Loading issues - advice needed!!

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mrsdoubtfire

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I have a 16.3hh 4 year old who I have had since weaning. I have always practised loading her and she was always happy to walk in. However, recently she has decided to sometimes not load at all. She has started going out and about for lessons, hacking and cross country but just sometimes completely refuses to get into the trailer. Sometimes she will walk straight in and then the next time it could take up to and hour and then eventually she just gives in and walks straight on. This is so infuriating as she doesn't seem scared or worried and has never had a bad experience but she just plants herself on the ramp! Does anyone have any suggestions as to what I can do please?
 
Are you saying that she was happy to get on and load until you started driving her about? If that's the case you need to examine your driving style carefully and go a for test run with someone in the trailer to see if there is anything unpleasant noise-wise happening.

If that's not the case, what do you do when she stops on the ramp?
 
She does still load sometimes, and is more than happy in the trailer once in, she doesn't stress at all just munches happily on her hay. I drive VERY carefully when towing and have been doing so for 15 years, so know that that isn't a problem. I have also tried her in different trailers and it makes no difference.
When she stops I try to persuade her to walk on, I use nuts, apples or anything tasty as she is VERY greedy and will generally do anything for food. I have tried loading her with my instructor as well and she tried tapping her on the back legs with a lunge whip and having a lunge rope behind her, but this just stresses the horse and then she gets angry and backs off completely. Once she gets bored she does just walk in calmly and nicely.
 
She's taking the pee. Your instructor has the right idea, and if it "stresses" the horse, it's her own fault. Of course she gets "angry"; she's not getting her own way. I would persevere and not take any cr*p.
 
My 5 yr old does the same thing!!!! Will walk in one day and the next he wont! Its infuriating! Ive fed him in the lorry for a week and that still didnt work now i just keep walking at the ramp until he goes in but hes not out in it much atm due to being injured. They are just taking the pee... Just be consistent and eventually they will give up the game (hopefully!)
 
Cortez said:
She's taking the pee. Your instructor has the right idea, and if it "stresses" the horse, it's her own fault. Of course she gets "angry"; she's not getting her own way. I would persevere and not take any cr*p.
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Well it MIGHT work - or it might convince her there IS something to be scared of in the trailer. It has never worked for any of mine, and with a 4 year old you are investing for her whole future.
I have had the best results with reinforcement training - if she will go in now and again, ensure there is a feed waiting for her. If she won't - reward each forward step, even if it just a toe on the ramp. Then a foot on the ramp, then both fronts - you get the picture. Those I have taught like this never needed the next three stages - they rushed in of their own accord, and once they realised there is a feed waiting inside, we couldn't keep them out.
Have you tried without the partition? Some horses like to lean and others like to spread their feet to brace themselves on the move.
 
JillA said:
Well it MIGHT work - or it might convince her there IS something to be scared of in the trailer. It has never worked for any of mine, and with a 4 year old you are investing for her whole future.
I have had the best results with reinforcement training - if she will go in now and again, ensure there is a feed waiting for her. If she won't - reward each forward step, even if it just a toe on the ramp. Then a foot on the ramp, then both fronts - you get the picture. Those I have taught like this never needed the next three stages - they rushed in of their own accord, and once they realised there is a feed waiting inside, we couldn't keep them out.
Have you tried without the partition? Some horses like to lean and others like to spread their feet to brace themselves on the move.
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I believe the OP has done all of the above, with the result not being quite as she would like. Unlike you, I have NEVER not had this method (tapping with the whip) work with any of mine (and I used to breed, so have trained hundreds of young horses to load in my time). I am not suggesting beating the horse in, I am advocating firm and focused encouragement forwards, with negative consequences for not moving forwards or going backwards. I usually have a mouthful of feed inside the trailer for any of mine that are unenthusiastic about going in, but they have to get in to receive it.
 
Have you tried using a pressure headcollar - like a Monty Roberts one? I am no expert but these work brilliantly as long as you get the release timing perfect. if you buy one new you get an instructional DVD with it.
 
