Mare Aggression

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Ceriann

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I keep three mares out 24/7 (currently strip grazing but they have good quality grazing). One is my retired 20 year old IDxTB who is a big older girl and very much used to being the top dog. Despite her status she has always been a failry gentle leader, using her mass to have things first as opposed to aggression. She was devoted to her long term field companion who i had to have PTS last year. I now keep her with my 5 year old IDxTB who has alwasy seemingly accepted my older mares status, allowing her to go first, steal her food etc (though never done aggressively) and a 5 year old coloured cob mare, who is very much at the bottom of the pecking order (being the smallest and the last to join the group).

My 5 year old IDxTB has from day one bullied the coloured mare (the latter came to us 3 months ago) and will pursue her with teeth showing etc. It tends to be more posturing although there has been the odd sign of a bite (superficial) and the smaller one will stand up for herself if pushed. She has now however started to clash with my older mare - in the last week or so. My older mare had scuff marks on her backside and hind legs - superficial skin scrapes but scrapes nonetheless. I have also witnessed a back end clash between the two of them and whilst its a one off kick, its my older mare who is coming off the worst, with additional scrapes. Neither are shod at the back and to date the clashes have been limited and havent caused any real damage but my older mare is now v wary of the 5 year old, seems jumpy and generally ill at ease. The pack of three in fact all appear less settled as a consequence.

Whilst the coloured cob is quick and nimble and has learnt whats needed to keep herself safe from my stroppy mare, my older girl isnt so quick and i hate to think of her being bullied (she's a lovely old mare who deserves to enjoy her retirement in peace).

Is this a fight for top dog status and if so will it calm down once status is sorted? It could be seasonal strops but theyve been together for 9 months and ive never seen this before. My previous mares have always rubbed along well with little friction. I am at the point where i feel i need to separate them but having three, one will need to be alone (which will cause its own issues). Any experiecnes/thoughts appreciated.
 
my mare was on her own for a short while, then got joined by another mare. i chatted to the owner before she arrived and she said that her mare was always the dominant mare in the past. she arrived and straight away it was definitely my mare who was the boss- the other mare was 17 so whether she had decided to retire from being the boss i don't know! (mine was 8 at the time).
mine are now in a mixed herd, there used to be a very dominant mare who was horrible to everything, although mostly chased, not many injuries. when she moved my girl took over being boss, but she literally pulls faces, that's it! we had a new mare arrive in may, and she has slowly got more and more grumpy! and she is now bossing my mare around, along with the other 10 horses! so i think in time dynamics change. things have started to calm down now, but the past month she has been not very friendly shall we say!
the older horses definitely get picked on more, i think she picks on the weaker basically, as when she first arrived we tried to add one at a time in a separate paddock with her, i puts my friends 21 yo who is very stiff, in with her and she immediately started reverse kicking towards him. quickly separated and put in a younger chunky gelding and she was fine with him.
i would give it a bit of time as it would probably calm down soon, but if not you may have to consider separating them so your old girl gets some piece!
 
I have three mares: a 40 yr old and a 19 yr old who have lived together for over 10 yrs and a 3 yr old who is the daughter of the 19yr old.

The 19 yr old is the boss and always will be, wherever she is!

Recently there have been a few instances of flare ups, where the 19yr old was intent on killing (i am not exaggerating) the 40 yr old, and keeping her as far away from the youngster as possible. They were separated for a while and then put back together when things settled down. Things have begun to get a bit strained again lately and I am keeping an eye on it, but think it is linked with one of them being in season, triggering the evil oap bashing.

my advice would be to separate until things settle and keep an eye out for changes in the grass or mares coming into season triggering the bullying again. that seems to be the way of it with mine at the moment. Mares.

