livery yard dilema

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moosilver

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Hi

I moved to a new livery yard 3 weeks ago after 5 years at my last one.
This was a bad move I have now come to realise. The horses come in at 1pm (i knew this) what i didnt know is they start to go out at 8am and have to be back in for 1pm so in effect they get 3 hours out. I also didnt know this goes on until May!!.
I have come up every night to check as not happy. On many occassions my horse had no hay so i put more in only to get a rude text stating they were weighing my horses haylage and she was only allowed x amount (no communication with me re this) also this was all done by text. I have not seen the yard owner since i got there, i havent even unpacked as no allocated slot. This is a big yard 60+ horses. I am on full livery in effect. The basic fee is £60 a week but then we pay over and above for services.
long story short i have found another yard and am moving on Monday. I have paid until Sunday (tomorrow). To keep the peace i have said its too far for me to travel to. The YO has accepted this but has now said i have to pay a months livery. I cant afford to do this as I have to pay new yard upfront. I did sign a contract but obviously only been there 3 weeks. What shall i do any ideas? Shall i offer to compromise and give her 2 weeks money (would this be the £60 flat rate?) dont want to go without doing the right thing but at the same time this yard is so bad and is turning my mare into mrs grumps. I cant stay for the next month i need to get out asap before she becomes completly sour. any thoughts?
 
Poor poor you - i know just how you feel - I made a very bad move recently.

First thing first - I would only be paying the standard livery price of £60-
Second - what does the contract say ? - if it says you must pay a month in advance then you have in effect agreed to this, and if she was going to give you notice then surley you would expect a month to move ??
Third - Did you pay a month in front ?
Forth - have a hug !
 
I'm not going to e popular fr this, but ...

If you've signed a contract and they aren't in breach of it, you ought to pay what you owe. Perhaps you could offer to pay in instalments so you can afford both yards at the same time?
 
Theocat said:
If you've signed a contract and they aren't in breach of it, you ought to pay what you owe. Perhaps you could offer to pay in instalments so you can afford both yards at the same time?
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This:rolleyes:

Don't blame you for moving her though! You just don't want to be made to look like the bad party in all of this. Definitely reach a compromise and don't just not pay up!
 
If they didn't disclose all facts to u I would feel the contract was null and void and not pay a penny. If u misunderstood the situation or just decided it wasn't for u I would pay a couple of weeks out of courtesy. Sounds like u r doing the right thing moving, hope the move goes smoothly.
 
theocat you are right that if there is a contract with a month notice needed- most places do- then you have to pay a month from when you give notice. although you are not happy and have not been there long, yo have to run a business and it will take time to find a new livery, so they have to cover themselves with the notice period. but it should just be the basic rate as you wont be there to use any extra services.
good luck with the move, sounds like a good idea
 
amymay said:
I make it 5 hours out.

And I would pay the months notice.
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Depends on how many horse they turn out and bring in - and if they only start turning out at 8 am.... and then they start bringing in at say half 11 - and your horse happens to be the last out but the easiest to catch - as its a polite horse or the one if the furthest away field.... then it could be as little as 3 hours.
 
If the contract says a months notice, then unfortunately that is what you have to pay.

I'd have a good read of it though as it sounds like you were unaware of a lot of things before you arrived. If thats the case there may be chance to negotiate but you'd have to tell them the real reason you are leaving.

It does sound like a rubbish situation though. I once left a livery yard and got a bill on my leaving for hay id never used. It was a large Heston I'd said Id go halves on with another livery. The bale hadnt even been opened on my leaving but they chased me and sent me snotty messages for weeks! Paid in the end as it was all so stupid!
 
