Manchester Police get tough

Pale Rider

Pale Rider

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I don't know what folks opinion of this video is, personally, I'm all for the Police dishing out some stick to people like this.

However, I suspect the Complaints Department and the CPS will spend a fortune trying to sack and convict the officers involved here.

The Police can only get tough when they are not undermined by the system, but some may feel that they don't agree with the Police being allowed to dish this sort of treatment. You just cannot have it both ways.
 
I'm not too sure what I feel about that. Where the police looking for those teenagers? Not sure about the story behind it.
I really think the police need to be tougher but I think I mean in the sense of thougher punishments.
 
You're right, people ask for tougher policing.
The police demonstrate this by shooting dead an armed drug dealer.
This sparks riots, which means the police mete out tough treatment.

And so the circle is complete!
 
In this instance the Police have my total support. i hope the IPC etc., acknowledge the public support in this case.
 
mtj said:
In this instance the Police have my total support. i hope the IPC etc., acknowledge the public support in this case.
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Couldn't agree more and if the police didn't have their arms tied behind their back which has happened since the soft seventies/eighties, then we wouldn't be in this trouble.
You'll all laugh at this but this is the type of behaviour that us oldies were afraid would happen as soon as they took discipline away from the classroom and the police. For once 'progress' as people called it has done us no favours at all and now the chickens are coming home to roost; I hope the human rights lot are happy because they are just as responsible as anyone.
 
I could have cheered when I saw that clip on the news, and although I am an old fogey my daughter who is 23 agreed with me. In the same news item there was a mother defending the looters, with her obnoxious child standing next to her giving the reporter and another adult lip. If that had been my son he would have had a clip round the ear. :mad:
 
Tough Policing needs to be backed up by tougher punishments - the punishments are handed out by the CPS And the judicary whicha re seperate entities from the Police and they aslo appear to live on a different planet from the rest of us:rolleyes:

As for the Police - well they are damned if they do and damned if they don't :o I think in view of the provocation they take from the scumbags out there in these situations I am surprised we haven't seen more of this and frankly it shows remarkable restraint on behalf of our Police. Their behaviour has of course been modified over the last 30 years by politics of all colours, the EU Human rights, the judiciary and the CPS.
 
Good on them. There is only one language people like this understand and something needed to be done to stop the rioting and looting. I hope Cameron sticks by what he said yesterday and backs up the Police this time.

Did anyone see that woman on the news last night with her kids, standing outside a shop saying that the reason kids are rioting/looting is because they have nothing and they see people with everything? I was gob smacked. I drove through Alderley Edge recently and saw all of those huge houses belonging to footballers etc - they have things I don't but that wouldn't make it right for me to break in and take those things. When did our society go so wrong that people now think it's OK to just take what they want instead of working to better themselves and improve their standard of life?
 
Notice how the camerman only shows the police line that the scumbags attacked before the "filming" for 5 seconds at the end? Still I guess that would have spoilt the storyline if you saw it first?

Nothing quite like half a story making the news :rolleyes:
 
chestnut cob said:
Good on them. There is only one language people like this understand and something needed to be done to stop the rioting and looting. I hope Cameron sticks by what he said yesterday and backs up the Police this time.

Did anyone see that woman on the news last night with her kids, standing outside a shop saying that the reason kids are rioting/looting is because they have nothing and they see people with everything? I was gob smacked. I drove through Alderley Edge recently and saw all of those huge houses belonging to footballers etc - they have things I don't but that wouldn't make it right for me to break in and take those things. When did our society go so wrong that people now think it's OK to just take what they want instead of working to better themselves and improve their standard of life?
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I used to work in a posh house in Alderley Edge looking after children (before it became WAG city), of course I was envious of everything they had, including their ponies, but I didn't fill my pockets before I came home! Oh and if you drive through Alderley Edge again Chestnut Cob stop and look in the charity shops, amazing stuff in there. :D
 
MurphysMinder said:
I used to work in a posh house in Alderley Edge looking after children (before it became WAG city), of course I was envious of everything they had, including their ponies, but I didn't fill my pockets before I came home! Oh and if you drive through Alderley Edge again Chestnut Cob stop and look in the charity shops, amazing stuff in there. :D
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Ooo OK will stop and have a nose next time. Thanks for the tip! :D
 
Finally, sensible directions have been handed down to serving officers. Spot on.

If the IPC take any punitive action against those officers, or any others for that matter, then there will be further public outrage, I hope.

Total support.

Alec.
 
To be honest I think parents should get the jail sentence their child should have got [only it was under-age], and they should be forced to share the sentence with their own child, believe me those kids would soon start to behave.

If they can't control their children, why did they have them? I realise there are exceptions, but most kids follow their parents when it comes to attitude and behaviour.

Proper parents would not be out on the streets when riots are going on.
 
I saw a TV interview with the g/friend of the man who was shot, she said "he was not a gang member", what does that mean? .......... he was a self employed person who carries a gun in the pursuit of his trade or profession.
I don't know all the ins and outs, but if people carry guns, then hell mend them, they are criminals and if they get shot and killed, then they are getting their just deserts.

