Molasses in Hoofkind!!!... laminitis!!!

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GREYSMEADOW

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Yesterday my little pony had an attack of laminitis – the worse I have seen him since his very first bad attack over 10 years ago. I naturally gave him his medication – Danillon/ACP. I’ve been feeding him soaked hay and Hoofkind with a handful of high fibre cubes, F4F with some speedibeet + a small carrot for pm feed
The only real change is the Hoofkind as he started turning his noise up at the HiFi Lite.

I have put him back on Hi-Fi Lite, reduced the high fibre cubes and F4F, some speedibeet and no carrots at all… He now looks at me as if to say…. Where’s my DINNER!’… so I shut the stable door and creep away…..

Whilst sorting out the contents of my feed bins I found to my horror a lump (the size of half a brick) which looks like molasses at the bottom of the bag of Hoofkind!!! And so I do wonder how much molasses is there really in a bag of Hoofkind as I think this has triggered his laminitis. Therefore, I shall be talking to the Hoofkind people tomorrow to see what they have to say. I also feed him 2 year old hay and he’s on no grass.

This morning he’s bright as a button and very much back to his Thellwell self – yes he’s a Shetland.

I received some samples from Simple Systems (GreenGold, Total Eclipse and MetaSlim) and tried him with the samples this afternoon and he’s given me the thumbs up (as he can be quite a fusspot with feed) ….. he almost chewed my hand off!

I’m now seriously thinking of moving over to Simple Systems and wondering if he would be better on Lucie Stalks as well or instead of GreenGold. Are there any SS uses who could recommend Lucie Stalks; however I will be calling their helpline tomorrow. Thanks for reading.
 
The only feed i trust for my pony who is very prone to laminitis is Happy Hoof as to my knowledge it doesnt have molasses in it. I had the same problem as you a few years ago when i used healthy hooves (which has the laminitis trust stamp on it!) It was full of molasses, couldnt believe it!
 
Thank you to Suffolkangel, monkeybum13, LauraWheeler.
I will be visiting my feed store and having a good look on each bag exactly what is in the feed.

I have since found out that Healthy Hooves does contain molasses – not necessarily on the printed bag but on the paper note attached to the bag itself which contains the batch number, ingredients etc.

Apparently some of these type of feeds are lightly molassed and I need to find out which ones.

Thanks again.
 
They all contain molasses to some degree...even the ones approved for laminitis. I will only use dengie hi fi lite as I have compared them all across the board for sugar levels and this comes out lowest...but even using that I have to be on the watch as I have found lumps of mollasses in it before now...that I have swiftly binned. Hope you pony gets better soon.
 
Most of the laminitis approved feeds have around 4/5% sugar ( I have a laminitic shettie too and have done lots of research on sugar in feeds!)
Good Doer has 8%!!

I feed SS Lucie Stalks, have done for a couple of years now and mine love them, just Alfalfa and nothing else; mixed with very watered dwon Speedi-beet and a balancer or vit and mineral supplement.

However I doubt whether it is the feed tbh, my shettie has been a little footie too ( I kept him in for three weeks) I just think the cold hard ground has made them a little like this .

He's fine now and running around outside as normal
 
Alot of these feeds contain Molasses extract in order to bind the 'dust' to the feed....

I feed all my horses and lami prone ponies Fast Fibre. It is mollasses free and is a complete feed. That is ALL mine get except for soaked hay.
 
It sounds like you have had a faulty batch of Hoofkind so I would definitely take it up with the manufacturers.

When choosing a replacement feed, don't just concentrate on whether the feeds contain molasses or not - you need to look at the water soluble carbohydrate levels - that is sugar AND starch - which should be less than 10% for laminitics. You can have a molasses free feed which is actually higher in soluble carbs than a lightly molassed one!

If the soluble carb level is not available on the manufacturer's website and/or bag then email or ring them as they should be able to provide you with this crucial information.
 
It's not actually molasses it'self - it's a low sugar extract. The best feeds for laminitics IMHO are allen and page L mix and the dengie hi-fi lite. Even happy hoof has a low amount of molasses in.
 
This is one of the things that makes my blood boil - there is absolutely no need for the feed companies to add molasses to any feed, let alone ones approved and/or marketed specifically for laminitic prone horses and ponies. Molasses is added for two reasons only, neither of which is anything beneficial for the horse - firstly as already mentioned here to bind the dust together, which is for the human's benefit not the horse. And secondly because it makes the feed very palatable so horses will chomp it up hungrily - again making the human owner very happy 'look how my horse enjoys his feed, if he's enjoying his feed so much he must be very contented'. Yep - very contented when his lamella have inflamed so much he can hardly walk.

I think it's pretty disgraceful of the feed companies to behave like this - especially when the molasses ingredient is often hidden away in the small print. It's equally disgraceful that many of these feed are stamped as suitable by the Laminitic Trust.

