Looking for advice re; previous house owners horses left behind

patchwork puzzle

patchwork puzzle

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I am currently on a private yard with just my two ponies and the owner of the house has two ponies there also.
When I first moved there, it was to be on a DIY livery basis, just doing my own ponies, however it became apparent very quickly that the owner could not be there so often and so she asked if I could do her horses at times. I had no problem with this but again, within a short space of time I found myself doing them for the majority of the week whilst she was away. We spoke about this and came up with an arrangement whereby I would have free livery in return for caring for her horses whenever she was unable to be around, and when she was about she would do the poo picking and bring mine in etc to help weigh up the favour.
After this I began to see her less and less and since last year she has only been back once. There were a lot of issues in the background and so I was happy enough to do what I could to help her out, also helped by my having a friend who could come up three times a week and help give her ponies some tlc.
More recently though, my friend is now no longer to come up. I let the owner know and asked if she knew of anyone who could help as I was going to struggle with mucking out and looking after 4 and having a full time job, family etc.

My problem is this, I hardly receive any communication back, she hasn't acknowledged my request for any help (the ponies had previous sharers) or even acknowledged that I may be struggling and her ponies are getting the minimal in care which I hate as want them to have the attention they deserve.
I have ordered hay and shavings on her account (with her consent of course) but the hard feed for them I have had to pay for and I don't get any response to my messages re; farrier (the last time I had to chase again and again to get payment as I was adamant they needed doing that time and couldn't be left again. This time round she hasn't responded again) I also asked about worming and vaccinations but no response.

To complicate things further she has now sold the house. They have exchanged contracts and are due to complete in a week. The new owners are happy for me to stay but I cannot get any information out of the (soon to be) previous owner regarding her ponies. She said at one point that she was going to sell them but each time I ask she'll either not respond or arrange a date to be there and then say she can't be there at the last minute.

My worries may come to nothing as she may move them or have an arrangement in place but with only a week to go, I would just like to know what's going on with them and know for certain that they aren't going to be left there indefinitely!

I'd appreciate any thoughts on what others would do.
 
I would talk to the new owner and let them know the situation. It is then up to them and their solicitor to make sure that the ex owner removes all her belongings (this includes ponies) from the property
 
This looks like trouble. You say the new owners are happy for you to be there, but for how long? Has the house been sold with no communication to you. If you are there, the house has been sold without vacant posession, which I can't think any solicitor would be happy about and the new owners would at least make a contract with you. Agree with crabbymare.
 
Sorry, possibly didn't make it clear. I'm not in the house, I just have the horses in the stables on the property. For all I know at this point the current owner may have made plans but she won't tell me anything. The new owners aren't horsy and that's why they are happy for me to stay as it helps maintain the land as much as anything (it's a big place and the yard is totally self. contained with separate access too).
 
Also, the woman's husband has said it's been put in writing that I'm there etc but he has nothing to do with her anymore and never did have anything to do with the horses. My issue isn't whether I'll stay here or not as until I meet the new owners who knows if we'll even get along but simply what others would do about her horses if they're still here.
 
I think to start with you need to make sure the new owners are aware that some of the horses are not yours.
I would contact her (in writing) to inform her I am no longer in a position to provide full livery care for her horses.
You could outline what you are prepared to do but I think you will leave yourself open to being taken advantage again.
Can you turn her horses out for the summer? If you get no response then I suppose it will be down to the new house owners to pursue her.
 
Have you met the new owners? Spoken to them? I would ascertain your own position first before you worry about someone elses ponies.
 
Agree it is way too soon for you to worry about these ponies. No new owner is likely to take possession of the house with ponies there that aren't wanted. Far more likely they will be sold/PTS/whatever and the lady leaving has far too much (moving, marriage breakdown by the sounds of it? etc) to deal with and simply hasn't got time and/or inclination to discuss with you.

I'd be looking around for alternative options for your own animals as they new owners (if you don't have a contract with them, and it sounds as though you don't) may ask you to leave pronto...
 