I don't think the police should hit teenagers with sticks unless in self defence, it just re-enforces the violence culture, lock them up in a bare cell, then put them in jail for six months, just make sure they get no TV or Mobile phones or any other consumer goods. No communications with loved ones unless by letter, let them learn a trade, or sit in a cell on their own all day.
 
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MrsD123 said:
I saw a TV interview with the g/friend of the man who was shot, she said "he was not a gang member", what does that mean? .......... he was a self employed person who carries a gun in the pursuit of his trade or profession.
I don't know all the ins and outs, but if people carry guns, then hell mend them, they are criminals and if they get shot and killed, then they are getting their just deserts.
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She also said he had never been in prison - only ever been on remand:rolleyes:

I doubt the Police involved in Operation Trident would be wasting their resources on someone who had an unblemished record:o
 
slinkyunicorn said:
Tough Policing needs to be backed up by tougher punishments - the punishments are handed out by the CPS And the judicary whicha re seperate entities from the Police and they aslo appear to live on a different planet from the rest of us:rolleyes:

As for the Police - well they are damned if they do and damned if they don't :o I think in view of the provocation they take from the scumbags out there in these situations I am surprised we haven't seen more of this and frankly it shows remarkable restraint on behalf of our Police. Their behaviour has of course been modified over the last 30 years by politics of all colours, the EU Human rights, the judiciary and the CPS.
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I couldn't agree more.
I think the police should be congradulated on their restraint so far. I would have beaten 7 bells out of anyone I came across :mad: :o
They are stuck between a rock and a hard place.
Don't use force, yelled at for "not doing enough".
Use force, be liable for those who they use force against (even if the thug deserved it!) and possibily cause more uproar over it!
They have a difficult job, rather them then me.
 
Be careful what you wish for in regard to demanding the police get tough. I have just seen a very disturbing account of a 16 year old girl being beaten to the ground in Tottenham by a line of policemen with their batons. It doesn't make comfortable viewing.
Neither does the clip of a group of police dragging a teenager off his bike and all of them beating and kicking him. He was not arrested, nor was another teenager further down the road who was repestedly kicked by police while on the ground. He was not arrested either.

I want tough action taken by the police, but I want it to be professional, not thuggery. Unprofessional behaviour just increases bad feeling.
Yes, these officers are on the front line, but so was my husband during the prision riots a few years back. I speak from personal experience. The test of integrity and professionalism is not when everything is rosy, its when the s*** hits the fan.
 
And then the Met police whinge because one of their own gets taken to court for hitting an innocent man as he walks by, minding his own, and try to compare that to the thuggish behaviour seen over the last few days and the reactions needed but not acted upon.

This country has gone mad.
 
MrsD123 said:
To be honest I think parents should get the jail sentence their child should have got [only it was under-age], and they should be forced to share the sentence with their own child, believe me those kids would soon start to behave.

If they can't control their children, why did they have them? I realise there are exceptions, but most kids follow their parents when it comes to attitude and behaviour.

Proper parents would not be out on the streets when riots are going on.
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You can't blame this all on kids. Yes parents should know where their 8, 9 and 10 year old (eg) kids are but most of those you saw on the news were adults... people who should know better. My local news is Midlands Today and yesterday they interviewed a man on the street (I think in Birmingham but might have been West Brom, somewhere like that) who said he encouraged the rioting...said it was to pay back the "*******ing Polish coming to our country and taking our jobs". It's truly dreadful - one sector of our society has gone very wrong.

What should be done about it?! I know that looting and rioting is wrong but I do feel we need to look at the bigger picture. Where did things go so wrong that we have an entire section of society who genuinely don't care if they go to prison for this because they have no respect for the law or other people? Cameron will use this as another excuse to blame the poor for the world's ills but he won't try to resolve the problems, just put people in jail.
 
chestnut cob said:
You can't blame this all on kids. Yes parents should know where their 8, 9 and 10 year old (eg) kids are but most of those you saw on the news were adults... people who should know better. My local news is Midlands Today and yesterday they interviewed a man on the street (I think in Birmingham but might have been West Brom, somewhere like that) who said he encouraged the rioting...said it was to pay back the "*******ing Polish coming to our country and taking our jobs". It's truly dreadful - one sector of our society has gone very wrong.

What should be done about it?! I know that looting and rioting is wrong but I do feel we need to look at the bigger picture. Where did things go so wrong that we have an entire section of society who genuinely don't care if they go to prison for this because they have no respect for the law or other people? Cameron will use this as another excuse to blame the poor for the world's ills but he won't try to resolve the problems, just put people in jail.
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I don't think our society has gone wrong, it's always been wrong. People now blame the Poles, but we started with the Irish, then the blacks then the asians. Whichever the current immigrant group come in are subjected to some prejudice, but this is not the cause of the current dis order in my view.