moosilver said:
Hi

I moved to a new livery yard 3 weeks ago after 5 years at my last one.
This was a bad move I have now come to realise. The horses come in at 1pm (i knew this) what i didnt know is they start to go out at 8am and have to be back in for 1pm so in effect they get 3 hours out. I also didnt know this goes on until May!!.
I have come up every night to check as not happy. On many occassions my horse had no hay so i put more in only to get a rude text stating they were weighing my horses haylage and she was only allowed x amount (no communication with me re this) also this was all done by text. I have not seen the yard owner since i got there, i havent even unpacked as no allocated slot. This is a big yard 60+ horses. I am on full livery in effect. The basic fee is £60 a week but then we pay over and above for services.
long story short i have found another yard and am moving on Monday. I have paid until Sunday (tomorrow). To keep the peace i have said its too far for me to travel to. The YO has accepted this but has now said i have to pay a months livery. I cant afford to do this as I have to pay new yard upfront. I did sign a contract but obviously only been there 3 weeks. What shall i do any ideas? Shall i offer to compromise and give her 2 weeks money (would this be the £60 flat rate?) dont want to go without doing the right thing but at the same time this yard is so bad and is turning my mare into mrs grumps. I cant stay for the next month i need to get out asap before she becomes completly sour. any thoughts?
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Poor you, This is why I cannot stress enough when viewing a yard, to ask what is included in the livery and ask for a copy. We do this so potential liveries know our routine, what is and not included.
The livery owner needs to sign, agreeing in what we do.


Have A word with YO and get a copy of what is included, sit down and work out if this is right for you. In the meantime there is no harm in window shopping.


Most yards require a months notice, did you agree to this? written contract?
 
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Some question we get asked / when people view us

When you view a yard have questions ready to ask.
  • How long will my horse be out for
  • what is included in the rent ie what does the livery include
  • what extra's do you offer and what cost
  • is there a contract to sign
  • can i have a copy to read through
  • do you keep horse records
  • is the hay / bedding ad lib
  • what feeds do you supply
  • do you charge extra for horse boxes
  • do you allow outside trainers - farriers-vets
  • do you allow dogs
  • what are the yard rules
  • is there a kerfew
  • does the school need to be booked
  • if i want to supply a different feed at my cost is this allowed
  • can i give my horse horse treats etc in the stable
  • how much storage space am i allowed
 
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My friend moved onto a yard recently and the first time she used the school she was told it was £5 to hire for 30 minutes and she needed to book it. She left.
 
Sorry, I make 8 am till 1pm = FIVE HOURS out ? So no idea what you are talking about tbh.

The bottom line is that of you do not like it leave - but five hours out is pretty good going at this time of year.
 
If it's full livery and you want to leave early, they may negotiate a lower rate for the remaining time as you won't be using bedding, feed etc. Otherwise, if no breach of contract by them then you would owe the months notice. Unlikely they would take you to court over non-payment but they could do and it can leave bad feeling if you don't do the right thing.
 
Shysmum said:
Sorry, I make 8 am till 1pm = FIVE HOURS out ? So no idea what you are talking about tbh.

The bottom line is that of you do not like it leave - but five hours out is pretty good going at this time of year.
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Wow!!!! ours go out 7am-3pm week days and weekends 9am-3pm winter months this is
 
If the yard owner was providing what was laid out in your contract then I would give proper notice but if they are not providing the services you signed up for in the first place or they have misled or misdescribed what they will provide then I wouldn't. You wouldn't pay for something you did not get in any other situation and I don't see why you should here. The trouble is you have not explained the real reasons behind why you are leaving and the reason you have given is beyond the control of the YO.
 
Leviathan said:
Some question we get asked / when people view us

When you view a yard have questions ready to ask.
  • How long will my horse be out for
  • what is included in the rent ie what does the livery include
  • what extra's do you offer and what cost
  • is there a contract to sign
  • can i have a copy to read through
  • do you keep horse records
  • is the hay / bedding ad lib
  • what feeds do you supply
  • do you charge extra for horse boxes
  • do you allow outside trainers - farriers-vets
  • do you allow dogs
  • what are the yard rules
  • is there a kerfew
  • does the school need to be booked
  • if i want to supply a different feed at my cost is this allowed
  • can i give my horse horse treats etc in the stable
  • how much storage space am i allowed
Click to expand...

you can ask all these questions and get answers that you find acceptable... you give your notice .... you move...... the first day the sudden feeling of all your hope starts to run out of your boots when you realise your pony is on a tiny amout of hay and he has been standing in since 1pm - and the board says that there will be no turn out tomorrow as the fields are wet and the school is now out of bounds and the jump paddock is not to be used for riding as its too wet - and you go to where the hay is kept and there is none left and you look up at a 35 ft stack of hay bales wondering how on earth you can get one down with being killed and you call the ym whom promises to be on call 24/7 for emergencies.... and they wont answer and when they finally do you get a mouth of abuse and they tell you your horse is obese and its had its ration.
 