It would tell the new house owners the situation then it might be worth them saying her ponies have been left there as you have left, it might be enough to get her to contact them and or you its very cheeky of her to just stop communication with you and assume your just looking after them, as for buying feed and bedding just stop doing it leave them in the field and tell her so.
 
re what others would do with her horses if they are still there.
serve an abandonement notice, and after the mandatory 2 weeks had passed sell them.
 
Thank you to those who've replied re the ponies (my situation with the new owners isn't what I'm concerned about and to say that I need to worry about that instead of someone else's horses when I'm the only one doing said horses isn't a helpful response). I haven't met the new owners yet but a third party who also lives within the boundaries has and has been very involved in the process, hence why I am happy with where I myself stand when the completion occurs.
 
PP I think people were concerned about you becasue it sounds as though you won't have a legal leg to stand on in terms of your own ponies and are less concerned about the others because you are under no obligations in respect of them once the sale goes through as the livery/look after swap won't be valid any more...

For the sake of all the ponies I hope something gets sorted.
 
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Thank you Girlfriday. I don't need to go into the whole situation around whether and if I am staying as it isn't relevant to my question of her ponies. If I move on I have choices so im certainly not lacking concern where I should be but I do see that people probably are thinking along those lines. If I don't do her horses as it stands now, there's no one at all doing them. I may be under no obligation once the completion date passes but I can't just not do them, which is why I wanted advice in case I'm left with them there. I can see what people are saying about speaking to the new owners when they're there, which I will obviously do but just thought I'd get some ideas ahead of time.
 
Are you a BHS member? Their legal helpline could be useful to you if you end up having to go down the route of abandonment notices etc. Sounds as though the ponies' owner is preoccupied with her other problems and in your position I would be pretty cross with her, but she may make arrangements with a dealer or someone and not think to tell you until the last minute. I think you're very sensible to make sure you understand the legalities of your position, and what your options are, in case she doesn't though. Once you've done that I agree with others that it would definitely be prudent to speak to the new owners of the property so they understand the situation and how you propose to handle it.
 
I think once the week is up I would contact the new owners and let them know only two of the ponies are yours and that the other two belong to someoneelse
 
You need to contact ponies owners and make it clear you need a thorough conversation, whether that be on the phone or face to face.

I know you said the new owners are happy for you top stay there but you need to tell them the situation.
you currently get free livery as you care for the other ponies.
But i assume the new owners will want paying for livery?
So who will pay that?
Will the her ponies owners pay for all of it in return for you carrying on caring for them.
Or will you just pay for you horses in which case the new owners will have non paying liveries and abandoned horses on their land!

So basically make the pony owner speak to you and explain what is going on and speak to new owners and find out what they what and what you want and what the situation is with the horses.
 
I would send a letter to the ponies owner by signed for post, email etc, saying that you are no longer able to care for them and she has to make other arrangements for their care, and set a date. This should make it easier if she doesn't do anything to serve an abandonment notice by the new land owners or by you.
I would imagine the buyers solicitors have no idea that there is a problem, now is a good time to sort it out as they will be in contact with the seller as they will want their money. My neighbour can not get hold off the person who sold him his land to sign legal documents, its costing him thousands in legal fees.
I know you are happy where you are but I would be tempted to move just so you do not have the stress or the responsibility for these ponies.
 
ester said:
re what others would do with her horses if they are still there.
serve an abandonement notice, and after the mandatory 2 weeks had passed sell them.
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Ditto this.

If you are a BHS gold member then definately speak to their legal team. If it were me I would be serving an abandonment notice then after the time has passed, getting the ponies passported, up to date on everything and look to loan them out or sell them if suitable.
 
I'd make sure you take action before they complete the sale, otherwise there is no incentive for them to get things sorted. If the buyers solicitor is made aware of the potential issue they may well also want to get things sorted before any money changes hands.
 
I'd serve an abandonment notice now and not wait for the new owners. If they're not horsey, they're just as likely to tell you to deal with it. Once the two weeks is up, you can then sell / rehome /pts /keep as you see fit but at least you'll know that their future is secured.
 