In fact the whole area of labelling of animal feeds needs legislating. I was in a friend's feed room a few weeks ago and looked at a local brand of what was called a Non-heating mix - that was it's big selling point. But when I looked at the paper label it contained oats, maize, barley, molasses, wheatfeed etc etc. In what way is that non-heating?!!!! Sadly many horse owners will just read the Non-heating in big letters on the front of the bag and think it's okay, rather than getting their magnifiying glass out and reading the actually ingredients in the smallest print stitched to the top of the bag (which has often ripped off in transit anyway).
 
Happyhoof in endorsed by the Laminitis Trust...

Safe and Sound is also a fantastic feed for laminitics.

But really and truly... after the medicine is no longer fed.. does the ned need any feed at all?!

Lou x
 
Have a look a the UKNHCP forum - there is quite a lot of good information on feeding on there.

I use the following for my laminitics

Unmolassed beet, linseed meal, seaweed, brewers yeast, various herbs, magnesium oxide and good quality hay.

I do not use chaffs (even things wih tthe laminitis trust seal fo approval should be treated as suspect), no grains, and no alfalfa

Metaslim is powdered alfalfa based and in my opinion not suitable for laminitics. it also contains Mag Sulph (epsom salts) rather than mag oxide, and cinnamon which explains why he is biting your hand off for it!

Hope he's OK soon.
 
I have a very old, very fussy little pony who is also prone to laminitis.
I've recently posted at the end of my tether as no matter what I've tried she'd turned her nose up at - inc hi-fi lite, healthy hooves etc etc.
I got a sample of ReadyFibre Mash from Rowen & Barbury and she loves it.
You soak it for 5 mins & it's ready to feed & is really hi fibre, but they have assured me, safe to feed to my little pony.
I bought a big bag (approx £8 so really inexpensive) on Saturday & we've had clean bowl for 2 nights now which is amazing as she has refused to eat any type of feed which you add water to for about a month now!!!!
Might be worth you dropping them a line?
I do still give her some hi-fi lite, I just find the ReadyFibre Mash makes it more palatable.
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ETS - I've just checked the feed values compared to Happy Hoof & Healthy Hooves etc. The digestible energy of the ReadyFibre is 7.5 Mj/KG and the starch is 4.18% - this is actually slightly lower (combined) than a lot of the products endorsed by the Laminitis Trust!
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[ QUOTE ]
Happyhoof in endorsed by the Laminitis Trust...

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<font color="blue"> you mustn't assume this automatically makes it ok....most contain mollasses extract and for very sensitive animals this is enough to tip them over the edge </font>


[ QUOTE ]
But really and truly... after the medicine is no longer fed.. does the ned need any feed at all?!

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<font color="blue"> agree with this....but it can be useful for supplements </font>
 
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ETS - I've just checked the feed values compared to Happy Hoof &amp; Healthy Hooves etc. The digestible energy of the ReadyFibre is 7.5 Mj/KG and the starch is 4.18% - this is actually slightly lower (combined) than a lot of the products endorsed by the Laminitis Trust!
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[/ QUOTE ] You need to know the sugar level as well as the starch level to get the total soluble carb level. For example, if the starch is 4.18% and the sugar is 2%, then the total soluble carb level will be well under 10%. However, if the sugar content was, say, 8%, then in total the soluble carbs would be 12.18% and risky to feed to a laminitic.
 
I have been told it's safe to feed to my little pony - should the bag show the sugar content? The webiste says low in starch &amp; sugar...
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I'm not saying it is not safe - just that you can't tell that it is safe just from the starch level and the DE content alone, you need to know the sugar content as well. Hopefully the manufacturer is honest and reputable, but if you wanted to double check you should email or telephone them for the sugar content.
 
I've asked &amp; the sugar content is 8% so as you say a bit risky...I've rang the laminitis trust helpline &amp; they have advised that as it is the only feed that she will even entertain at the moment to try it &amp; just keep a very very close eye on her - they said that the feed isn't approved but that doesn't mean it wouldn't get the approval if they applied for it. They have checked the webiste &amp; said everything sounds ok but obv can't give full endorsement due to the having no approval at this time.
I'm going to try halving her ration of the ReadyFibre &amp; mixing with more chaff to see if she'll still eat it that way.
She's a very old lady who isn't well covered etc and is dentally challenged! I have tried all of the laminitis approved feeds &amp; she won't eat any of them so am going to have to stick with this for now &amp; just monitor her very closely.
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I have been feeding my slightly overweight mare who may have had ???laminitis the vet wasnt 100% sure Hifi good doer
I spoke to the dengie helpline and it seems to contain more fibre with added copper, selenium and vitamin E and less digestable energy than the Hifi lite which was what she was getting before.
Her routine has not changed otherwise and she has lost a little of the weight she carried, her temperament has changed (calmer) and so far she hasnt had any other symptoms of laminitis??? if that is what it was??
Im always a little cautious about feed bags that has laminitis trust stamped all over them.
I hope you can find somthing that suits your pony meadowgrey. I can only recommend the HiFi good doer as I havnt used any of the others and probably wont because Ive heard of this problem sooooo many times before.
 
