Livery- is this ok?

I can understand them charging £20 an hour for an outside instructor to use the arena - thats a pet hate of mine. We have worked hard to afford our place with an arena. If I let outside instructors come and use it to teach the liveries then they are making money from me as they do not have their own facilities. And that surely is not right. Also I insist on seeing the outside instructor insurance as you would be horrified how many of them are not actually insured to teach. Yes they already have to pay for the instructor - but the instructor should pay for the hire of the school as they are the ones making money from their teaching.
 
The only two rules that I wouldn't be happy with are the pay extra for the school if you don't want their instructor (doesn't seem fair as their instrutor can't possibly be an expert at all disciplines, unless they are paying them a hell of a lot! So penalises those who are not at the level the instructor is trained to or within that discipline.

The second rule would be the quarantine one. What if your horse isn't happy on it's own? I wouldn't be happy with not riding my horse for 8 days either tbh, especially after he'd been moved to a new yard. He would need lots of work or he'd turn into a loon!
 
Where is the yard?? It sounds quite a lot like a yard I used to work on??

In my opinion it is too strict, I managed my own livery yard, and it is hard when liveries are a law unto themselves, but there are ways of going around them.

£20 for an outside instructor is rediculous, and if its the place I'm thinking of then its not worth using the on site one!!
 
If it were me, I'd be giving this yard a very wide berth. I especially don't like the fact that you have to have your horse there for a minimum of 3 months - That may not always be possible. Only 2 rugs in the stable - well, I don't know where they got that one from, sounds plain barmy!!

Bound to get worse when you move in.....................more currently unwritten rules will appear.........
 
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We have worked hard to afford our place with an arena. If I let outside instructors come and use it to teach the liveries then they are making money from me as they do not have their own facilities.

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But surely the liveries would be using the arena whether they were having a lesson or not? The instructor will not be making money out of you, as they will be charging a freelance rate. Any additional charge for use of the arena would have to be paid by the livery client, so effectively you are charging them for something that is already included in their livery package.
 
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oh dear, I did feel quite overwhelmed but put it down to the fact I'd be up since 5am lol. Quarantine would be in a field - I can see her etc but no exercising. If for any reason there was no water liveries have to bring there own water as will.
the facilities were wonderful darn it lol
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You have to bring your own water????? walk away, fast, in fact run.....
 
I have
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was recommended on here, lovely yard DIY but can pay for extras such as mucking out which is great - told oh he can pay for horse to be done on my birthday lol so just waiting for a space to come up (fingers crossed!)
 
I am actually going to go dead against the current shock-horror trend because as a client I think I would actually quite like those rules.

Bond: Sometimes things get damaged and owners don't want to pay up. I understand that YOs could abuse this but I can also see where the YO is coming from and quite frankly, if a bond discourages unsavoury/dishonest/careless types from keeping their horses at that yard, then I'm all for it

Rent must be paid xyz: The livery business isn't exactly a money-spinner, and the YO will have her own bills to pay on time, so this is a great way to plan her budgets effectively. I think this is an excellent business practice that would stave off any sudden bankruptcies and will in turn benefit the clients more than they perhaps realise via constantly improving facilities

Three month minimum contract: As above; if this discourages unsavoury, unreliable, moonlight flitters from passing through, trouble-causing and leaving devastation in their wake a week later, then so much the better

Quarantine: Depending on the full details of this I can't comment too much. If the precautions will help to minimise the transmission of strangles then I can't object to this; if not then I'd be intrigued to hear the reasoning

Two rugs: As above, depending on further details I'm not sure - if it means 'keep unused rugs stored in your tackroom' then I think this is perfectly reasonable. If it means 'two rugs on the yard maximum' then this sounds unreasonable

£20ph hire of school: Again, this seems fair enough. After all, if you're using the home instructor and paying the lesson-cost, then this is generating income for the yard. If you're just using the school free of charge with an outside instructor this isn't making income for the yard, and it is a business

Winter 7pm/7am: This sounds like field-preservation to me - the YO appears to be trying to give her fields twelve hours' rest every day to keep her grazing in good condition throughout winter so your horse actually has some grass to eat instead of just miserably standing knee-deep in mud because they've all been out all night churning it up

In direct contradiction to a lot of people I think I'd actually quite like to keep my horse there. It seems that most of the rules actually benefit the client's horse, whether directly or indirectly, and I like the idea that the YO appears to have a good business head which will hopefully keep her well-run, healthy, tidy yard full of nice clients who have good pastures year-round.
 
The only thing I wouldn't be happy about is paying for the school if you have your own instructor in. As said above, liveries are paying for use of the school already. I have yet to find an in-house instructor that I would pay for a lesson - I might pay them to leave me alone I guess...
 