Are the horses riding/driving horses in good health and with passports? If so, you could ask the current owner if she would sign ownership over to you, so you could sell them. She might jump at the chance to be rid without having to do anything herself.

If you can get hay/shavings on the owners account then I see no problem ordering these with her consent, as you have been doing. But stop buying hard feed out of your own pocket. Vaccinations aren't essential so don't worry about those.

What happened to the sharers they used to have? Can you look for more sharers? They could organize the farrier and buy hard feed in return for having full and free use of a horse, which isn't a bad deal.

In the long term something needs to be done, the owner is maybe going to abandon them at the property, she pretty much already has done so. I agree with others it's helpful to let the new owners know this sooner rather than later. You don't know what she's said to them, she could have told them all 4 are yours and will later deny that 2 are hers. The sharers (if you find new ones) might flake off when winter comes, so if they need selling it would be best to do it over summer.
 
annagain said:
I'd serve an abandonment notice now and not wait for the new owners. If they're not horsey, they're just as likely to tell you to deal with it. Once the two weeks is up, you can then sell / rehome /pts /keep as you see fit but at least you'll know that their future is secured.
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I would question if it can be classed as abandoment when you own the land and are not letting the yard as a whole to a third party?!
 
ester said:
I would question if it can be classed as abandoment when you own the land and are not letting the yard as a whole to a third party?!
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I did wonder that but it sounds like it's the (ex)husband who owns the house/yard - or is at the very least the one still living there and responsible for selling it?
 
I would give a letter to the estate agent dealing with the sale to pass onto the new owners so they can inform their solicitor as this will need dealing with before the sale is finalised. Someone will get their finger out if there is the prospect of the sale falling through due to the new owner becoming liable for two horses.
 
Nobody is living there, haven't been since last year and yes, she is still the owner so can't serve abandonment at this time. I think the advice to go down this route is the best thing to do though but can only do so after the completion date. The solicitor and new owner are all completely aware of the horses and the situation but the belief is that they will have been moved on by then. My worry is that, due to her lack of communication I'm not being told what's happening to them. Now I know we can serve abandonment if they haven't gone I'm feeling better about it. If next Wednesday comes and they're still here with no contact I shall inform her she has until the weekend to move them or I'll serve the notice.
 
No you know where she lives now? Could you go to see her and ask her permission to sell the ponies and take from any profit what is owed to you for feed/vet/farrier etc ? She might be grateful for someone sorting out these problems for her.
 
The solicitor needs to be kept aware as they may be able to withold funds if the horses are still there as the new owners will not have vacant posession. Its something that the legal people will need to sort out if possible
 
I still wouldn't wait until they've moved. I would make sure the solicitor and new owner are aware of your concerns. Say something along the lines of "Due to the lack of response from the horses owner I am concerned that they will not be removed from the site when the sale is completed. They are not my horses and I will not be responsible for the care of them or the payment of their livery"
 
Sugar_and_Spice said:
Are the horses riding/driving horses in good health and with passports? If so, you could ask the current owner if she would sign ownership over to you, so you could sell them. She might jump at the chance to be rid without having to do anything herself.
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I think this is what I'd be inclined to do TBH. OK so I know I'm a big softy but if it were me, I'd be concerned for these ponies and their plight.

OP has been very generous, and good-hearted, and is now in one helluva fix purely because of someone else's laxity and sheer lack of care and concern for their ponies, which is truly shocking and one can only be frankly appalled.

OP....... are you fond of these ponies at all?? Coz it might just be worth your offering the "owner" a silly price for them, and I mean silly. Do you know where the "owner" lives? Coz I'd be inclined to go round with some cash in hand (token payment only, not a huge amount!), OR, even better ask her to sign ownership over to you for nowt, and then you'll at least have peace of mind about them - and can sell them on if needs be to recoup some of your expenses. But at least you'd know what's what. Yes I know I'm daft in the head and totally soppy.
 
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