Loan crisis

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Charmel

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I have 8 horses/ponies of our own (some retired) and I recently took on loan a 10 year old 15.1 TB X Cob for my 15 year old daughter. It belongs to a friends daughter who was having issues with her. She was scared to push her to do anything. horse didn't load (took 2 hrs when we picked her up) didn't work in an outline and would just tank off if she felt like it and apparently doesnt like being stabled or tied up!

3.5 months on and lots of lessons and patience and 5 local competitions and she is completely different.

Ties up fine, stays in before shows and if weather wet. Does a lovelly dressage test and jumps 3ft 6 without trying. she has filled out muscled up and looks wonderful now. I changed nearly all her tack. Plus she now will load onto everthing.

The verbal agreement (her dad is my daughters god father so close close friends) was that we would have her for min 3 years after the trial period 1 month, till my daughter goes to Uni. But happy to keep her longer if she didn't want her back or buy her (she has tried to sell her to others 3 times). She has not visited her at all since we had her but has seen her at comps when she has been there watching friends.

I have been pressing for a legal contract

She has now contacted me and said she wants her back and she misses her too much!

She wants to put her in foal!

We can have her till the summer then she wants her back!

What should I do?
My daughter loves riding her and they are a great team already.
 
Unfortunately I don't think you have a leg to stand on. Her horse, her decision. Even if you had a contract in place, she could still take her back at any time. Sadly it's one of the pitfalls of loaning. Feel sorry for your daughter though :( just sounds like they wanted some free schooling for the horse
 
That's really mean of them and I suspect the owner has seen the horse going well for your daughter and now wants a slice of the action.
They have let you put in a great deal of work and expertise only to effectively snatch the horse away. Could you not have a heart to heart with the father and get him to see reason? It is a little insulting for the owner to want the horse back to put in foal when clearly your daughter is getting on so well. I think jealousy may have a part to play here - I don't know what age the owner is, but if she is the same age as your daughter she may see this as rivalry and if older maybe she feels embarrassed that the horse has turned about like this. Good luck OP - I hate loans for the bad ones like this.
 
I'm not sure what you can do other than offer to buy her or have a quiet word with her parents about how much your daughter likes her and how poor the market for foals is at the moment and hope that they can convince her that taking her back to breed from isn't a great idea.

If she won't change her mind I would be tempted to give the mare back now as I wouldn't want to keep a horse through the worst part of the year only to have to give it back in the summer and your daughter will bond with the mare even further the longer you keep it.
 
Its such a shame when the horse is doing so well with you but I guess the horse still belongs to the owners and the arrangements were informal. You could offer to buy her if your daughter is that fond of her ?
 
I'm another who would be inclined to offer to purchase the horse (though expect an inflated price now the horse has improved!) or send her back now. I definitely wouldn't be putting any further work into the horse and would be peeved that they expect me to keep said horse over winter only to take it back come summer.

I wouldn't sweat not having a contract too much though as I doubt it would have changed anything.
 
Put an offer in to purchase the horse, if they decline, send it back with an invoice for all the feed, bedding, tack, time your daughter has spent improving the horse, etc.
 
Oh how ridiculous. So this girl had a horse she couldn't manage and couldn't get rid of fast enough. Now she wants her back to breed a foal? Lovely. Can you imagine a nice foal proud mare?

I second a conversation with the father plus I would say take the horse back, like now, like this minute - see how she gets along in the nice dark winter.

How rotten for your daughter.
 
Tiddlypom said:
I'm afraid that you can do very little but return the horse when requested. Loans are often tricky and have broken up many friendships.

Perhaps offer to buy the mare outright?
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I offer to buy her for the amount she tried to sell her for before we had her but she said she isn't for sale. She wants us to keep her till summer but I don't think thats fair really. I could go and buy another but I thought we were helping her out she is still a kid at 18 and cant cope with the mare. The mare is too sentsitive for her she needs correct riding and consistency. Not a happy hacker once every couple of weeks living out and getting other to check her. The Mare has transformed she calls to us when we walk on the yard and because we live there she sees us all the time.
 
Talk to the father.
A frank discussion about all the work you have put in, the plans you had and the verbal agreement you made.
It sounds like they have seen her do well and want back a perfect horse with no work from them.
Ask to buy her now or send her back straight away.

Sounds like sour grapes.

That's the problem with loaning with no contract.
 
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RebelRebel said:
Oh how ridiculous. So this girl had a horse she couldn't manage and couldn't get rid of fast enough. Now she wants her back to breed a foal? Lovely. Can you imagine a nice foal proud mare?

I second a conversation with the father plus I would say take the horse back, like now, like this minute - see how she gets along in the nice dark winter.

How rotten for your daughter.
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Me too ,
I would return the mare now just when the weathers getting bad with an offer to buy no mucking around no discussion , just I will drop the mare back on say Saturday am would love to buy at whatever price but have think let me know and I 'll see you when I drop her off
Awful thing for a child , just get it over with .
 
It is heartbreaking for you, but the 18 year old kid needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Of course she wants you to keep her until the summer the stupid girl doesn't want the actual reality of looking after a horse, she just wants a cuddly wuddly foalie woalie... it makes me so cross.

ETS - poor mare btw.
 