Cortez said:
She's taking the pee. Your instructor has the right idea, and if it "stresses" the horse, it's her own fault. Of course she gets "angry"; she's not getting her own way. I would persevere and not take any cr*p.
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I would take no crap either my Tb went through a stage of doing exactly this after he got his feet under the table I let him know in no uncertain terms that while yes life was very comfy and easy here it comes at a price .
However if this happens to me with a young one although I let them know it's not on I load them every day until they really get it.
 
Reinforcement training means you use the food as a reward, not an inducement, there is a huge difference - an inducement is a bribe and they can choose whether or not to be bribed. If you reward each step (I use rope halters, for just that little bit of pressure) they will soon be offering more and more steps.
And Cortez - I have also bred a great many foals over the years, and for a while the pressure method worked fine for me and mine. Until I got a really sticky one. I have used both methods and trust me, the reinforcement training one is low stress and gives them very little reason to object. We had one who was under threat of being PTS because every time someone tried the pressure method he just reared and boxed. With a reinforcer he learned to load, in a lorry with a big step, in just under an hour. The following day, when another pony was put on first he pulled me in in so that the other one didn't get his treat.
If you haven't tried it you don't know how powerful it can be.
 
Hi I, too, had trouble with my boy. So I used the pressure and release method by Michael Peace. I used a Parelli type halter with 12' rope. You apply pressure and as soon as horse moves forward, even if it's only an inch you release the pressure. I Practiced first with him respecting the rope moving away and coming towards me a couple of time, having the long rope is so helpful as you can direct the horse if they go sideways a little off the ramp without changing your position. I then practiced for a few days on and off, on, off loads of times. He now goes on practically every time. But I always take the pressure halter and rope with me where ever I go, so if he stalls at all that goes on and Hey Presto all if fine. It is such a good feeling once they load coz the peace of mind knowing that I can go anywhere, anytime is priceless AND I don't get anxious and stressed the night before I go out now! Good luck and keep us posted.
 
:D
JillA said:
Reinforcement training means you use the food as a reward, not an inducement, there is a huge difference - an inducement is a bribe and they can choose whether or not to be bribed. If you reward each step (I use rope halters, for just that little bit of pressure) they will soon be offering more and more steps.
And Cortez - I have also bred a great many foals over the years, and for a while the pressure method worked fine for me and mine. Until I got a really sticky one. I have used both methods and trust me, the reinforcement training one is low stress and gives them very little reason to object. We had one who was under threat of being PTS because every time someone tried the pressure method he just reared and boxed. With a reinforcer he learned to load, in a lorry with a big step, in just under an hour. The following day, when another pony was put on first he pulled me in in so that the other one didn't get his treat.
If you haven't tried it you don't know how powerful it can be.
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This ^^^^ .....plus a rope halter.

One bought in mare reared six times after a show, falling into the trailer the last time when the ramp was slammed shut!

Lots of work as above and she was self-loading on command!

The recommended method of "not taking any nonsense" will just convince a hesitant loader that the trailer is a nasty place to be and to be avoided at all costs. I had one here that would plant as soon as she got within 25 yards of the trailer. She also loads now.

Just one thing. I think faffing around with tid-bits and morsels on the ramp is a waste of time. Give a generous and decent reward once they are fully in and leave them to it. That will work.

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Thank you all very much for your advice, it is a reinforcement feed/treat that I do, if she doesn't move she gets nothing!! My instructor decided that the tapping with whip method won't work with her as she then digs her heels in even more!! I think I will invest in a pressure halter and keep on persevering. Thanks again for the help!
 
