Lorry help...what to do for the best?

[catembi]

So I have a Renault Master van conversion, stallion box, which I totally love. Great runner, so easy to drive, light on fuel, maintenance is so inexpensive compared with 7.5 ton, I am comfortable to whiz about all over by myself. The horses that I've had in it are a QH, an ISH and a TB, 15.2-3, all fine. The new boy is a 17hh big boned TB, and I would guess that he weighs about 650kg. I would guess that my payload is about 1.2 tons as my box is quite basic. He does physically fit in the lorry but I drove about 30 miles each way to hack out with a friend today & now I am having misgivings. I thought that as I only travel one, and am under payload, I would be okay but today the box kept repeatedly suddenly shifting to the right as if I had rubbed a kerb with the back wheel (I hadn't). It was also struggling more than usual to get up to speed and just didn't feel anywhere near as stable as usual. I only have single wheels at the back, not double.

Options: 1. Carry on & hope for the best (not happy with this). 2. Sell my van & buy a box-type 3.5 ton. But would this be much more stable than my van (assuming double wheels at the back) or not really? 3. Sell my box and buy 7.5 ton. I had a run of four 7.5 ton before I went to 3.5 ton & OMG they are so expensive, PITA with the plating, heavy on fuel & I was always a bit scared of driving them in case I got sent somewhere stupid by sat nav & couldn't turn round. 7.5 ton would also be a squeeze to get down our drive and even more of a squeeze to turn around. It takes me a couple of goes in the van. But would it be more stable for a big horse? I don't want to tow as I don't want to change my Aygo for something bigger, I hate towing and I can't reverse a trailer.

Or am I just being paranoid? Would the extra 150kg really be making this much difference? Was it just the wind today making the box feel unstable...?

Aaarrgghhh. I love my little lorry but today I did NOT love driving it at all, for the first time ever. I don't want all the expense of changing it or inevitably finding that I've bought a dud, but today I didn't feel safe. Please be nice as I am upset about potentially having to sell my lorry which I love.

 

[Flame_]

Was it just the wind today making the box feel unstable...?

Probably, at least possibly.
Try it again on a day when it's not blowing a gale.

I don't like the look of those conversions though, and a 17 hand horse in one does sound ominous to me.

 

[Merry neddy man]

Messy but 2 partitions so the horse is central may help, you have probably upped your load weight by 25% so you will notice the difference.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

I'd buy a box type 3.5t I think this and the dual wheels will make a difference. I wouldn't want to haul a large horse in a van conversion, personally.

 

[PapaverFollis]

You need to not assume what your payload is! You need to measure it. 1.2T would be huge payload for a 3.5tonner, basic or not. 900kg tops is more usual.

Having said that I suspect the jerking about was because of the wind. I've had that in a little car with a cross wind. I would try it on a still day and see how you go.

But as much as you love the van you need to be very honest with yourself about whether it is suitable for the horse. Do you have a camera in the horse area do you can check the jerking isn't from him unbalancing?

 

[The Xmas Furry]

Most coach built 3.5 will not have rear twin wheels, but they (3.5 coachbuilt, not twin wheel 3.5) are generally more stable (depending on build of course), the likes of the 4.5 daily etc will have twin wheels but are not generally used as they - like mercs and fords - are too high a platform to start with.

As mentioned, try a short one when weather allows, also get a hired coachbuilt to test on a trip.

I've taken 17.2 in mine which is solidly coachbuilt, it was a rather hefty chap and yes, I noticed the weight difference but didnt get the issues you mention.

 

[catembi]

I do have a camera & kept an eye on him, and the jerking did not correlate with his movements at all. He was travelling pretty calmly. He is a very laid back horse.

Two partitions might be a possibility. I think I will also find a weighbridge...I've been meaning to anyway. Realistically, I think I need a bigger box, either a bigger 3.5 ton or even bigger. **sighs** And I was thinking that elephant sized rugs were going to be my biggest expense...!

 

[Nicnac]

Never seen a 3.5t with double back wheels. I am looking to downsize a rather large 7.5t as only have one horse and a shitland now. Double rear wheels is one of my must haves as don't feel safe driving horses on single rear wheels due to the weight on them. Yet to find the right truck!

 

[Boulty]

Would try again when not horrifically windy as crosswinds would definitely cause the jerking / feeling like you've hit a kerb... Never had that feeling from a horse moving about.

If you feel you do need more space & stability then I'd try hiring a coach built & see how it feels. My coach built always felt stable regardless of what I had in there or what stupid places I took it to & if you go for a long wheelbase one then you should have plenty of space for him. A 3.9 or 4.5 ton may be another option although obv you'd have the hassle of plating etc

 

[Merry neddy man]

Never seen a 3.5t with double back wheels. I am looking to downsize a rather large 7.5t as only have one horse and a shitland now. Double rear wheels is one of my must haves as don't feel safe driving horses on single rear wheels due to the weight on them. Yet to find the right truck!

All newish 3•5 ton boxes have twin rear wheels.

 

[meleeka]

I think you need to get to a weigh bridge before you make any decisions. If that’s ok you can try without the wind, if it’s still not right have it looked at by a professional, there may be something wrong that’s making it feel unstable.

 

[[153312]]

please get the tracking checked. that is not normal.

 

[View]

Please get a mechanic to check your box before you do anything else.

