Lymphangitis

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mickey

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Anyone else expereinced a horse with this? My horse has a swollen hind limb, vet has diagnosed it as lymphangitis. It's been there 10 days. Do you have any idea how long it will take to go back to normal? He is barely unsound on it now and seems quite happy but is still on 2 bute a day.
 
Presume you have reduced the feed, this can be caused by a diet too rich in protein, if he isn't lame can you lunge him gently to encourage the circulation if your vet ok's it? If he is on 2 bute though, this would mask any lameness, so defo check with vet first.
 
Yes, he has been on Alfa A, Alfa beet (recently as they have run out of fibre beet which he normally has) and pasture mix.
I have changed Alfa A to plain chaff as I know Alfa has a lot of protein, and as he is not working reduced pasture mix to 2/3 scoop. He has only been getting 1 scp pasture mix, 1 alfa A and 3/4 alfa beet or sugar beet, before this.
 
Unfortunately, over the past 4 years, I have become very experienced with Lymphangitis
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My mare has has recurrant bouts. some have been very severe, with the swelling right up the leg, the quarters and her udders. Its a very serious condition. At its worst,it can result in the skin being so stretched that it splits and oozes gunk, the hoof can come away entirely and ultimately they can need to be PTS - so not a condition to take lightly (I'm not suggesting you are by any means).

What happens is, they have a bout - usually due to some infection in the lymphatic system (runs beside arteries and blood vessels). This results in lymphatic fluid that removes toxins from the body being unable to function properly. Once a horse has had a bout, they are vulnerable to future bouts because perminant changes take place in the lymphatic system. With each bout more damage occurs (damage in worse according to how long the bout last for too). After several nasty bouts, the tissue in the leg is the consistency of velcro - like a sticky, spongey mass that can be torn apart and stuck together repeatedly, hence no efficient drainage can occur (according to my very good vet who has carried out post mortums on several horses that had the condition).

10 days is a long time for your horse's leg to be swollen when he is on 2 bute per day, so you really need to be getting more aggressive in his treatment. Has your vet seen him recently? If he saw him early on without follow up, he probably assumes that the leg has gone down by now. When it doesn't, it usually means there is some infection (assuming the horse has enough movement) and the big guns in antibiotics (Exanol) are often required. There are 3 aspects to treatment, anti-inflamatory meds (e.g. bute), sometimes/often antibiotics and movement. When the lymphatic system fails, the only way to move the fluid through is by muscle movement 'massaging' it down - hence movement. If your boy is too uncomfortable to be ridden in walk, or lunged, then walk him in hand several times a day for an hour each time (I've been there so I know its not fun!). Also as much turn out as possible is crucial. Even when you get past this you will need to be careful with management in case he has become vulnerable to it. I found through trial and error that my mare cannot stand in for more a a few hours in a standard stable and she lived out for the past couple of years. Tried her this year in a very large foaling box at night. All was fine for the first two weeks, Then she developed another bout of Lymphangitis a week ago. Fortunately, managed to get this one under control with Danilon and movement. she is back to a large barn at night and out by day. I may try her in the box again over night but coming in much later, but its too soon to decide as she has only just stopped the Danilon.

Sorry this has turned into an essay and I hope some of it helps.
 
Great advice there from Stella, and sorry that both of you have first hand experience with this godforsaken condition.

A horse at our yard got it this time last year. In his case it started as mud fever and escalated into lymphangitis. He was one of the cases where the skin stretched so much he oozed gunk - it was so painful and uncomfortable for him, even with lots of bute etc and heartbreaking to see. He had a very slight recurrence last year but - touch wood - has been fine since.

His owner isn't really turning him out at the moment to avoid the chances of mud fever and then the further complications. When he does go out she chooses a dry day and puts turnout boots on as a precaution.

Hope everything goes okay for your horse OP and glad that your mare is currently ok Stella.
 
I would be worried if his legs are still up after 10 days .Is he on antibiotics,mine was when he got it badly ,now any sign and he gets epsom salts and bran mash and hay no hard feed and legwraps on legs.Lots of walking if you can
 
We had a horse with it about 2 months ago, and it actually took about 4-5 weeks before the swelling had gone completely. It would come up over night, but go right down after 10min on the walker.
Our vet said this is quite normal, but we could treat it with steroid injections if it persisted much longer.
He was initially treated with IV bute and oxytetracyclene for 5 days, coldhosing and we also chucked him out 24/7 as his leg would come up much less that way, and he got some epsom salts everyday as well.
Are you exercising him?