Charmel said:
I offer to buy her for the amount she tried to sell her for before we had her but she said she isn't for sale. She wants us to keep her till summer but I don't think thats fair really. I could go and buy another but I thought we were helping her out she is still a kid at 18 and cant cope with the mare. The mare is too sentsitive for her she needs correct riding and consistency. Not a happy hacker once every couple of weeks living out and getting other to check her. The Mare has transformed she calls to us when we walk on the yard and because we live there she sees us all the time.
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In that case call their bluff. Say you appreciate they miss the mare but that you think in this case it would be best if she were returned this weekend before your daughter gets even more attached. I suspect the idea of having to deal with her in winter might cause a U turn.
 
GG2B said:
In that case call their bluff. Say you appreciate they miss the mare but that you think in this case it would be best if she were returned this weekend before your daughter gets even more attached. I suspect the idea of having to deal with her in winter might cause a U turn.
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This.

She wants to end the loan, in which case give her the horse back now before you invest any further in it. If she doesn't want it back this winter then you agree to keep her however only with the written contract for 3 years as you stated previously.
 
GG2B said:
In that case call their bluff. Say you appreciate they miss the mare but that you think in this case it would be best if she were returned this weekend before your daughter gets even more attached. I suspect the idea of having to deal with her in winter might cause a U turn.
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This, and call the parents to arrange the return not the daughter
 
How annoying - verbal contracts aren't worth anything unfortunately.

I would also speak to the parents and confirm a return tomorrow morning. No way would I be improving the mare through the winter to return in summer.

I'd suspect that it's either jealousy and a wish to collect ribbons on the back of your hard work, or a wish to collect a fat sale cheque on the back of your hard work. I would therefore do my utmost to scupper this! Good luck, I hope the owner sees sense.
 
Charmel said:
I offer to buy her for the amount she tried to sell her for before we had her but she said she isn't for sale. She wants us to keep her till summer but I don't think thats fair really. I could go and buy another but I thought we were helping her out she is still a kid at 18 and cant cope with the mare. The mare is too sentsitive for her she needs correct riding and consistency. Not a happy hacker once every couple of weeks living out and getting other to check her. The Mare has transformed she calls to us when we walk on the yard and because we live there she sees us all the time.
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Send her back now. Watch closely, within a month she'll be up for sale reduced even further than before. It won't take long her her to go back to what you already have.

The kid is 18, I can't see what the dad has to do with it quite honestly.
 
Unbelievable! As someone else said, i think that it's partly jealousy about how well your daughter is doing with her & partly thinking she may be worth lots more money by next summer if you continue with all the hard work.

I'd be calling them now & putting an offer on the table, if they don't take it, drop her off in the morning, i'd be very surprised if you didn't get a call within a month offering you the chance to buy.

I wouldn't bother going down a loan contract route, they could still pull this sort of stunt even with a contract. For the sake of your friendship, buy her or do not help them again.

Good luck, i hope you do manage to get her, let us know.
 
This is tough, and such a shame for your daughter. If the genuine reason that they want the horse back is because they 'miss' it, then surely they would be asking for it back as soon as possible, not asking you to get it through the winter? I'd definitely be in touch with the parents, not the 18 year old.
 
Im another saying return this weekend. sorry you pay to keep her in winter? No way. and as for breeding from her?how ridiculous. Return Asap. i feel for your daughter as she sounds like done good job :)
 
I can't see how the parents are in any way involved in this. OP only states that the dad is her daughter's Godfather, it doesn't look like there was any involvement from them in the initial loan agreement. If OP goes to the parents and tries to strong arm the 18 year old, I reckon it will all go sour. Send the horse back to the 18 year old without involving the parents this weekend, the 18 year old has to then either fess up or struggle through winter.
 
I would be ringing her and saying I would either buy her for the original price, or she can have her back tomorrow. Must say if I was your daughter I would be furious, and rather vocal about the plain spiteful way the girl is behaving.
 
9tails said:
I can't see how the parents are in any way involved in this. OP only states that the dad is her daughter's Godfather, it doesn't look like there was any involvement from them in the initial loan agreement. If OP goes to the parents and tries to strong arm the 18 year old, I reckon it will all go sour. Send the horse back to the 18 year old without involving the parents this weekend, the 18 year old has to then either fess up or struggle through winter.
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The dad has no input tries not to get too involved, accept he pays instead of giving her pocket money and he says one of the two she has would have to go. She has been on loan a couple of times and returned I feel sorry for the MARE she is a sweetheart when someone like my daughter rides her but she draws confidence from her rider and panics if shouted at, hence her failing with the current owner.
I have known the girl all her life and she has spent lots of time with me and my girls maybe it is jealousy. she has just got a job been there four days maybe thats why she wants her back....
 
How much do you think I should offer for her. She cost her owner £1400 two years ago and she has done nothing with her since.

She is 10 yo tbxcob bay mare very fit and good in all ways now! Was strong in gag but like a baby in her french link. Since I have had here she has jumped and won at 3ft 6 and got 68 in her first dressage test ( should improve now extra lessons) she has gone training at x country and flew everything.

She hacks out alone company anywhere...but before we had her, her owner wont take her out without someone and never on grass.....

Her value has probably doubled in 3.5 months TBH

So how much do I offer.....She has tried selling her for £2500, £1200 and £1600 in the past.......
 
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