misbehaving horse? Advice/help?

Hormonal Filly

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Hi.. I'm new to this and have just created this account!

I need some advice.. well, misbehaving
I'm 18, I go to sixth form aswell as working 2 jobs to afford my own horse because my parents do not support me. And the horse.. I own Fleur, Shes a 14.2 9yr old fine Tb x Appaloosa.. shes a kind of strange blue roan/brown roan colour! I've owned her a year in may. She didn't have the best start in life and was saved from the meat man, when I got her she hadn't been ridden since she was 4 and had a few minuet back problem.

I have found out a few things from her past, her first owner was a crazy lady (who was taking her to the meat man) many people have told me she should have never had horses. Apparently she was much to heavy for Fleur, and even though being told so, still continued to get on her as a 3yr old, her 'ride' was a 5 minute block around a house. She continually got thrown off and when Fleur messed around (she bucked and reared) She jumped off and un tacked her.Her first owner also didn't agree with saddle checks and sizing so I guess that was totally incorrect.
She continued to keep her as a companion until she was 9, when she decided to shoot her other horse and take the other to the meat man.

A year on, with hundreds spent on physios and massages, she's been bought back into work slowly with me and since, has been doing some basic show jumping, enjoys her pleasure rides (she's very quick when racing) and even some cross country.
She's ridden in a Pelham, purely because she was so fussy with every bit, I cant think of one I haven't tried! The pelham was a bit she relaxed in more, and in any snaffle, when I re-backed her in a myler snaffle and took her out on any ride I had no breaks, even once I schooled her... the difference to her in the arena and in a field is unbelievable. Mainly because she is so strong and when in a field, wants to go go go (even though shes always walked fields, trotted, cantered and maybe galloped) Even in a Pelham my control is minuet.. I think her breeding, many ex race horses, she's just a wizzy pony.
She is awkward horse. But shes been given the all clear from many different types of physios and my vet thinks its behaviour.

She will hack out perfectly on roads, on her own or in company and is completely perfect with any car, rubbish lorry, bags flying, arctic lorries and whatever else you find on the roads!
In fields she gets wound up and strong, even when we are walking she is trotting side ways and if I stop her, she will rear up (shes gone over backwards with me) I think its excitement for maybe having a gallop, but as I said she's never gone in a field and galloped shes been taught to walk, trot and canter and even to walk fields. When I do take her for a gallop she will reach her neck down, go and I've tried dropping the reins, sponging.. control is minimal.
When schooling she has improved hugely, she will go in a outline in a happy mouth straight bar hanging cheek and does try her best.

But her one problem that drives me insane!
((Oh and shes had her back/teeth/saddle checked very recently and all is okay))
she always reaches down and pulls the reins out my hand.. I have dropped the reins, and she does do it less, but still does it. I even tried changing bits, and she will do it in any bit ridden in. Every so often, she also chucks her head up, and I've again dropped the reins and she still continues to do it. She does it more when excited, on a funride mainly she will continually do it whereas on a hack every so often. I'm not sure if its a habit or I'm doing something wrong, but she will continues to do it with my Olympic standard instructor and friends.
I have heard, stick a running martingale on her - I have done that and she will fight against it, which makes it worse.
She is lunged in a pessoa 2 times a week, and has the correct muscles to learn right to the floor and work well.

Why could she be doing this head business?
I've heard its from lack of respect, and this doesn't surprise me because you need to be strict with her for her to listen because she's very high in her herd, and a kind of 'oh no ill do this, I don't want to do that'

Please no bitchiness.. :)

Thanks!
And Yes, She has had her teeth done and have been told they're fine, her back has been checked by a handfuls of physios and specialists and her saddle was new from a master saddler, and checked only a few weeks ago.
 
My mare was a flipping nightmare for snatching the reins out of my hands. She would do it constantly when excited and jog sideways at the same time.
Bit wise mine was better in an eggbutt thick hollow mouth snaffle but she wasn't strong at all. I put a standing martingale on her to stop her from flinging her head up too high and this helped to teach her not to do it as much and as it's attached to the noseband it doesn't hurt their mouths.
Mine too was given the all clear in back and mouth ect, it was her way of releasing tension when excited.
She got better as she got older and better schooled. She could pull put a decent 70% dressage test but if we did loose marks it was for inconsistent contact. I had to ride her with a very black and white contact, very secure and she liked that.
She was loads better at the end but would revert back in exciting situationslike sponsored rides or hunting, it was irritating as hell but it was just her and her way of expressing herself. She was a fizzy wizzy let's get busy girl :)
 
Ah yeah, sounds the same as mine! She also does it constantly when excited and jogs sideways! It drives me mad, because she is so wizzy and constantly wants to go, hates standing still! Yes, I ride fleur very black and white.. very straight to the point, and she has got use to that and has improved in the last year.
I have tried a standing martingale, but she must of enjoyed pulling against it and tried to do it more. I may try it to school though as shes much better in the arena.