ETS
Lymphangitis has nothing to do with feed, it's an infection in the lymphatic system, like one of the other posters said.
Too much protein can cause legs to fill up, but this is nothing to do with lymphangitis.
 
My mare has got this too...here is our experience.
Last Sunday she couldnt put weight on right hind...she had a couple of scabs of mudfever on hind feet since Thursday which we had cleaned etc...but on Sunday morning at 8.00am legs were puffy so YO decided to keep her in and keep an eye on her (she had waterlogged hind legs last summer - so wanted to make sure this wasnt the same) - my mare walked out as if fine to go out but 40 mins later could not put any wieght on right hind so vet was called out. He bandaged both legs, gave steroid injections, antibiotics and put her on two bute a day (she was very distressed - heavy breathing). Monday morning he came back out to check on her and leg was much more swollen and lymphangitis was decided on...whereby she then went on to stronger antibiotics and right leg bandaged nearly up to her stifle. She had swelling in teat and a couple of small fluid lumps on tummy but this is fluid and has to go where gravity will allow.
She was kept in as couldnt walk...but by Tuesday was on the way to getting better and could be walked out in hand for grass. We just had to keep her as dry as possible or she would carrying a very heavy bandage round!!!
Kept in touch with the vet and Friday he came out...leg had gone down...walking normally...so can now go out in one of the pens that my yard has for recup.
The vet was very pleased with her progress and he said about how quickly her swelling had gone down...he was pleased we had treated it quite aggressively so quickly.
She is now normally bandaged at night to help with swelling...but goes out in pen during the day..I take her for a walk for some grass too. She has now finished antibiotics but we have kept her on two bute a day so we can see if any changes may be affected by no more antibiotics.
I was told she would now have a tendency to this problem...and to act quickly if any cut or something occurs to that leg. I didnt realise it could cause quite such bad outcomes tho...
 
Thank you everyone for the information - Much appreciated.

In the case of my horse the condition came on suddenly. He was turned out am (all was normal - so the yard girls said) and a few hrs later when I went to get him in I spotted the issue. The swelling started around the cannon, then dropped to fetlock region as well and is now mostly around the hock although the cannon/fetlock/stifle is swollen too. The vet came out 13 days ago - Put him on antibiotics for a week, high dose of bute which has now been whittled down to 2/day. We cold hosed and bandaged for the first few days. Now the leg is still swollen, doesn't seem to be changing much. He is not at all uncomfortable on it - virtually sound.
My vet is very laid back about this - I have spoken to her at least every 2-3 days since the initial consultation, giving her detailed reports, and she is just saying it could take weeks to go down. When I asked if it may reoccur in the future she said she had seen 2 other cases recently, and they had not reoccurred since she saw then 2 yrs ago.
Do you think she should be doing more??? What could be done at this stage??
Thanks
 
Mickey, I haven't read this post fully but just wanted to make sure you've been given the advice to EXERCISE the horse, regularly. The limb needs as much movement as possible - heartbreaking if the horse is in pain but it is absolutely the best course of action. Lunging/long reining is preferable to riding IMO just as you don't have the additional weight of the rider, but one way of the other, keep the horse moving.
 
Hi Sal_E
Yup, he was in the first 2 days until we established no tendon/ligament damage. Since then he has been turned out for at least 6 hrs/day. I have done some long-reining and walking in hand. I have to say he does like to have a dash around the field and a good old buck for a few mins occasionally. I'm a bit concerned that may not be helping. But like I say it's just for a few minutes.
Thanks for your help!
 
My vet did tell me, when my mare could put weight on it and was obviously not in so much pain, I could walk her around all day if I wanted too...but nothing more than that ie. no trotting. The first two days she couldnt really walk anyway...

But I was told she cant go out until the few scabs from the mud fever (which seemed to have started all this) had come off and totally healed...otherwise it could be straight back to beginning again.
 
I don't want to cause any offence, but your Vet doesn't sound very experienced. Especially given that she stated she has seen two other cases - surely she wouldn't have said that if she had seen hundreds as many Vets have! I think I'd ring the practice and specifically request another Vet comes out to take a look just to be on the safe side!
 
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Thank you everyone for the information - Much appreciated.