Loved the foal loading as I did that with my youngster, but he was crafty he would go in and slowly reverse out gently pulling the feed bowl out with him at the same time. :) the problem is now it took 15 mins to load first time he went out in the trailer as he went for an operation for retained testicle and 1hr and 20 mins to load when we brought him back, and that included 1 broken clip on head collar, 1 broken clip on lead rope, 1 lunge line snapped in 2 and 1 broken clip on brand new lunge line still in it's bag and he's learnt to rear because of the clips breaking they were when we looked poor quality, so we are giving a little time off then starting him again. :)
 
Cortez said:
She's taking the pee. Your instructor has the right idea, and if it "stresses" the horse, it's her own fault. Of course she gets "angry"; she's not getting her own way. I would persevere and not take any cr*p.
Click to expand...

I have to say I completely agree, it sounds like a baby testing boundaries, with this one you have to take the hard line and tell her how it is. If she's not worried, not stressed then she's being a madam.
 
You should really look up videos on youtube or watch Monty Roberts approach to getting horses used to loading, i used the same approach with my horses and now they load perfectly and travel perfectly.
Also maybe use travelling boots or a poll guard if your not already as maybe the horse is hurting himself while travelling
 
I sort of agree with the boundary testing comments. However, a horse doesn't think that way, their is a reason they don't want to go in and it's most probably a nervousness/insecurity. My youngster did the same for a while having been pretty good about going in from the word go.

I had some tips from a lady who I have for lessons sometimes. The 'tips' came after a lesson I had with her one day. He decided he wasn't keen on going back in the lorry. She came over and explained he was somewhat fearful (not terrified, just unsure of the ramp) and she took him from me and basically used the same method she has taught me from when I got him as a 15mth old, to ask him to move forwards. This is just tapping with a schooling whip on his side (where your leg would be if riding). He knew and understood what this meant as we'd done a fair bit of groundwork using this. You tap and increase the intensity of the tapping until they step forward. The minute they move forwards you stop using the whip. If they stop moving you start the tapping again.

If they swivel their bottom one way, tap them that side to get them to move back across. Mine went in within about 2 mins and then got lots of praise and treats. The trick is for it just to be you (or the handler), do not have people behind him/at the side of the ramp etc etc. Just you and the horse. Do not let them turn round, do not walk them away and circle/re-approach etc. They have to remain facing where you want them to go (ie the trailer/box).

I have the whip with me every time now in case he hesitates, which he does on occasion. For him, it's a command he knows and understands and all I have to do is be calm but firm and he walks on every time. I also still have a treat in my pocket for once he's in.


My youngster is no pushover and he certainly has his own opinion BUT he generally is only a problem if he doesn't understand something I am asking.

Therefore, my suggestion would be to get some groundwork done with this horse and put that in to practice when you want to load her. You don't need lunge whips, lunge lines or force, just clear instructions!
 
I had some tips from a lady who I have for lessons sometimes. The 'tips' came after a lesson I had with her one day. He decided he wasn't keen on going back in the lorry. She came over and explained he was somewhat fearful (not terrified, just unsure of the ramp) and she took him from me and basically used the same method she has taught me from when I got him as a 15mth old, to ask him to move forwards. This is just tapping with a schooling whip on his side (where your leg would be if riding). He knew and understood what this meant as we'd done a fair bit of groundwork using this. You tap and increase the intensity of the tapping until they step forward. The minute they move forwards you stop using the whip. If they stop moving you start the tapping again.


Thank you for for this tip ^^^ (sorry couldn't work out the quote thing properly!!) I will try introducing it on the ground and then shall try next time I practise loading. Fingers crossed!!!

Thank you again to everyone who has answered!
 
My teenage dressage horse was an excellent loader and traveller. However, if he did not do 2 or more tests he would point blank refuse to load. This was a much travelled highly experienced competition horse with manners to burn.

We had all sorts of problems with him until we realised how to deal with it and what he was doing. After the first test we would throw a sheet on him, ease the girth and load him. That was fine because he knew there was another test coming if the saddle was left on. He would come out, do another test and we could then stand him by the lorry, untack/wash etc, prepare him for travelling and he would load like a saint.

At regionals or championships we had to fool him into loading because he would be doing just one test.
 
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