Losing Shoe

MystieMoo

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Hi All

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to give as much info as possible.

Our 10 year old ID x Cob mare - my profile pic - has been losing one of her hind shoes recently.
We have had her 5 years and she has always had super feet, this has never happened before.
In October of last year, we moved areas and had to find a new farrier. We found one who had excellent qualifications, experience with shoeing horses on the heavier side, able to offer remedial if ever needed, and came recommended by several people.
He shod her 5 cycles in all. By the 4th cycle, the shoe was starting to come off. Not all the time, but every couple of weeks perhaps. Same through the 5th cycle.
Several things then happened at once. We heard that a couple of other horses on the yard were losing shoes, same farrier (it's a huge yard), and then we heard that one horse was on two separate cycles for his shoes and was being shod every 2 to 3 weeks, fore and hind alternately (Clydesdale, no idea if that is normal for them as I have no experience of them), same farrier. We also moved yards and changed farrier.
Mare threw same shoe at the new yard, recently nailed back on by old farrier prior to move. New farrier came. He reported that all four shoes were different, the nails were too big, the shoes were too big, and the hoof with the repeatedly lost shoe was now tricky because some hoof had come away with the shoe.
There is no sign of hoof disease of any sort and he has suggested leaving the back shoes off for a cycle or two to let the horn grow so there is something more substantial to nail a shoe to!
This all makes sense to me, but I have never had a horse of this size and weight without hind shoes: 16.2hh and around 700kgs.
So, I need all the advice I can get please re her being unshod behind for the next few months, and also how a horse like her might manage barefoot all round or if that's a bad idea given her proportions.
Some things to note:
- this is the first time my daughter and her mare have lived away from home, so I've not been able to keep my eagle eye on things
- mare is on a diet and has lost a good amount of weight and is still going down in size(!), the old yard had rye grass which was an uphill battle
- she pulled her hock back in the winter in the awful mud, vet involved, was never unsound, full work-up after time off and exercise regime where she moved beautifully for the vet
- physio is coming out asap to check her over for me as she is due to be seen, anyway, and I wonder if she's a bit out of alignment what with the hock and bad shoeing
- we have access to two arenas, one Martin Collins and one rubber, plus grassy hacking re her barefoot phase
- rubber matting in stable

Thank you!
 
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nutjob

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My wb who weighs in at 650-700kg has never had back shoes. He has pretty large saucer sized flat feet. He was not shod at all for the first 3 years I had him but now has fronts on as he struggles on stony ground. I would prob take the backs off now if the farrier is recommending this and then the fronts in the winter when the ground is softer.
 

thommackintosh

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After years of being shod on all four, I bit the bullet with Harry (17.3hh ISH at 800kg) at the tail end of this winter when he lost both back shoes within a week of each other. He was grand for a few weeks, then quite footy for a month, and now his feet are in the best shape I've seen. I wish I'd done it years ago.
 

MystieMoo

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My wb who weighs in at 650-700kg has never had back shoes. He has pretty large saucer sized flat feet. He was not shod at all for the first 3 years I had him but now has fronts on as he struggles on stony ground. I would prob take the backs off now if the farrier is recommending this and then the fronts in the winter when the ground is softer.
Yes, I might well try this. Is it necessary to use hoof boots etc, at the start or at all? I've never had a potentially barefoot horse and she has huge feet. She's big to fit for anything!
 

MystieMoo

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After years of being shod on all four, I bit the bullet with Harry (17.3hh ISH at 800kg) at the tail end of this winter when he lost both back shoes within a week of each other. He was grand for a few weeks, then quite footy for a month, and now his feet are in the best shape I've seen. I wish I'd done it years ago.
This is the thing, I think I might end up feeling as you do. She has such good, strong feet apart from this recent issue. Good to know other big horses do fine!
 

nutjob

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Yes, I might well try this. Is it necessary to use hoof boots etc, at the start or at all? I've never had a potentially barefoot horse and she has huge feet. She's big to fit for anything!
Hoof boots are great for transitioning I have used them on another horse who was shod for several years without a break. My current horse has very wide feet and boots big enough to fit the width are too long! I'm not able to do enough walking on a smooth surface to help my horse as the roads are not safe for hacking where I am. If you can build up walking on tarmac or concrete she should improve. Give it a go, if it's not working go back to shoes.
 

IrishMilo

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The size of your horse has no bearing on how he'll fare barefoot. I've never had to shoe anything behind, aside from my current massive TB, and that's only because he wears the wall to a pulp on the lateral (outside) side of the foot. I wouldn't rush in to buy boots, see how he goes first. Most horses cope very well having hinds off.
 