In the case of my horse the condition came on suddenly. He was turned out am (all was normal - so the yard girls said) and a few hrs later when I went to get him in I spotted the issue. The swelling started around the cannon, then dropped to fetlock region as well and is now mostly around the hock although the cannon/fetlock/stifle is swollen too. The vet came out 13 days ago - Put him on antibiotics for a week, high dose of bute which has now been whittled down to 2/day. We cold hosed and bandaged for the first few days. Now the leg is still swollen, doesn't seem to be changing much. He is not at all uncomfortable on it - virtually sound.
My vet is very laid back about this - I have spoken to her at least every 2-3 days since the initial consultation, giving her detailed reports, and she is just saying it could take weeks to go down. When I asked if it may reoccur in the future she said she had seen 2 other cases recently, and they had not reoccurred since she saw then 2 yrs ago.
Do you think she should be doing more??? What could be done at this stage??
Thanks

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That's pretty much the advice our vet gave us, and she's one of the best horse vets in our area.
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Ours also went from being fine in the morning to being hopping lame, blowing, sweating and the leg being swollen from stifle to coronet band in the space of about 4 hours.
Do you have the option of keeping him out 24/7 for a couple of weeks?
That's what we did with ours for a few weeks, and it stopped the swelling from coming up from being stood in.
 
I don't think 24 hr turnout would be an option. He would go beserk..........when the others went in.
As it is, during the daytime he is apparently stood like a field ornament which isn't much help. I have thus been walking him in hand as well!
 
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I don't think 24 hr turnout would be an option. He would go beserk..........when the others went in.
As it is, during the daytime he is apparently stood like a field ornament which isn't much help. I have thus been walking him in hand as well!

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That's a shame as it's really the best thing for it.
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You could also gently massage the leg, and cold hosing several times a day will also help.
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Are you giving him epsom salts in his feed, as that will help remove the waste from the lymph vessels as well?
 
My mare had this condition in the summer, i put her on to lymph blend from Global herbs as i found the swelling was taking along time to go, its brilliant her leg was back to normal within a couple of days after.
 
My mare had this 9 years ago. With a combination of bute, anti biotics, gentle walking and cold water hosing it cleared up in about 2 weeks but was left with a huge abcess on the inside of the leg. She how has a permenantly thick lower leg but has never been lame since on it. Its really important to keep them moving whislt they have this condition.
 
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My vet is very laid back about this - I have spoken to her at least every 2-3 days since the initial consultation, giving her detailed reports, and she is just saying it could take weeks to go down.

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Laid back is a very kind way of putting it, I'd sack her. This is a VERY serious condition and possibly life threatening. Immediate use of diuretics should be administered along with bute for the pain and antibiotics for the infection. If your vet isn't treating with diuretics sack her and find a vet who is more up to date.

I may sound rather harsh, but after using a similarly incompetent vet I ended up with a mare with a leg like an elephant's which was ulcerated from coronary band to hock, never returning to normal. Don't allow this to happen to you. These diuretics will reduce the leg to normal in about 24 hours, I have witnessed this. The ongoing swelling and consequent pain is unnecessary.

I wish your horse a speedy recovery.
 
I have to say that my Vet has only used Durectics on occasion because they also have side effects, so its a cost benefit issue. Steroids are also sometimes used, but they can trigger Laminitus. My Vet was very attentive however, intially seeing her every day until she started to respond to treatment, then every few days, then leaving it a week etc. Thankfully, even at her worst, Flora responded to treatment, with a reduction in swelling and a happier mare within days. The bad bouts have taken weeks for the swelling to go right down and even then, she always had a thicker leg until she started living out.
 
QR: Thanks for all the helpful advice.
My horse's leg is still a bit swollen. My vet has told me to commence ridden work at a walk. I was rather alarmed to hear from her that his leg could be a little swollen forever.......
But it does seem to go away after 10mins walking exercise.
 
People, i really need your help! quick question before i tell the story...can lymphangitis occurr in all 4 legs?

right, from the start.

My friend has a horse who went to a p2p yard in october. at the end of december she had a call saying her horse was unwell ,and had swollen joints. She agreed it was best to rest him as it sounded as though he was being worked too hard from what the trainer told her. They had the vet, who apparently concluded there was nothing they could think of that would cause this. The triner then suggested cancer (seems silly i know).

She decided this week to bring him home, despite the possibility of him not making the journey his condition is so severe. He arrived this morning, and its not a pretty sight. He can barely support his own weight, let alone walk. The hocks and knees of all 4 legs are around the size of a football, he really is suffering. He has no condition on form refusing to eat for weeks.

The vet is coming tomorrow, but any experiences people may have of similar situations would be very much appreciated. My first thought on seeing him was lymphangitis in a very advanced stage, apparently his joints have just got bigger and bigger as time has gone by. There are no cuts on him, though.

Thanks everyone!
 
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