we have over 60 horses they start to go out at 8am i was told they were out FOR 8am, this could take an hour and a half?? then they start to come in at 11.45 to get them back in for 1pm. I think looking at my hose state of mind she is on the wort end of this regime ie max 3 hours out. Obviously this was not explained to me and had it been i wouldnt of gone there. Do i tell her this? also i have been up on 5 occassions out of 2 and a half weeks and all the horse have been left standing in wet turnout rugs all night to 'get them dry' again no communication!! i was told my horse was 'going on to hay' (via text) no asking talking to etc. she has been on haylage for the last 5 years, would be nice to be involved in the care of my horse. shes a terrifying woman with no manners, her texts are rue and bkunt as she is in person. Im a show cob get me out of here!!!!!!!!!!! i feel like i shouldnt give her anymore money i just want out!
 
If you feel like you are not getting what you were promised, have a look over your contract. If they are in there, she had breached the contract. If maybe they are not but she said them to you, You could still consider it verbal contract.

I would then sit down with the YO and say 'I didn't want to offend you, but honestly i am leaving because ....' and explain you feel you do not owe her anything as she has breached the contract so it is void. But if she hasn't then in reality unfortunately you will be entitled to pay up.
 
I'm sorry for how things worked out, but you should pay what you owe, and that's a month's notice. I would tell them why you're leaving and what made you unhappy as you leave.
 
moosilver said:
we have over 60 horses they start to go out at 8am i was told they were out FOR 8am, this could take an hour and a half?? then they start to come in at 11.45 to get them back in for 1pm. I think looking at my hose state of mind she is on the wort end of this regime ie max 3 hours out. Obviously this was not explained to me and had it been i wouldnt of gone there. Do i tell her this? also i have been up on 5 occassions out of 2 and a half weeks and all the horse have been left standing in wet turnout rugs all night to 'get them dry' again no communication!! i was told my horse was 'going on to hay' (via text) no asking talking to etc. she has been on haylage for the last 5 years, would be nice to be involved in the care of my horse. shes a terrifying woman with no manners, her texts are rue and bkunt as she is in person. Im a show cob get me out of here!!!!!!!!!!! i feel like i shouldnt give her anymore money i just want out!
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Bloody hell I'm lucky if mine are out for 3 hours a week never mind a day! Think yourself lucky
 
I've often left a 'wet' turnout rug on a horse. Providing the rug is dry underneath then there's no problem.

At the end of the day the yard doesn't suit your needs. So you're right to move. You should be honest about the reasons though by way of an explanation for not wanting to give or pay a months notice.
 
Carrots&Mints said:
Bloody hell I'm lucky if mine are out for 3 hours a week never mind a day! Think yourself lucky
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I run a livery yard and have full and part liveries. At the moment all horses are on three to four hour turn out. The owners are happy with that.

I also think 60 a week for full livery is very cheap. I charge 130 a week for full and 80 a week for five day part.this only just breaks even . I don't know how any yard can afford to pay enough staff or provide ad lib hay on 60 a week.

My liveries have turn out am , in at lunch to a hay net, then large nets at night.
If rugs are wet on the outside but not inside they are left on to dry.
Most of the liveries choose to put them to bed in their field rugs.
 
I'm moving to a yard and it's £45 for DIY, £60 for full is ace!

At the end of the day OP move for your horse sake never mind if you do or don't have to pay, money shouldn't matter for the welfare of your horse
 
amymay said:
People have this obsession with signing things. You don't need to have signed a piece of paper to have entered into a contract.
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I have to say in the few livery yards I've been at, I've never actually signed a contract for anything. When I've left for whatever reason, I spoke to the YO and gave what I thought was enough notice , I think the last yard was about a fortnight's notice, and it always ended up in a polite and amicable ending. The yard I'm currently at has a months notice for leaving but that's because we pay direct debit one month in advance. This was explained verbally when I moved . However it sounds like OP is only just being told now that she has to pay a month up?
 
You need to pay the month's livery fee if that is what is in your contract. If you have not told the livery owner the real reason for leaving and said it is travelling distance then you have no course to disagree in my mind.

However, if you have been truthful and said to her that you were not happy because of x y z then the YO may be more willing to discuss reducing the exit fee.
 
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