MiJodsR2BlinkinTite

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My cob mare had awful white-line separation issues with one of her back feet; it got really bad and the then-farrier we had at that time ended up having to hack into her hoof and took away chunks of it, right up to within 1cm of her coronary band, so it was basically like a dorsal resection. Our vet at that time (now sadly retired) suggested that we transition to barefoot as he said basically how the hell are you gonna keep a shoe on that; also as he knew my mare from when she was a youngster and remembered her going barefoot then. So this is what we did. Off came the hind shoes. Then shortly after the front ones came off as well!! (not that I'm trying to persuade you to transition to barefoot or anything!).

With poor feet, improvement has to be from the inside-out; I found Equimins Hoof Mender was a brilliant supplement for mine and worked well.

Just a suggestion: and do with it what you will - but "The Barefoot Horse Owners Group UK" is an excellent place to lurk if you are after any sort of foot advice. It isn't just for people who are barefooting their horses, you will get some good advice there re. diet, management etc.

The other suggestion I would make is to change your farrier if you can; it doesn't sound like the one you have currently is doing your horse any favours. I'd get those back shoes off pronto; and use hoof boots. The Hoof Bootique will be able to offer you some excellent advice about suitable boots.
 

starbucker

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Not much to add but, thats such a shame to hear your horse wasn't being shoed properly, we trust these professionals to do right by our horses. My farrier is hinting my young horse may need shoes in future as she wears them down quicker than it grows apparently, heavyweight cob, not footsore so Im not putting them on unless she tells me shes struggling. another heavyweight cob on yard is fine barefoot competing at 90cm hardly needs trimming farrier takes one look and sends on way
 

AShetlandBitMeOnce

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Perhaps ask your farrier if he would be happy for you to use Keratex on the backs? It's a hoof hardener and may help protect against footiness, but I'm not sure if it affects regrowth so best to ask him first
 

MystieMoo

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Not much to add but, thats such a shame to hear your horse wasn't being shoed properly, we trust these professionals to do right by our horses. My farrier is hinting my young horse may need shoes in future as she wears them down quicker than it grows apparently, heavyweight cob, not footsore so Im not putting them on unless she tells me shes struggling. another heavyweight cob on yard is fine barefoot competing at 90cm hardly needs trimming farrier takes one look and sends on way
Oh, that's really reassuring re the competing cob as my daughter like to event at 80cm.
It's horrible when you've trusted someone, I'm trying not to be angry about it. We have such an amazing farrier at home, but my daughter & horse are away at university and it's too far for him to travel. It makes you a bit nervous after something like this, but the new farrier seems good - I'm reserving judgement for a bit!
I wouldn't blame you for keeping barefoot, I'm half worried and half eager to see how our girl goes.
 

MystieMoo

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My cob mare had awful white-line separation issues with one of her back feet; it got really bad and the then-farrier we had at that time ended up having to hack into her hoof and took away chunks of it, right up to within 1cm of her coronary band, so it was basically like a dorsal resection. Our vet at that time (now sadly retired) suggested that we transition to barefoot as he said basically how the hell are you gonna keep a shoe on that; also as he knew my mare from when she was a youngster and remembered her going barefoot then. So this is what we did. Off came the hind shoes. Then shortly after the front ones came off as well!! (not that I'm trying to persuade you to transition to barefoot or anything!).

With poor feet, improvement has to be from the inside-out; I found Equimins Hoof Mender was a brilliant supplement for mine and worked well.

Just a suggestion: and do with it what you will - but "The Barefoot Horse Owners Group UK" is an excellent place to lurk if you are after any sort of foot advice. It isn't just for people who are barefooting their horses, you will get some good advice there re. diet, management etc.

The other suggestion I would make is to change your farrier if you can; it doesn't sound like the one you have currently is doing your horse any favours. I'd get those back shoes off pronto; and use hoof boots. The Hoof Bootique will be able to offer you some excellent advice about suitable boots.
Thank you so much for taking time with a detailed reply. I'm so glad it worked out for your mare!

We do now have a new farrier and it's his suggestion to take the back shoes off, which he's doing today. I may well remove the fronts, too, if things progress well. I'll keep you posted!

I'll look up that supplement, now. I'm so disappointed because she's had amazing feet, still does, except for the mess the previous farrier made. But maybe this will lead to her being barefoot, which is a good thing.

🙂
 

MystieMoo

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The size of your horse has no bearing on how he'll fare barefoot. I've never had to shoe anything behind, aside from my current massive TB, and that's only because he wears the wall to a pulp on the lateral (outside) side of the foot. I wouldn't rush in to buy boots, see how he goes first. Most horses cope very well having hinds off.
Thank you. After the positive replies to my post, I'm actually cautiously looking forward to seeing how she does with everything crossed for those hind shoes, at least, to stay off.
 
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