Thanks for your reply and advice :)
 
Yes im ordering a hackamore and going to try that on my bridle, because they're only £15 where as a bitless bridle is £40/50. However I want to attempt dressage as she can move amazing when she tries, and I can not do that in a bitless bridle or a hackamore.
Thank you!

Yes I have, I have lessons with a brilliant dressage rider. She has told me to try and ride through it, and to possibly stick a standing martingale on her however I do not want to mask the problem or possibly make it worse. I've heard it may be a allergy but she does not do it in the field. Thank you!
 
Could you maybe try a nose net if you think it's an allergy? They dont cost an awful lot of money if funds are limited....
 
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This is a image of her last year (bottom) and 2 weeks ago (top) I know her neck lacks muscle.. but think that may be to do with her head shaking and leaning etc?
 
I suspect there are different reasons with different horses but I used to ride a Shire who did this. It was a habit, pure and simple. I tried to keep my hands still, neither giivng with the reins nor snatching back and eventually, and that was a very long even.tu.a.ll.y
she did stop and rides were much more enjoyable. But if someone else rode her she would immediately start the old habit again and I'd have at least a couple of days of snatching before she returned to normal.
 
Has your instructor come out on a hack with you, since you are not having so many problems in the school but when out? The fact that she has reared up and over is quite worrying!

My horse also does this yanking the reins down when she gets tired and fed up, My instructor says it is an evasion and to bring her head up with one rein then carry on. It is a pain. I also think it may be because she lacks muscle and may be stretching, it is unnerving sometimes.
 
Thanks guys!
Mandwhy, She hasn't, but I have explained and she still suspects its bad behaviour and doesn't do it as much hacking as she enjoys it, but in a field just gets over excited. Yeah, She's never gone over properly on me before but she had had a gallop, didn't want to stand still and just went over! Luckily we were both fine and she just stood and looked at me, I did tell her off and I got on straight away - she was foot perfect after though!
I have attached a photo on the first page of her when I first got her, and her body muscle now. She's done 3 pleasure rides all 12 miles, so I don't suspect its tiredness as I like to hope shes fit enough for a canter on a 3 mile ride! She does it much more on pleasure rides.. it just drives me mad as I've been told to drop the reins so she cant lean on me, but then I have no breaks and she still does it with no reins. I will try the one rein thing though! Thank you x
 
I would suggest that you dont take her hacking out in fields or on pleasure rides until she starts behaving.

Is she ok just out on the roads in walk and trot?
 
I don't mind it, she absolutely loves her pleasure rides and a good canter or gallop, doing it less will mean she's more fired up the next time she goes in one. Shes perfect on the roads in walk and trot, only ever reared in a field.
 
Trouble is if you go on a pleasure ride, and cant stop her, and upset someone else's horses, it wont go down very well.

In normal circumstances I would probably say get the vet out to come and have a look, however I'm suspecting that given your circumstances, this may not really be a viable option.
 
No advise regarding the no brakes isue im afraid, but maybe for the snatching of reins.

Might sound silly but could you pop a daisy rein on for a few weeks? A horse I schooled for a few months had a horrible habit of snatching and after a few weeks of realising that there was no way of getting her head down she just gave up and never tried again (well, very rarely).
 
My horse did exactly this with his bit and his neck and it was because his neck was stiff. My physio advised me to get him going long and low - lot so hill work, lunging in a Equi Ami, transitions. It has improved him so much and now he doesn't try and grab the bit and shake his head much - only when he is excited.

He was never a strong horse and I always rode in the mildest bits (now in a straight bar Nathe) but as his back rounded and his neck came down, it was obvious how much more happy he was to be ridden.
 
As many Appaloosas have a tendancy to do, yours is developing a ewe-neck. Compare her neck muscles in the older photo to now, she didn't have a ewe-neck in the older pic. This suggests to me that she needs the rider to use more leg and less hand. Possibly she is shaking her head/pulling etc because she is objecting to a strong contact, my advice is to let go. My guess is that you do not take such a strong contact in the school, so maybe your RI hasn't picked up on this.
 
To help remove the ewe neck, lots and lots of transitions, one of my favourite exercises for this is walk for five strides, trot for five strides, rinse and repeat as often as you can. If she or you find five a bit difficult to start with, try ten. Keep in mind that forward going horses need riding with seat and legs at least as much as those which need pushing on. Also remember that Appy's are very clever and if you are not careful, she will train you rather than the other way round!
 
Would using a grass rein help? That would only come into action if she lowered her head too much.....as for when she is prancing and dancing....I would practice doing some lateral movements and when she starts playing up get her hooves moving sideways!!! With frequent changes of direction so she has to listen to you!! Good luck.
 
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