Looking for horse share but confused about an ad

[lewis2015]

A share is about the owner getting help (either/both time and financial) and the sharer getting to have the experience of having their own horse without the same costs.

Isn't that what I said!? You're disagreeing by agreeing. Ester implied it was a jip to 'pay for the pleasure' of riding someone's horse. I said all shares work like that essentially as it benefits both parties.

Shares are all different and the arrangements has to work for owner and sharer. I've shared before where the horse was full livery so I didn't do jobs, just paid to ride a couple of times a week. I've had a sharer for mine who did jobs as he's DIY so she didn't pay. Hence why I said this particular arrangement may not suit the OP, but I didn't think it sounded 'dodgy' or cheeky as others implied.

 

[lewis2015]

That might just be till things settle down, I would not, for example let a 14 yo loose on my horse, not any 14yo, not any horse.
She won't make money charging £15.00 for a trek, so really that argument is dubious.

Exactly! What kind of trekking centre charges £15 for a 2 hour hack? I think people are being a bit cynical and over suspicious assuming she's running a secret trekking centre.

As others have said, OP, the only way to decide if this IS dodgy or if it's going to work for you, is to go and meet owner and horses and assess the situation.

 

[southerncomfort]

I responded to a similar ad once. When we got there, their were 6 horses all tacked up with a queue of people waiting to ride them. She wanted as many people as possible to ride these horses and pay per ride. Since I was there anyway, I took one of the horses off for a ride around the fields, when I got back she complimented my quiet riding and then decided to mention that this particular horse had broken her daughters back.

All in all, fishier than a fish market on fish day! She was basically renting her horses out by the hour and making a very nice bit of money out of it. We reported her for running an unlicensed riding school/trekking centre.

 

[EQUIDAE]

I've got a similar setup - I have 4 horses (oh wait it's 5 now), 2 in ridden work and a girl comes to help out a few times a week - she does a few jobs, plays with my youngsters and rides. I don't charge her as she contributes and is improving my horses. I had another inexperienced girl come and she paid. I also pay someone else to school my horses and progress them. Occasionally I ride

 

[mynutmeg]

Isn't that what I said!? You're disagreeing by agreeing. Ester implied it was a jip to 'pay for the pleasure' of riding someone's horse. I said all shares work like that essentially as it benefits both parties.

Shares are all different and the arrangements has to work for owner and sharer. I've shared before where the horse was full livery so I didn't do jobs, just paid to ride a couple of times a week. I've had a sharer for mine who did jobs as he's DIY so she didn't pay. Hence why I said this particular arrangement may not suit the OP, but I didn't think it sounded 'dodgy' or cheeky as others implied.

I think I must have misread - I'm fairly dyslexic and don't always get the right meaning of what I read

 

[lewis2015]

I think I must have misread - I'm fairly dyslexic and don't always get the right meaning of what I read

No worries Perhaps I didn't articulate it very well!

 

[laura_nash]

I used to do something very like this with a lady. She had a homebred mare for herself and a couple of other horses for her husband and daughter, but neither of them rode very often (daughter at uni, husband a farmer) so she had about 6 of us who would ride out with her (only one at a time) for around £20 a pop for about 2 hours. She kept them at home and didn't need help with jobs. It wasn't a trekking centre type of set-up though, each of us met with her first, then again for a trial ride in the field, before we were okay to ride out. We all had to have rider insurance. Though we paid on a per-ride basis we didn't necessarily pay at the time and there was usually an agreed day / time each week (or day / times).

It was much more of a "riding out with friends" type of atmosphere, I doubt there was much profit in it either - just hacking company, exercise for the other horses and some help with their costs. Whilst I was going there one of us ended up buying the husband's horse as he (the horse) was ready for a quieter life and the husband got a new one. When there were less people (i.e. if someone stopped coming) she would just ride and lead so she didn't actually need us, I think it was just more fun for her.

I found it perfect as I didn't have the time or money for my own horse, but it was much more like riding out with a friend than riding at a riding school. Plus she had loads of land and knew all the local farmers so we could wander about in fields, do a bit of schooling etc rather than sticking to specific routes.

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

So you'd be helping her out by riding one of her horses but paying £15 for the pleasure... no thanks!

My thoughts exactly. I've always been paid to exercise other peoples horses. I've got six dogs, I would appreciate someone exercising them & paying me a fee for the privilege. What a joke!

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

Sorry, but what else is a share than helping owner with her horses and contributing to the cashflow?

A con?😛

 

[Barnacle]

What's with the "secret trekking centre" thing? It really doesn't make any difference whatsoever whether this person has 4 horses she uses to take people out on hacks and make a little extra cash (which she can use to keep the horses) or whether she needs help exercising her 4 horses, is a bit of a worrier so insists on escorting, and asks for a contribution towards costs... The outcome is identical.

OP, if what you'd like to do is go on a 2-hour hack on a horse every week, this sounds like a pretty good deal and far cheaper than most riding schools I know of - and probably cheaper than a trekking centre too. If you want the experience of owning your own, you should find a different share arrangement as this doesn't sound like it'll give you much time with the horse on the ground.

Nothing wrong either way...