Good luck. xx
 
pippixox said:
my mare was on her own for a short while, then got joined by another mare. i chatted to the owner before she arrived and she said that her mare was always the dominant mare in the past. she arrived and straight away it was definitely my mare who was the boss- the other mare was 17 so whether she had decided to retire from being the boss i don't know! (mine was 8 at the time).
mine are now in a mixed herd, there used to be a very dominant mare who was horrible to everything, although mostly chased, not many injuries. when she moved my girl took over being boss, but she literally pulls faces, that's it! we had a new mare arrive in may, and she has slowly got more and more grumpy! and she is now bossing my mare around, along with the other 10 horses! so i think in time dynamics change. things have started to calm down now, but the past month she has been not very friendly shall we say!
the older horses definitely get picked on more, i think she picks on the weaker basically, as when she first arrived we tried to add one at a time in a separate paddock with her, i puts my friends 21 yo who is very stiff, in with her and she immediately started reverse kicking towards him. quickly separated and put in a younger chunky gelding and she was fine with him.
i would give it a bit of time as it would probably calm down soon, but if not you may have to consider separating them so your old girl gets some piece!
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Thanks. I suspect it is just things changing. My old girl is still a formidable size and whilst not nimble or as sprightly she will shift if she has to and is clearly trying to stand her ground (hence the clashes). If it doesnt stop or my older mare starts to look more unhappy i will separate.
 
Clover increases oestrogen in mares and cause this kind of behaviour- she's at a trying age an mixing that with the clover (possibly, might not be) it might be making her feel a little bigger than she should be and more aggressive. If possible are you able to section her off on her own or get her off the clover? I think (from my own experience) when you get a mare like this they need there own space so they don't fret about dominating everything and helps discipline them. - Its only a guess though from my knowledge on clover and previous experiences. xx
 
whisp&willow said:
I have three mares: a 40 yr old and a 19 yr old who have lived together for over 10 yrs and a 3 yr old who is the daughter of the 19yr old.

The 19 yr old is the boss and always will be, wherever she is!

Recently there have been a few instances of flare ups, where the 19yr old was intent on killing (i am not exaggerating) the 40 yr old, and keeping her as far away from the youngster as possible. They were separated for a while and then put back together when things settled down. Things have begun to get a bit strained again lately and I am keeping an eye on it, but think it is linked with one of them being in season, triggering the evil oap bashing.

my advice would be to separate until things settle and keep an eye out for changes in the grass or mares coming into season triggering the bullying again. that seems to be the way of it with mine at the moment. Mares.

Good luck. xx
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Wow - 40, that's impressive! It could well be seasonal, my grumpy mare is definitely more evil when in season. She is also the only one i ride and therefore the one that oridnarily gets the lions share of attention, which may or may not be making it worse (my old mare used to be my riding horse and was always no1 for attention).
 
amymay said:
How much space do they actually have?
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They are on 4 and a half acre field, which is effectively divided into two fields by hedging (with clear sections in places so the two sides do in places blend). They have access to half of one side which is quite sparse on grass (an acre and a bit) and a third of the other field (where we are doing the strip grazing) with good grazing (just under an acre). The two sections are open to each other so there's plenty of room for them but they do (as expected) tend to always be on the good grazing.
 
Our three boys have started this. My lad is 9, and a very dominant herd leader. Then there's a 14 yo and a 5 yo. The 5yo used to be bottom of the pack, very submissive, but recently he's started standing up to my lad when he tried to push him round - they have been going at it like stallions, rearing up, clashing legs and biting withers. But I tried individual turnout for my boy over the summer and he got anxious and depressed, calling to his 'friend' all the time. They also shout to each other when we take them out to pony club together. Have just stopped rugging for a while to avoid tips while they sort it out, and are keeping an eye on the lumps and bumps. That's horses, they're like kids - they're going to go through patches where they don't get on...
 