I think I posted it on your other thread last week but be very very careful of the ReadyFibre Mash. It really messed up the feet of my gelding that had been beautiful to look at and sound at speed on all surfaces, including rocks. After a couple of weeks on the ReadyFibre Mash his soles lost all their concavity and he became footy. Disaster. But now two months after stopping feeding the Mash to him his feet are finally getting back to how there were before. I would worry what affect this feed would have on an already laminitc horse. But I do understand that you need to feed something and what a dilemma when your pony turns her nose up at everything else. Just keep a very close eye on her - which i know you will anyway - and monitor for any negative changes.
 
As an option you could always rinse the feed before giving it. I did this with some HiFi Lite I was using up. The water was black. I rinsed it until the water ran clear. I have also done this with speedibeet.
 
Yes, I just saw that this morning actually! I am rubbish at checking my posts after a day or so!
Thanks for that - I will have to keep a very close eye on her - she will be the death of me! I've been at my wits end with her feed and have also been concerned about her fluid intake etc so the ReadyFibre seemed to tick all the boxes and she likes it which is a big plus - I really hope it's ok for her, I can't go thro all that again!
OP - sorry for hijacking the thread - hopefully so of my questions will help you with your problem tho!
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If you are looking for something sugar free to replace the hi fi lite, the top spec top chop lite is a straw/alfalfa mix that is totally sugar free. It has mint i think to make it tasty.
It does work out more expensive than hi fi at £8.95 for a smaller size bag.
I swapped from alfa a lite to top chop alfa to avoid sugar and my gelding ate it quite happily but he is greedy and not too fussy.
 
That's why I only use feed recommended by the Laminitis Trust, Happy hoof, speedibeet, Spillers Hi Fi cubes as and when needed depending on level of grazing and how much work done.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I have a very old, very fussy little pony who is also prone to laminitis.
I've recently posted at the end of my tether as no matter what I've tried she'd turned her nose up at - inc hi-fi lite, healthy hooves etc etc.
I got a sample of ReadyFibre Mash from Rowen &amp; Barbury and she loves it.
You soak it for 5 mins &amp; it's ready to feed &amp; is really hi fibre, but they have assured me, safe to feed to my little pony.
I bought a big bag (approx £8 so really inexpensive) on Saturday &amp; we've had clean bowl for 2 nights now which is amazing as she has refused to eat any type of feed which you add water to for about a month now!!!!
Might be worth you dropping them a line?
I do still give her some hi-fi lite, I just find the ReadyFibre Mash makes it more palatable.
smile.gif

ETS - I've just checked the feed values compared to Happy Hoof &amp; Healthy Hooves etc. The digestible energy of the ReadyFibre is 7.5 Mj/KG and the starch is 4.18% - this is actually slightly lower (combined) than a lot of the products endorsed by the Laminitis Trust!
wink.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

I tried my horse on that, he ate it for about 6 months, had to travel to gloucester from cardiff to get it, last time I went i got about 6 bags, he then decided he didn't like it ! I rang co to see if they'd changed anything in it and the said no so not sure why he suddenly went off it when he seemed to relish it. After that I used a Badminton feed in pink bag, massive cubes, he liked those, this was before he had laminitis, I just needed a high fibre food he would eat at the time, he doesn't like alfa. He gets what I said in my other post now :-) its suprising to hear that hh has molasses in it, I do hope its safe
 
Sounds like Madame!
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It's ridiculous really as this little tiny pony has me wrapped round her little hoof!! I just worry about her, she doesn't eat enough to keep a flea alive really and the fluid intake was a concern and then I discovered the ReadyFibre Mash &amp; it was like a weight off my mind &amp; now I'm worrying again that it might not be safe for her!!!!!!! She won't entertain chaff really, I wouldn't give her any kind of cereal based mix and she's not overly fond of beet products! Talk about fussy!!!!
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With my big lad it's a case of if he's hungry he'll eat it!!!!!!
 
I never feed anything without reading the contents of the bag... theres several feeds that give the impression of being low sugar and starch, whereas when you actually look at what is in the bag there are others types by the same brand which are lower.
Never trust the name of advertising blurb, always check the ingridients for yourself on whatever you will feed. Dont 'trust' the advice of a feed advisor either, they will be biased towards there products obviously, so whilst there exeprt advice is obviously very helpful, do a bit of research yourself so you can feel confident in what you are feeding. All the major brands have a full break down of whats in their feeds on their websites usually, compare them all and you will see big differences even in chaffs marketed similarly. I did a table in excel recently to find the right chaffs for my girls, unfortauntely it did not save properly otherwise i wouldve shared it with you.
hope your pony recovers from his lami quickly.
 
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