 

[GoldenWillow]

I would also get your box checked out before you do anything. If you do decide to change it what about a 5.5t box? I've a couple of friends who have/have had these and they are a much more manageable size than a 7.5t although you still do have the plating etc.

 

[ycbm]

I do have a camera & kept an eye on him, and the jerking did not correlate with his movements at all. He was travelling pretty calmly. He is a very laid back horse.

Two partitions might be a possibility. I think I will also find a weighbridge...I've been meaning to anyway. Realistically, I think I need a bigger box, either a bigger 3.5 ton or even bigger. **sighs** And I was thinking that elephant sized rugs were going to be my biggest expense...!

You don't need two partitions. If you move the one you have over, or remove it altogether, the horse will likely stand more central. I had my partition shifted over before I bought it. The other side is just wide enough for a portaloo.

 

[ycbm]

All newish 3•5 ton boxes have twin rear wheels.

New 3.5t vans with single rear wheels are being sold NM.
.

 

[luckyoldme]

It does sound as if the horse is shifting while you are driving along.
As others have said a twin rear axle would be more stable and also as view said get it checked over.
I would get it to a weighbridge too fully loaded and empty just so that you are certain of your weights.
I always think that there's a lot of talk about payloads on here. There's a huge difference between a correctly distributed and secured load and a live animal with room to maneuver and a natural instinct to cause problems!

 

[ycbm]

Never seen a 3.5t with double back wheels. I am looking to downsize a rather large 7.5t as only have one horse and a shitland now. Double rear wheels is one of my must haves as don't feel safe driving horses on single rear wheels due to the weight on them. Yet to find the right truck!

They are built to carry 3.5tons and as long as you don't go over that, they're safe. The horses aren't over the rear wheels, they are between all four.

 

[Northern Hare]

Before trying again, I personally think you should check your van's payload as a priority, as it will affect how the van handles - and of course whether you are legal or not.

Here's a link to the gov website which helps you find a Weighbridge local to you. There are others - lots of quarries have their own. It only takes 5 minutes but it's really worth knowing for sure.s

https://www.gov.uk/find-weighbridge

We've moved onto a motorhome now and we have exactly the same issues with payloads, so we are often at the weighbridge!

 

[Red-1]

I would imagine twin rear wheels would really add to the weight and reduce payload. Wheels are very heavy.

I would have thought a 3.5 box type would be more spacious, but think that the buffeting was most likely due to the wind.

That said, I would have it to a weighbridge, with everything you intend to carry, water, fuel etc. as estimating is a dangerous thing with payload. It may well be over.

I would check tyres, age and pressure, I would also take it out empty, make sure it drives true, or have it to a mechanic.

 

[ycbm]

I do have a camera & kept an eye on him, and the jerking did not correlate with his movements at all. He was travelling pretty calmly. He is a very laid back horse.

I'm not sure if you know that this is illegal if you were driving.
.

 

[tda]

There's a huge difference between a correctly distributed and secured load and a live animal with room to maneuver and a natural instinct to cause problems!

Agree with others, it would have been the wind, but still worth doing other checks as advised

 

[Barlow]

It’s probably stating the obvious but did you check your tyre pressures before you loaded? Under inflated or unevenly inflated tyres can often give that feel. I also have winter tyres on my 3.5t all year round to provide extra grip, I found they really help to stabilise the box.

 

[mini_b]

I wouldn’t travel my big horse in a van conversion. Sorry.
Sell it and go for a bigger one.

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

There are definitely 3.5t coach built that can carry one large horse comfortably. My friend has a Marlborough for her over 17hh and it’s perfectly roomy and safe.

 

[MissTyc]

I've removed the partition to travel my 16.1hh baby in my 3.5t. He stands diagonally centrally and I don't think anything even when he has a kickabout. I wouldn't want to travel him "straight" within a single partition and he's smaller than your boy. I do find, even minor shifts can make the driving feel lurchy if they're actually leaning, but would also echo having everything checked before travelling again, just in case!

 

[MereChristmas]

I had a 3.5 with twin rear wheels when payload was hardly ever mentioned. It was high from the ground. I had 2 partitions and my horse travelled in the centre. I had the vehicle weighed and found the payload would barely be enough for a 12.2hh. It was sold.
I have a 3.5 conversion now which carries 1200kg. It is not high enough for a 16.2 but that doesn’t matter to me.
A friend’s mare isn’t happy travelling with a partition in a 3.5. She is travelled without a partition and settles herself sideways and doesn’t move.
I don’t see any reason why if the payload and height are OK and your horse is happier that way that you couldn’t travel without a partition.

 

[TheHairyOne]

I know some models of the transit type vans you can upgrade to 4T. My friend did it with a 3.5 converstion to allow her to take 2 so i unless you have the heaviest build in the world (not likely in a van conversion) i would go with weight not being an issue.

From personal experience my sisters horse is a 17.3 tb type and he travelled many miles in our lwb coach build converstion without mucking about with partitions.

I would go with a lot of the suggestions about 1, the weather, 2, check all tyres and suspension elements etc

However, another thought thats not been mentioned. Is it tall enough for him to use his head/neck properly to aid with balance?

 

[PeterNatt]

I would get a professional lorry mchanic to thoroughly check your vehicle out including the suspension, tracking and tyres. Also get the weight of the vehicle checked out on a weigh bridge to determine what the pay load actually is.

 

[Goldenstar]

You could go for a seven ton van type ( or 6.5 ) if you buying are something a bit older .