This is people who see mass rioting and looting against a background of austerity, job cuts and rising prices, as legitamate, which of course it is not. This added to the perception that the Police are unwilling or unable to provide a robust response, which they are because of the mounting criticism they get for the degree of violence they use or the tactics, no one liked being kettled, but it works.
 
chestnut cob said:
You can't blame this all on kids. Yes parents should know where their 8, 9 and 10 year old (eg) kids are but most of those you saw on the news were adults... people who should know better. My local news is Midlands Today and yesterday they interviewed a man on the street (I think in Birmingham but might have been West Brom, somewhere like that) who said he encouraged the rioting...said it was to pay back the "*******ing Polish coming to our country and taking our jobs". It's truly dreadful - one sector of our society has gone very wrong.

What should be done about it?! I know that looting and rioting is wrong but I do feel we need to look at the bigger picture. Where did things go so wrong that we have an entire section of society who genuinely don't care if they go to prison for this because they have no respect for the law or other people? Cameron will use this as another excuse to blame the poor for the world's ills but he won't try to resolve the problems, just put people in jail.
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Well the rioters are taking the opportunity to break the law because of "safety in numbers"
obviously alcohol and probably drugs have helped them overcome their normal behaviour, but to be honest they are not thinking ahead, if kids are living at home, then their parents are still responsible for them, to a greater or lesser degree.
Just a small example for you to think about: I had to go and get some goods that had been stolen by a boy [16 - 18], at the stables recently, his father just said " I don't know anything about it!" as he handed them over.
Well if my son came home with goods that did not belong to him, I would soon know something about it.
By the way, the boy complained that I spoke to him as though he was a thief !!!!!!
He was really upset that the YO told me where he lived too!
He is now "working" at the local riding school, where they " give lessons" in return for "work"
Not sure about the legality of that!
 
I cheered when I saw this footage, but I don't think releasing it will be helpful in the long run.

Re people being caught up when the police go in hard Horserider - if you're in that general area, you're asked to move and you don't, when the police are forming lines, then you may very well get a duffing, I say that as someone who has observed civil unrest and stood closer to the rioters than the cops, I've had a couple of near misses, it's been my choice to stand where I stood and if I get hurt by a cop or by anyone else (how do they know who I am or what my intentions are? how do they know I don't have a knife or something up my sleever?) then it will be my responsibility.
 
CaveCanem said:
it's been my choice to stand where I stood and if I get hurt by a cop or by anyone else (how do they know who I am or what my intentions are? how do they know I don't have a knife or something up my sleever?) then it will be my responsibility.
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This is exactly how I see it. It would be pretty easy not to get duffed up by the police, don't go out and join in the middle of a riot! If you do riot/stand in a riot, that, to me, forsakes any rite to moan or blame the police if you get hurt by them or anyone else.

Thank you to the Greater Manchester Police Force from me.
 
As far as these particular youths are concerned, they are typical of the groups that cycle round Manchester every night of the week, looking for vulnerable people to rob, abuse and intimidate. Very difficult to catch or identify, and never do enough to get arrested when the Police are about. This beating is probably long over due, but it will not solve the problem of ferral youths destroying the quality of life for law abiding ordinary folk in the long run.

In mass disorder situations, as we have seen recently, surely anyone on the streets is part of the whole. No sane person would want to just stand about watching. In situations like this people should be warned to clear the streets, and if they don't then the Police should be free to clear the streets with as much force as is required. If people get hurt, no matter how badly, then it is unfortunate but acceptable, with no come backs on the Police.

If we are serious about protecting the ordinary folk and their property, you cannot do it being soft on the types who riot, loot and set fires.
 
Flame_ said:
This is exactly how I see it. It would be pretty easy not to get duffed up by the police, don't go out and join in the middle of a riot! If you do riot/stand in a riot, that, to me, forsakes any rite to moan or blame the police if you get hurt by them or anyone else.

Thank you to the Greater Manchester Police Force from me.
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In fairness I've been pretty lucky, missed a half brick or two and an exploding sideboard (the police ran their wagon right over it, it had been used as a barricade!) but one colleague got hit by a bit of a blast bomb a few years ago.
I hate to say it but you're safer standing with the rioters, what does that tell you.....

But it does piss me off - like I say, if you're in an area where you are told to leave, don't complain when it kicks off. And dog bites. You're told 'don't move, don't come forward, don't raise your arm' - CHOMP - ow, the nasty dog bit me.....I'm gonna sue...oh shut UP!

(No idea what a 'sleever' is, apologies :o)
 
I don't like violence. But in this instance I support them.

I look at it this way. I know I would never be beaten like that by them as I am a law abiding citizen. If you break the law and take part in absolute disgusting behaviour as they did, then you have to accept the consequences. In this case, a beating with a baton and a prison sentence hopefully.

If police were allowed to give these yobs a slap as routine if they step out of line, without fear of being sued etc, they may be a bit more controlable. Maybe not the right way of looking at it, but these youths/people are out of control.
 
Watched a prog called "Coppers" the other night,it was about how the Police work riots and demo`s.I found ,in the main scenes, the pure hatred in the BNP and another similar group against a muslim crowd absolutely horrible. Then I remembered,seen it before in archive Nazi films taken before the War.
Tough,very tough..plastic bulets and water cannons are too good for these morons.
 
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