QR Sorry but there is no way I would keep my horse at at yard like the OP has described, but each to their own.
I agree with a bond as we have one on our yard which is to cover any damage or if you fail to give the 2 weeks notice upon leaving then you do not get it back.
So far as the rugs go then I agree with a previous poster in that if you are unable to keep more than that in your tack room it is pretty damned stupid especially with the range of rugs one could use season to season. Also with the intermittent changes throughout a season you may find yourself using more than one type of rug in any one week and that's not even considering if you compete or show your horse.
So far as the rent goes then paying by a due date is fair enough so long as the YO would accept DD's otherwise then in my opinion I don't think it is fair to charge someone if they were a few days late in paying in hand if they had been ill for instance and could not get to the yard.
So far as turnout is concerned then yes that is fine so long as you have someone to turn out for you?
If you had to work longish hours or had early starts/worked shifts you would be struggling to meet the times during winter.
Three month minimum contract is fine though I agree with that.
I don't agree with the 8 day quarantine as that would send a lot of horses nuts.
So far as the £20 charge for the hire of a school for an outside instructor goes would depend on how good the on site instructor was to be honest. I still feel the charge is way too much though especially as you would have the instructor charge on top.
I would also not expect to pay anything for the hire of a school if their own instructor was used or even if you just schooled your horse in there yourself. Of course if the yard run a separate business as well for teaching then these free sessions would be limited or to a couple a week or at certain times. I would expect to be paying for the school use in the charge for my livery especially if it is high, and that goes for DIY too.
As for the yard that would not allow owners to visit their horses how b***** ridiculous! But if it works for some people I suppose it would support my argument how some riders only perceive their horses as commodities or as a means to earn them fame and or fortune. I am sorry but being able to see your own horse and spending time getting to know him/her should be a part of horse ownership otherwise why not just go out and buy a mechanical horse it would certainly be a lot cheaper!
 
In all honesty there were plenty of rules at the livery yard I used to frequent when looking after a friends horse while she travelled for a year. But they were more reasonable!! Many of them we actually arranged among ourselves - just common courtesies like poo picking, not cluttering the tack room, asking before borrowing anything etc.
 
Now those kind of rules I totally agree with in fairness as they are about common courtesy, helping to maintain the health and welfare of the horses/ponies and would also make the yard seem a more tidier place.
It is the dictatorial rules of some yard owners which involves money at one point or another that gets up my nose. As in you must do it my way or use my staff/facilities/feed/bedding or else I will charge you through the nose for it all.
I know at the end of the day it is business but it is one that involves both animals and people and I think some people should be a bit more 'human' in their approach to it all. By reading some of the posts on this thread alone I am so glad I am at my present yard and even the previous one was very good compared to some I have seen described.
 
It all sounds fine to me. The quarantine comes with a field so no real probs there - bet no-one would be chuffed if a new horse arrived with strangles/lice/etc. It all seems rooted in safety and common sense and sadly, common sense isn't as common as we think.
 
Quarantine is a great idea- we have no rules at our yard and we had a pony gelding dumped in the field with was carrying strangles! guess what the outcome was?

Also the other rules sound good to, apart from the instructor thing. It's much worse to be on a yard where everything is left to some people and then others don't turn up for months!!
 
YO's should never be expected to wait "a few days" because someone is short of money or unwell. If they have any sense they will insist that all pay by direct debit. They have their own bills to pay and shouldn't have to operate at the mercy of their liveries financial circumstances.
Re visiting instructors, I agree 100%. If the YO charges for the use of the school for the lesson it's no skin off the instructor's nose, it's the livery having the lesson who has to suffer. So the argument about the instructor making money from using the premises doesn't stand up. The instructor makes money from teaching. The YO makes money from their livery charges, which take into account that liveries use the arena. I don't care how good an instructor is considered to be, if I have an instructor I'm happy with then I'm not going to be forced to use someone else.
Quarantine is a pain if you have a horse that's a bit herd-bound, but a necessary evil.
 
Am I thick I really dont get the rugs in the stable bit....Why would you have rugs in the stable that were not on the horse (or do they meen no more than 2 rugs on any one horse?) surely they have a tack/rug room to keep rugs in as it would be dangerous to leave rugs in a stable with a horse (obv not wearing them at the time)
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I don't know, at the yard I'm on now (at at all previous yards) they're hung in the stable in a rail against the wall in all the stables, I suppose it frees room in the tackroom which isn't very big and is more conveniet. Saying that I only have her winter and stable rug anyway
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All sounds a bit draconian to me!

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Quarantine would be in a field - I can see her etc but no exercising

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So you have to stay there a minimum of 3 months if you hate it and for 8 of those 12 weeks, you aren't allowed to exercise your horse and it has to stay on its own! How awful for the horse!

Frankly ridiculous and slight overkill in my opinion! No way would I keep a horse at such a yard.

Rules are good, but that's just taking things a step too far.

and £20ph to have an outside instructor in!

Of course, the YO has every right to put any rules they want in place and if they keep a full yard and make a profit, good on them, but it definitely wouldn't be for me.
 
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