 

[Leo Walker]

If I "shared" mine at £15 a ride I would come out in profit! Theres a huge difference between sharing and hiring your horse out for reward. I've had a few people ride mine, and as I wanted to supervise and they were doing me a favour I never charged them anything, just poo picking or jobs on the days they rode if needs be. If I wanted to share him properly, then I would expect them to do all jobs on their days, have free rein to do what they wanted, and while not have a total say over management etc, I would expect to listen to their opinions and take them on board, even if I did have overall say.

I'm about to look for someone to ride mine again. No charge, just riding and once we are happy they are getting on, then I'd like them to do minimal jobs on their day, mainly as, if I'm not supervising them ride, then I dont want to have to come up and muck out etc. But saying that, I'm not really sure that I get this sharing thing!

 

[ester]

What's with the "secret trekking centre" thing? It really doesn't make any difference whatsoever whether this person has 4 horses she uses to take people out on hacks and make a little extra cash (which she can use to keep the horses) or whether she needs help exercising her 4 horses, is a bit of a worrier so insists on escorting, and asks for a contribution towards costs... The outcome is identical.

The former would have very different insurance implications though and require a council licence.

 

[Polos Mum]

The former would have very different insurance implications though and require a council licence.

How is insurance any different? A proper trekking centre's insurance could only be used if they were negligent in some way (v difficult to prove) - if you have a normal horse fall and end up with a broken arm it doesn't make any difference where you are riding - you either have your own accident cover (on which you can claim) or you don't in which case it's tough!

 

[Princess16]

Why don't you go along perhaps take a friend with you, have a look at set-up she has, horses etc and air your concern about insurance. It's the only way you'll find out for certain if it's all above board. What have you got to lose ?

 

[be positive]

How is insurance any different? A proper trekking centre's insurance could only be used if they were negligent in some way (v difficult to prove) - if you have a normal horse fall and end up with a broken arm it doesn't make any difference where you are riding - you either have your own accident cover (on which you can claim) or you don't in which case it's tough!

It is the third party insurance that will differ, if you are "hiring" a horse that causes an accident to a third party while being hired, possibly a traffic accident or it gets loose and damages another person, then the insurance will be void if the terms of the insurance have not been met due to money changing hands, so the individual could be liable, in this case probably the owner of the horse not the hirer, the rider/ hirer may also find any personal injury cover is also void.

 

[Polos Mum]

It is the third party insurance that will differ, if you are "hiring" a horse that causes an accident to a third party while being hired, possibly a traffic accident or it gets loose and damages another person, then the insurance will be void if the terms of the insurance have not been met due to money changing hands, so the individual could be liable, in this case probably the owner of the horse not the hirer, the rider/ hirer may also find any personal injury cover is also void.

OK so if I as the rider fall and the horse causes a traffic accident the car drivers could claim against me personally - not the horses owner - because I'd paid to ride? But if I was just riding a mates horse for free then they would go after the owner? or if I was riding with a proper trekking centre then the would also go after the owner of the horse or indeed if I was paying £20 a week 'contribution' to shoes - i'd also be fine.

Still a bit confused about why paying to ride in some circumstances makes me responsible for the third party liability of the horse and not in others

I have always assumed that lawyers will go after whoever has the easiest to access insurance (trekking centre, owner, rider - in that order as easiest to prove liability in that order) - which is why BHS gold cover is so cheap - as it's insurance of last resort you have to try your home insurance, YO insurance etc etc. before eventually BHS get involved.

 

[be positive]

It is money changing hands for each ride that makes the contract between owner and rider a commercial one so the horse will not be covered if it causes an accident, who the injured party goes after would depend on the situation, in reality unless the loss was serious they would probably drop it as with no insurance there will be little to be gained, a proper trekking yard would be covered for any eventuality whoever was to blame and their insurance would be liable if "your" horse caused an accident during the course of the ride you paid to be on .
A contribution towards shoes or a share where a certain amount is paid gets round the need to insure for hire and reward, but only just in my view, as it is not considered to be a profitable or business arrangement, paying for a single ride, even if in reality it is not profitable or considered to be a business by the owner, is still a hire rather than share or contribution, it is a fine line but one that insurance companies will persue if they end up with a multi million pound payout which could happen in a multiple traffic accident.

Insuring a car/ horsebox is much the same, you can do car shares, give lifts to people and be fully insured but if you start to charge for journeys by the mile or run it as a small business even if you only really cover costs your insurance will become void and it could be you that gets taken to court.

 

[igglepop]

Thanks for the replies. Haven't rung as I've found a nice share horse. Will ring them tomorrow out of curiosity because if it is genuine a nice two hour hack would be loverly.

 

[webble]

I'm intrigued to know now op please find out and report back

 

[igglepop]

I will do. I'm really want to know as well but I've had such a hectic weekend that I've not had time to ring.

 

[igglepop]

She says she isn't a trekking centre so will arrange to go down this week and have a look. If I'm unsure at all I can just leave 😀 Sadly the horse I was supposed to start sharing on Monday has just appeared on a fun group for sale so I'm looking again.

 

[Noodles_3]

Hi igglepop, did you go see this lady? How did it it go if so? Good luck with your search.

 

[igglepop]

I'm going to see them next week. I will keep you updated. Didn't go this week as I have been ill.