Livery prices?

tobiano1984

tobiano1984

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Perhaps those of you on livery can help me - do livery yard charges generally assume that your horse will live out in summer?

Of course if it's a smart competition yard with full livery and costs £150 a week, I imagine it's expected that your horse would live in overnight all year. But if it's a normal yard costing £80-£100 ish a week, is it accepted that horses are out 24/7 in the summer? Because I imagine this would make a big difference to the cost of hay and straw for the yard!

Any thoughts from people on DIY (inc. hay and straw), part, full livery would be much appreciated! If you like your horse to come in at night all summer too, would you be expected to pay more?
 
I run a yard and charge the same amount all through the year, even though they live out 24/7 in the summer. I make very little profit in the winter, but it gets clawed back in the 3 - 4 months they are out 24/7. However, last year we had very poor grass due to having little rain and so I had to feed haylage all the way through summer, so only really saved on bedding. I charge £100 per week for part livery 7 days a week.

ETA: All horses are on the same routine and all stay out or all come in. The only exceptions are before a show, where they can stay in over night, or if on box rest. I would have to put the livery up if they insisted on their horse coming in when the rest were out.
 
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I have a few liveries and expect the DIY/ part to be out 24/7 in summer, they are actually out now, they still have the use of a stable and pay DIY rate in the summer. I do not think it fair to continue to charge the part livery rate when I am no longer doing anything, other that providing facilities.

The full livery is in at night all summer and I exercise so his rate does not change.
 
Hi Wagtail - so you specify to livery clients that they live out when you say so? Do you generally find people are happy with that?

I've got a yard and am bringing in a few liveries, but already have one interested who wants their horse to be stabled overnight all year - so do you think it would be reasonable to put the price up for them to cover extra work and hay? The other horses will live out between April and end of summer.
 
tobiano1984 said:
Hi Wagtail - so you specify to livery clients that they live out when you say so? Do you generally find people are happy with that?

I've got a yard and am bringing in a few liveries, but already have one interested who wants their horse to be stabled overnight all year - so do you think it would be reasonable to put the price up for them to cover extra work and hay? The other horses will live out between April and end of summer.
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I stipulate to all liveries before they decide to come to the yard that all horses are to follow the same routine as I find they are much happier and calmer that way. So I guess they all know from the start and are happy with that arrangement. However, if one of them came to me and wanted to change to bringing their horse in at night all year round, or in in the day, then I would permit it so long as their horse was happy and settled being the only one in, but I would explain that I average the livery costs out all year and so would calculate the extra costs (including labour) and put their livery up accordingly. I would not be too happy with the arrangement however, as I need my summer break from mucking out!
 
Mine is living out for 4 months over summer (my choice!)

i dont expect to pay any different!?

However if i was on full livery, and i was doing diy or horse living out then its totally diff imo :)
 
Wow must be different where I am.
If a YO told me I couldn't stable my horse in the stable I PAY for, they'd get told to poke their stable :(

As a customer I expect to have and be able to use what I pay for, and if I choose to do things differently, then I want it to be my choice and not dictated by a YO.

I was once at a yard where YO tried to force everyone on to grass in the spring, he was met with an empty yard several days later. So he got to keep his hay and straw!!

It is something I would expect to be informed of when visiting a yard, but in the case of the above YO, it was not mentioned (along with many other things) and that gets peoples backs up.
I had not agreed to grass only in the spring or summer so I sure as hell wasn't paying for a stable, turn out, hay and straw when none were available.
Worse still, my friend was on full livery and they expected her to pay the full livery rate for the whole time he was forced out to grass (april - sept!) :(

I am now grass livery so irrelevant to me, but if informed prior to moving to a yard and costs balanced over the year then yes it's fair to increase cost. If not initially informed, then I'm afraid it appears to be tight and penny pinching and a YO dictating the management of a liveries horse :(
 
Welshie Squisher said:
Wow must be different where I am.
If a YO told me I couldn't stable my horse in the stable I PAY for, they'd get told to poke their stable :(

As a customer I expect to have and be able to use what I pay for, and if I choose to do things differently, then I want it to be my choice and not dictated by a YO.
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Wagtail's yard is full livery though - and I'm sure if a horse needed to be stabled for any reason then it could be.

However, in principle I do agree with you Welshie.
 
