of time, as all my liveries have moved in as soon as they've done their months notice elsewhere.
I wouldnt charge my standard part livery price to hold a stable indefinitely, but I would charge what it costs me to have that stable empty, which is around £200 per month (proportion of rent/rates/utility bills/insurance etc)

 

[Sossigpoker]

I have ridden some pretty tricky horses including exercising race horses for the Baldings when I was younger, I really don’t expect finding a horse will be too difficult. I do have a couple of people that work at yards keeping an eye out for me, thats how the private yard came up.

Trouble is a lot won't "pass" a vetting , especially if you're looking for a not a youngster. And a lot are still sold unseen over the phone by the looks of things so even getting a viewing can be tricky.
So I'd urge you to allow yourself a good few months at least , maybe 6 , to find one you can view, you like and passes a vetting.

 

[moosea]

Hi Jeffy,
Is this the first horse you are purchasing?


The usual route would be to start off by looking at a selection of yards that fit with what you need. You may want to make a list of all the things you are not prepared to comprimise on - written contracts may be one of those things?

Then go look at a few horses that sound lile they may be what you want.
If you feel that you have found a good potential horse then arrange the vetting and contact your prefered yard. If they have no spaces be prepared to use another yard until you can get in on the yard you like.
The alternative is to pay livery on an empty stable. But as you have already said you have a healthy budget that should not be an issue.

Good luck with your horse search- please keep us updated

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Have deliberately not read other responses, but as a YO myself I'd probably be unwilling to "hold" a place for someone who just rocks up and asks for it tbh even if they did bring cash ready to part with.

It would depend on a lot of things. For example, one of my current liveries has an old boy, he's an absolute dear, and sadly as a veteran in his late '20's we all know he ain't gonna live for ever. I know the livery, she's been here a while and fits in, and we've shared joys and tears together (she sadly lost her other mare last year). I know her to be a caring, conscientious & considerate owner and she has said she is looking for another horse - however nothing on the horizon as yet. In this situation then yes I WOULD be prepared to hold a place at the yard for her.

However 'tis a totally different situation if you don't know the person or anything about them. My instinct would be to say no, sorry in this circumstance.

 

[xDundryx]

maybe the best way the OP should have approached the livery owner (and any potential yard) is ask if there a deposit and/or holding fee for a stable, if so how much? As opposed to telling a YO that you'll pay x amount for x amount of time. I'm on DIY and currently holding another stable, paying the full monthly amount to do so. I appreciate a bit different to part or full livery however the norm on any yard around here is either a percentage for 2 months max or full monthly amount from the word go. Everyone accepts and agrees to this livery yards.are a business after all.

 

[jeffy]

maybe the best way the OP should have approached the livery owner (and any potential yard) is ask if there a deposit and/or holding fee for a stable, if so how much? As opposed to telling a YO that you'll pay x amount for x amount of time. I'm on DIY and currently holding another stable, paying the full monthly amount to do so. I appreciate a bit different to part or full livery however the norm on any yard around here is either a percentage for 2 months max or full monthly amount from the word go. Everyone accepts and agrees to this livery yards.are a business after all.

This is fair enough, I think the reason I suggested the hold fee is because I had already asked in person when I visited and didn’t get a reply and I knew there wasn’t a standard for the yard because I would have been their first customer. If it was an established yard they would have probably just answered when I first asked.