'Livestock, please keep all dogs on leads' notice

Fools Motto

Fools Motto

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A few days a week, I walk my well behaved dog through 2 joined fields that currently has sheep and lambs. (the other times we are ''free range'' at our farm). There is no notice on any gate that asks for dogs to be on leads.
I don't HAVE to have mine on a lead as she is super obedient and actually won't poo on a lead but I do take a lead with me.
I met the sheep farmer today, who actually I found very rude. The sheep in question were in the second field - out of sight of the first. As I walked past mr Farmer in the first field, I said 'good morning, bit wet today, and you have lovely healthy stock, a joy to watch the young lambs'. He said nothing (or at least I didn't hear anything), then 30 odd seconds later barked ''put the f'ing dog on a bluddy lead'.
I KNOW that farmers do often get the bad deal of a 'naughty dog or two' along the way, but it would have been nice to A) tell me nicely when I was walking past him, or b) realise that my dog was clearly walking to heal or c) asked me to put dog on a lead as we got closer to the second field.

But the thought of no notice of 'keep dogs on leads at all times' has brought me to ask the question, if no notice, and no farmer at the time of walking to ask you (or in my case order you to), and with my pooch being a good girl, by law, do I HAVE to put her on a lead?
 
I would always, even with the best dog in the world (which I do not have :p), have it on a lead going through other people's fields where there is livestock. JMO. His manner could have been better, obviously.

Farmers have a lot more to deal with than a 'naughty' dog or two!!
 
It was only last week that wotsit (sorry, I've forgotten your username :o) posted pictures of that poor mauled sheep. He may have been a bit abrupt but if that's the kind of thing you have to deal with it's no wonder they have such a low tolerance of dogs.

If the dog is walking closely to heel anyway it wouldn't cost you anything to just drape a slip lead over her head until you've passed through the field.
 
I understand from a farmers point of view, can just about get my head around the fact that he was a tad rude too!
But I wanted to know if there was a law that one has to keep ones canines on a lead, even when there is not sign on the gate to do so?
 
My sympathies are all with the farmer, I believe the country code also asks for dogs to be kept on leads around livestock.

OP your dog might have been the most obedient dog in the world but the farmer dosnt know that, also someone else on seeing you might think it was ok to do the same with their dog who is not so obedient.

My dogs are off lead around our cattle but they are always put on a lead if I go on another farmers land and they have livestock turned out.
 
Your surprised that a farmer was unimpressed with you walking an offlead dog in land that you knew had sheep and young lambs in it ........

Really...I mean really?

He doesn't know your dog.I doubt he cares how well behaved or obedient your pet seems to you...but il bet he knows how much damage it can do if it chases his sheep...

Your dog is not entitled to be offlead in someones field. Its the farmers land their livelihood at stake if someday your dog decides that those white fluffy creatures are fun to chase.
Your dog is allowed on the path just like you are..using an open field as a off lead exercise area might be common practice...but that doesn't make it right.

Calling dogs in with sheep "naughty" is demeaning to the damage that a dog can do to sheep if it decides to "play"

Abortion storms a few weeks after if they are pregnant, dropping dead from the stress of the chase,injurys from being ran into fences,drowning in streams as they try to escape....and thats just from a dog running after them without biting....
If you had seen the damage a "playing" dog can do to sheep maybe you could see his point of view a little better...but im not sure if anyone really wants to see the mutilated sheep pictures that i was looking at earlier on another site....

Hundreds of pounds lost already to the farmer,with a chance of losing more as he waits to see how many of the surviving sheep will have lost the lambs they were carrying.Plus a lot of pain and suffering for poor sheep involved.
 
Aru said:
Your surprised that a farmer was unimpressed with you walking an offlead dog in land that you knew had sheep and young lambs in it ........

Really...I mean really?

He doesn't know your dog.I doubt he cares how well behaved or obedient your pet seems to you...but il bet he knows how much damage it can do if it chases his sheep...

Your dog is not entitled to be offlead in someones field. Its the farmers land their livelihood at stake if someday your dog decides that those white fluffy creatures are fun to chase.
Your dog is allowed on the path just like you are..using an open field as a off lead exercise area might be common practice...but that doesn't make it right.

Calling dogs in with sheep "naughty" is demeaning to the damage that a dog can do to sheep if it decides to "play"

Abortion storms a few weeks after if they are pregnant, dropping dead from the stress of the chase,injurys from being ran into fences,drowning in streams as they try to escape....and thats just from a dog running after them without biting....
If you had seen the damage a "playing" dog can do to sheep maybe you could see his point of view a little better...but im not sure if anyone really wants to see the mutilated sheep pictures that i was looking at earlier on another site....