Yeah Amymay I know Wagtails is full livery, and she does things right by informing her liveries prior to them moving there and explaining the costs are averaged over the year.
I have no issue with this, it's the YO who make no mention of it and spring it on you come spring!
 
Theoretically we could turn ours out 24/7 in the summer on current yard but we'd be charged the same . . . the way I see it is I pay for "access" to a field and a stable . . . how I use said field and stable is up to me. We won't be doing this b/c the grazing won't stand up to the horses being on it 24/7 . . . but the grazing is ours to manage . . . YO leaves it up to us. Also, we are a totally DIY yard - so my livery fee doesn't include bedding . . . so why should the cost go down if horse is out 24/7? Obviously, I would spend less on bedding . . . but that's not included in my livery fee.

Hope that makes sense.

P
 
Welshie Squisher said:
Wow must be different where I am.
If a YO told me I couldn't stable my horse in the stable I PAY for, they'd get told to poke their stable :(

As a customer I expect to have and be able to use what I pay for, and if I choose to do things differently, then I want it to be my choice and not dictated by a YO.

I was once at a yard where YO tried to force everyone on to grass in the spring, he was met with an empty yard several days later. So he got to keep his hay and straw!!

It is something I would expect to be informed of when visiting a yard, but in the case of the above YO, it was not mentioned (along with many other things) and that gets peoples backs up.
I had not agreed to grass only in the spring or summer so I sure as hell wasn't paying for a stable, turn out, hay and straw when none were available.
Worse still, my friend was on full livery and they expected her to pay the full livery rate for the whole time he was forced out to grass (april - sept!) :(

I am now grass livery so irrelevant to me, but if informed prior to moving to a yard and costs balanced over the year then yes it's fair to increase cost. If not initially informed, then I'm afraid it appears to be tight and penny pinching and a YO dictating the management of a liveries horse :(
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I think DIY is completely different to full livery. For DIY I would not expect to dictate when horses will be in or out 24/7. After all the livery client is doing their own work and buying all their own hay feed and bedding. However, when doing full or part livery, which is all I do, no DIY here at all, you need to calculate the cost of feeding, bedding and labour for each horse. If you base your calculations on the horses being out 24/7 for part of the year, then the price would be cheaper than if you base your costs on the coming in every day throughout the year. Therefore so long as clients are made aware of this before they come to the yard, then this is their contract with the YO. If they suddenly decide they don't like it and want their horse in all year round, then YO has a choice of giving them notice to leave (if they cannot or do not want to accommodate the request), or allowing them to have their horse in every day but recalculating the cost of their livery accordingly.
 
Welshie Squisher said:
Yeah Amymay I know Wagtails is full livery, and she does things right by informing her liveries prior to them moving there and explaining the costs are averaged over the year.
I have no issue with this, it's the YO who make no mention of it and spring it on you come spring!
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I can never understand why YOs do that. They must know it will just piss people off. I make a point of telling people all about the yard, warts an' all, before they come. I am especially careful to tell them the bad parts! Last time anyone left was two years ago now though and I've been full since then so it can't be all that bad. :)
 
i do part and full livery, both 7 day. full includes grooming tack cleaning and exercise. my liveries choose whether they want to be in/out/half and half. price stays the same all year round. stables are always ready for anything that needs/wants to be in. fields are mucked out! and dont forget GRASS DOESNT GROW FOR FREE! rolling harrowing fertilizer top seeding, spray fencing etc etc are all expenses that occur whilst your horse is in the field! also the insurance and rates are all year too as are water rates.
 
Round here it's more difficult to find yards that will let you turn out 24/7 than yards that kick you out in the summer. I have never come across any that expect full liveries to be at grass in the summer. Many have the same routine all the year round. Some give the option to switch to night turnout.

When I was looking I came across one yard that offered full liveries the option to go out 24/7 in the summer at a reduced rate.


My horse is on 5 day part livery. In summer I switch to night turnout rather than day turnout and and he comes in during the day out of the heat, away from the flies and off daytime grass when the sugars are high and wouldn't consider a yard that didn't let me do this.
 
I expect to pay the same rate all year round and would not go to a yard that enforced 24/7 turnout as i like my working horses in during the day out of the heat & flies.
 