Ceriann said:
Wow - 40, that's impressive! It could well be seasonal, my grumpy mare is definitely more evil when in season. She is also the only one i ride and therefore the one that oridnarily gets the lions share of attention, which may or may not be making it worse (my old mare used to be my riding horse and was always no1 for attention).
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Yes, Tego is very special! ;) Whisper (the dominant 19yr old!) Is the only one in ridden work, but I don't think its anything to do with attention- the oldie gets fed every day and the youngster handles/groundwork etc so they all get about the same amount of individual attention.

She does however need to be caught first, fed first etc to avoid fighting, but that is normal in any herd situation.

The aggression has only started this year, with a hint of it last year while at a friend's place: she went into a large mixed herd and singled out one mare who she took a shine to and kept away from everyone else (god help anyone who came too close!). poor mare hardly ate for days as she was always being herded away from the other horses by my mare!

She has always been a very dominant mare, and would take over top dog position in any established herd she joined. makes for an easy life for me: can feed in field without fear of being bullied off bucket, and no problems getting in or out of gates etc. But now that this has started in her own close group of field mates it is troublesome. Mostly as she is so evil with it and Tego is far too old to be being chased and battered!

So far, as I say, it seems to start up and then one comes into season, so i think this is the root of the cause... that and the fact that she is clearly a stallion trapped in a mares body, growing old disgracefully...
 
whisp&willow said:
Yes, Tego is very special! ;) Whisper (the dominant 19yr old!) Is the only one in ridden work, but I don't think its anything to do with attention- the oldie gets fed every day and the youngster handles/groundwork etc so they all get about the same amount of individual attention.

She does however need to be caught first, fed first etc to avoid fighting, but that is normal in any herd situation.

The aggression has only started this year, with a hint of it last year while at a friend's place: she went into a large mixed herd and singled out one mare who she took a shine to and kept away from everyone else (god help anyone who came too close!). poor mare hardly ate for days as she was always being herded away from the other horses by my mare!

She has always been a very dominant mare, and would take over top dog position in any established herd she joined. makes for an easy life for me: can feed in field without fear of being bullied off bucket, and no problems getting in or out of gates etc. But now that this has started in her own close group of field mates it is troublesome. Mostly as she is so evil with it and Tego is far too old to be being chased and battered!

So far, as I say, it seems to start up and then one comes into season, so i think this is the root of the cause... that and the fact that she is clearly a stallion trapped in a mares body, growing old disgracefully...
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Ive moved them by the house to keep an eye on them. We had our first kick off with us with them in the field tonight when we went to catch them. Scared the life out of the OH but no real clash just a lot of noise and face making. I caught grumpy and she was good as gold. Lots of excitement in the new field (its their favourite paddock) and they've settled so we will see. If it doesn't stop there then I will have to separate them!

What you say re seasons makes sense but its the first time they've been like this. Could be a combination of factors I guess.
 
I have a mare like this (and interestingly lots of clover). Doesn't matter how much grass or room she has, I've witnessed her chasing my bigger mare round until she has her cornered then kicking lumps put of her. Big mare isn't interested in her at all yet aggressive little rat bag goes bananas if you take the other mare out. Little one is on a diet currently so on her own and life is a lot easier. She can still groom the other one over the gate but not harass her.
 
FfionWinnie said:
I have a mare like this (and interestingly lots of clover). Doesn't matter how much grass or room she has, I've witnessed her chasing my bigger mare round until she has her cornered then kicking lumps put of her. Big mare isn't interested in her at all yet aggressive little rat bag goes bananas if you take the other mare out. Little one is on a diet currently so on her own and life is a lot easier. She can still groom the other one over the gate but not harass her.
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Both my other mares pine for grump when I take her out, especially the little coloured mare and she's the one that gets the real bullying! They are funny things! All three seem more relaxed in the new field so they can stay there for a while and see if they can settle. The two that have been clashing have been fairly glued to each other (though that has always been the case). My older mare did let grump have her food first today though (and if I think about it she hasn't nicked the end of grumps food for a while) - so it seems she's letting top spot go.
 
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