Hundreds of pounds lost already to the farmer,with a chance of losing more as he waits to see how many of the surviving sheep will have lost the lambs they were carrying.Plus a lot of pain and suffering for poor sheep involved.
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You are right.
But do you think, that perhaps the farmer in question can put a note on the gate to warn dog walkers? I thought this was required (but asked the question as wasn't 100% sure). Got to remember that not everyone can be arsed to walk their dog weekly let alone daily and in that time the field has had livestock put in it?
Also, lets face it, the farmer COULD have been a little bit more polite when I first walked past him.
I am a beef farmers daughter, and when I'm out in the fields with the cows and calfs, and see another walker (also have footpaths) I'd like to think I can be a bit more polite.
 
Yes he should have been more polite but just maybe he was sick to the back teeth of telling people the same thing.

As a farmers daughter I must say Im surprised you know so little of the countrycode and expecting farmers to put notices on his gate, sheep farmers have enough on their plate with the Schmallenberg virus as an added worry. Im surprised he didnt warn you off his land for good which he was more than entitled to do.
 
Fools Motto said:
You are right.
But do you think, that perhaps the farmer in question can put a note on the gate to warn dog walkers? I thought this was required (but asked the question as wasn't 100% sure). Got to remember that not everyone can be arsed to walk their dog weekly let alone daily and in that time the field has had livestock put in it?
Also, lets face it, the farmer COULD have been a little bit more polite when I first walked past him.
I am a beef farmers daughter, and when I'm out in the fields with the cows and calfs, and see another walker (also have footpaths) I'd like to think I can be a bit more polite.
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No.Dogs should not be off the path in the first place.

The onus is on the dog owner to control their animal in a public place not on the farmer to tell them what common sense should have them doing.
Many places with footpaths have them signs alright....but they are not required by law,they are just becoming more common as people seem to be losing their animal sense.
That said the would help the farmer justify his shooting of a loose dog in a field with his sheep...

Should he have been more polite?Well yes he could have been and if he had explained why he needed your dog onlead then you probley wouldn't be as annoyed.But in reality you were the one in the wrong...and some people as not very tolerant.

If you seen someone walking through your newly calved beef cattle with their dog would you not be concerned though?Sure they are less likely to cause damage than in a sheep situation but its not exactly a wise thing to do from a safety point of view....Do you have signs up warning people that walking through a field of cattle with a dog is dangerous?
 
Yes, we have signs up at the footpath 'starts' warning of livestock and the bull, dogs to be on leads please.

We do only walk on the paths, which are worn grass tracks, the sheep also have access to the paths and can and do criss cross around us. Saying that, I have ventured off the path to avoid sleeping sheep and lambs.
Thankyou for answering the question re the sign and the law. I've seen the sign many a time, but not around these fields.

And on another note, slightly seperate, how do you train a dog to poo when it is on lead.... mine would wait til we get home, and then demand to go into the garden!
 
The funny thing is I would prefer for my dogs to poo in the garden as I could collect said poo at my leisure:eek::D

All my dogs will wee on command but havnt mastered the poo one yet:)
 
Dobiegirl said:
The funny thing is I would prefer for my dogs to poo in the garden as I could collect said poo at my leisure:eek::D

All my dogs will wee on command but havnt mastered the poo one yet:)
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I don't really mind the garden, but when the dog is clearly desperate to 'go' she looks so uncomfortable! She then has a bad habit of doing it on the go... a trail of poo from back door snaking around the garden is quite a challenge to pick it all up! Then she goes twice too! :confused::eek:
 
You ignored a notice, the farmer made a comment you did not like, your own fault. Get over it and in future respect the polite notices of landowners.

As for a dog not pooping on a lead if you keep it on a lead each and every walk, and don't let it off at home until it has pooped it will eventually get over it's hangup.
 
I think the farmer can say what he likes if you use his land with an off lead dog.im astonished you as a farmer's daughter would do this. :confused:
 
But then there are other signs on gates to fields with cows on saying if they chase you and your dog, let your dog OFF the lead.
 
We have footpaths over our farmland, and I am sick-to-the-back-teeth of dog walkers not only walking their dogs off a lead, but also of not sticking to footpaths (not saying OP did this).

They seem to think they have a God given right, really makes me cross, and then are incredulous when you mention that their dogs should be on a lead.

I have four dogs, and whilst I am very lucky to have acres and acres of my own land to exercise them on, most days I will take them elsewhere to exercise them as well, and never need to cross land with stock in it.
 