I'm on part livery - turnout, care and costs stay exactly the same all year round, barring one hour of extra turnout in the summer. I'd love him out 24/7 in summer, and would expect to pay a slightly reduced rate if that service was offered, but the only yard I found that would have suited that did 24/7 summer turnout had no grass and tiny fields, so we're better off where we are.
 
Most diy yards with inclusive hay & straw tend to state that hay & straw is only inclusive over winter, they assume they'll be out 24/7 in summer & if you don't you provide your own bedding. For full it depends on the client type, most competition horses are in all year so it would be expected hay/ bedding are included all year round. Really it comes down to what is stated on the contract.
 
littlelegs said:
Most diy yards with inclusive hay & straw tend to state that hay & straw is only inclusive over winter, they assume they'll be out 24/7 in summer & if you don't you provide your own bedding. For full it depends on the client type, most competition horses are in all year so it would be expected hay/ bedding are included all year round. Really it comes down to what is stated on the contract.
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Actually the 3 yards I know that do offer an hay and bedding inclusive package for DIYs charge the same all the year round.
Of those 2 do not allow 24/7 turnout at any time of the year though the other does.
 
Yards I know tend to, they just average the price all year. Agree if good 24/7 turnout isn't available then hay & bedding should be inclusive all year round.
 
I am on full livery and pay the same all year. I have a choice whether I want him to live out in the summer. I choose for him to still come in or if very hot stay in all day and go out all night as our barn is very cool.
 
I pay £70 a week for full livery which includes bedding, hay, feed, storage and stable. If I choose to I can continue to pay for the same set up through the summer, OR, the yard also offers for its full livery's to go DIY over the summer months and pay DIY costs of £30, this includes you getting to keep the stable and storage as well but you need to do all the labour your horse requires.

I think that this is a really good choice to be offered. :D
 
I'm on a small DIY yard. We basically pay 'rent' for use of stable and grazing. So we pay this all year round plus what ever hay and straw we use on top of that. The good thing about paying for what you use is that you don't get in a situation where people are getting p***** off because their horse is not eating as much as the horse stabled next to them that eats twice as much or p*****off because you don't think your horse has enough hay to get it through the night. I think our system works well for everyone on the yard, and everyone seems happy, on the whole apart from the two people that have a personality clash, and a different two waste of space owners (in my opinion!) we have a happy yard. Grazing in the summer is 24/7 if you want it but if you want to bring in that's no problem as you are paying for what ever hay/straw you use, so no reason for any one to complain. Its just down to people to sort out between them about making sure no horse get left on their own in the fields. Horses do have to be in at night between Dec and end of March-ish just to save the ground from being totally wrecked, and there's also a rule about not haying in field but I think we have it pretty relaxed really. We are lucky our grazing is good (too good for a fatty owner) we never have to worry about lack of grass.

There don't seem to be many DIY yards around my area that don't now have an all in price, and most of them charge the same price all year round ... but I think its quite obvious that the price is averaged out throughout the year. Yes perhaps you are paying more in the summer ... but then you are probably paying less in the winter??? I don't personally think there's any problem with this - but I would be wanting to put my horse in/out depending on my own needs/his waste line/weather etc and wouldn't want to be following restrictive rules. However if yards have these rules then that 's no problems as long as YO up front then liveries can vote with their feet. I some times think liveries also need to be a bit more pro-active and ask the right questions ... some times too many assumptions are made all round!
 
I'm moving my boys onto part livery at £85 a week each. However in the summer they'll be out and I get charged DIY rates. Therefore I'll just pay separately for rug changes etc when I can't get up (normally mornings). Also hay/bedding can be bought at yard. DIY rate is £40 a week per horse and in the winter this includes feeding and turnout so all horses are kept in a routine. Most yards I looked at though charge the same amount throughout the year.
 
Wagtail said:
I can never understand why YOs do that. They must know it will just piss people off. I make a point of telling people all about the yard, warts an' all, before they come. I am especially careful to tell them the bad parts! Last time anyone left was two years ago now though and I've been full since then so it can't be all that bad. :)
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I think as long as it's all explained at the beginning (I got given a very detailed document setting out all the yard rules, very helpful) then there's no problem.

I wouldn't have a problem if my part/full livery then went out 24/7 but I was still charged the same. There can't be much profit in a livery yard anyway so it'd be a bit mean to start demanding lower charges over the summer. As for the stable, it'd still be there to use if needs be so seems fair to me.
 
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