Fools Motto, why are you so cross about this incident?

The farmer has no way of knowing that your dogs are so obedient off the lead as not to worry livestock.

Put them on a lead if you wish to continue using the area to walk your dogs.

And no - of course they don't have to put notices up. But if you want to know more about your responsibility as a dog owner and walker all you need to do is to read the Countryside Code webiste, and indeed your local government website. All you need to know is there.
 
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Fools Motto said:
.........
I met the sheep farmer today, who actually I found very rude. The sheep in question were in the second field - out of sight of the first. As I walked past mr Farmer in the first field, I said 'good morning, bit wet today, and you have lovely healthy stock, a joy to watch the young lambs'. He said nothing (or at least I didn't hear anything), then 30 odd seconds later barked ''put the f'ing dog on a bluddy lead'.
I KNOW that farmers do often get the bad deal of a 'naughty dog or two' along the way, but it would have been nice to A) tell me nicely when I was walking past him, or b) realise that my dog was clearly walking to heal or c) asked me to put dog on a lead as we got closer to the second field.

.......
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Two points here; firstly and rather like the Police Officer who may be a trifle terse, you have no idea of the last situation which he had to deal with, and NO, he may not be in the best frame of mind. OK so the man was needlessly rude to you, perhaps, but I too have put up notices, asking people to keep away from my ewes, and been roundly ignored. I even had one venerable old boiler spouting off about "The right to roam"!!

and secondly, and perhaps of greater importance, when a ewe is heavily pregnant, and at the point of lambing, she will be or feel that she is in a highly vulnerable state. My dogs know my sheep, and vice versa. I would only ever take my dogs to my lambing ewes in a genuine emergency. If I don't want my working collie dog in with my sheep at lambing time, then I most certainly don't want the dogs of others, even in the field, with or without a lead. That's why I never lamb my ewes on land with a public right of way through it, I meet far to many who have no understanding and no wish to listen.

Alec.
 
This makes me really sad to read FM.

Last week one of our beautiful ewes was mauled by dogs. I know that's not what your lovely dog would do (nor mine) however can you imagine?!

This is what I found, I was 17 weeks pregnant at the time, I can't touch her or help her, I'm on my own because my mum has taken our dogs back down to the house. I'm terrified. I don't know sheep well enough, I thought she was dead at first. I'm desperately trying to get hold of my OH (who was on duty at the time so could well have been in interview/court/attending an incident) JUST for someone to talk to because I don't know what to do. :( I'm flapping majorly, I don't know what to do, I'm half in tears, half trying to stay calm because I'm frightenning her...

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Look how terrified she is, she's been there for quite a considerable time, prone, her twin lambs (if they are alive or dead still, we don't know) inevitably feeling her panic..

I can quite imagine how terse and rude my OH would be, if he met a walker going through our fields with a dog off the lead - after that fiasco.

I'm sorry the farmer upset you, I'm sure he didn't mean to. Please do what has been asked of you, just for the sake of doing the right thing. Farmers have an awfully bad time of things, my heart aches for them. As Alec says, you don't know what's gone before and it's such an easy thing to do for them - I say, why not just do it?
 
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH Congrats!! How very exciting!!

- Back to the matter in hand.....
 
In my experience I wouldn't trust any of my dogs off the lead with livestock again. My very trustworthy dog one day, totally out of the blue decided that sheep look fun to chase when he had never so much as looked at them before. it only takes once.
 
Stencilface said:
But then there are other signs on gates to fields with cows on saying if they chase you and your dog, let your dog OFF the lead.
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I've never seen such signs, but I believe a vet was killed walking her dog which was targeted by cattle, if she had let it go she would probably have been unharmed, some free range cattle are quite likely to mob dogs, so people should take precautions. Certainly any dog must be on a lead anywhere near sheep at this time of the year.
The farmer had an opportunity to talk to the OP, rather than shout at her, but basically he felt she was in the wrong, and it is his lively-hood.
 
Fools Motto said:
And on another note, slightly seperate, how do you train a dog to poo when it is on lead.... mine would wait til we get home, and then demand to go into the garden!
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It isn't terribly difficult to think of a way round this. If your dog won't go whilst on the lead, either slip the lead off somewhere safe and away from livestock so that it can go, then pop the lead on again when she's been or just make a habit of always taking her in the garden before you go out and then taking her in again when you get home. Avoid the poo trail through the house by leaving the lead on until you get into the garden.

That really isn't an insurmountable issue and only needs a teeny bit of thought to come up with a solution.

No excuse for a dog being off the lead around sheep at this time of year, you should not be surprised the farmer was rude!
 
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