More weight needed, what changes would you make to his diet?

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thatsmygirl

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My tb ex racer has still not got the amount off weight on that I would like, he's had his teeth done, worming up to date, back checked and just starting to come back into work after a 4 month hol after finishing racing. He had 2 failed wind ops while in racing which ended his career but I love him to pieces and for what I will do with him, just hacking he will be fine. He's currently out by day and in at night, as much hay as he can eat and always has some left so notgoing short there. He has 2 meals a day both containing a stubb scoop off baileys no 4 topline cubes ( level scoop) level scoop off alfa a oil and a huge scoop off sugar beet ( just changed from speedibeet to normal pellets) and a mug full off micro linseed in each meal, twice a day. He has no vices, not stressy at all, really laid back. His coat is shiney and his topline is good but I would just like a bit more coverage over his ribs, any ideas what I could change or add? He's 16.2 so quite a bit lad.
 
thatsmygirl said:
My tb ex racer has still not got the amount off weight on that I would like, he's had his teeth done, worming up to date, back checked and just starting to come back into work after a 4 month hol after finishing racing. He had 2 failed wind ops while in racing which ended his career but I love him to pieces and for what I will do with him, just hacking he will be fine. He's currently out by day and in at night, as much hay as he can eat and always has some left so notgoing short there. He has 2 meals a day both containing a stubb scoop off baileys no 4 topline cubes ( level scoop) level scoop off alfa a oil and a huge scoop off sugar beet ( just changed from speedibeet to normal pellets) and a mug full off micro linseed in each meal, twice a day. He has no vices, not stressy at all, really laid back. His coat is shiney and his topline is good but I would just like a bit more coverage over his ribs, any ideas what I could change or add? He's 16.2 so quite a bit lad.
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My sisters tb is at his perfect weight according to my saddler and vet and he looks fab a lot like you are discribing but i can still see a nice amount of his ribs if you get my meaning. I think its just how some of them are as a lady up the yard tb is the same.

I've given up trying for that extra bit of coverage as he looks healthy. also he is 16.3.

Xxxx
 
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I think it will just take time unfortunately. I've got an exracer that I got in june weighing 408kg (he's 15.3) so very underweight. He's holding his weight now but is still ribby. Even when he had quite a belly in the autumn he still looked poor over his hips and you could still see ribs. Ive spoken to other people with racers and they said theirs took a couple of years even to 'even out' the fat! Mine's neck is about twice the size it was, though still skinny by normal standards(!) and overall he looks more filled out, but he still has big hollows by his hips and ribs are clearly visible. As long as theyre healthy looking, which you've said your boy is, I wouldnt worry :)
 
Sound like your doing everything right to me.

Is he rugged? Mine drop weight when they get cold.

The only other thing we use is oil - but you've got that in his Alfa. And we also feed Blue Chip.

Some are just like that in the winter.
 
Oliviaandsparrow that sounds like my lad, his neck has filled out a lot but yes he seems to still be in by his hips, some nights seem worse than others for some reason. Think it's worse when I'm use to my others which are highlands and cobs
 
He's rugged in his Rambo duo which stays on him I don't change to stable rugs, he's a very hot horse and I have to be careful because iv caught him sweating a couple off times and won't take any liners in his rug so only in a 100g at mo but it's v mild here ( 12 degrees tonight) when I brought him I was told he's a v cold horse so to rug him well, they had 3 rugs on him but iv found him to be very hot but than he's having at lib hay now which has prob helped with that.
 
I've fairly recently posted on here and asked the TopSpec nutritionist for advice and the thing that stands out to me, based on what I learned from them, about your feeds is that they may be too large for him to digest efficiently. The stomach can only hold so much and so if more keeps on coming in, then it all gets moved through more quickly before it's had chance to mix with the digestive juices for efficient digestion.

Each feed should be no more than 2kg and not exceed the volume of a rugby ball.

If I were to suggest a change I would say drop the alfa-a oil and instead, just add a small handful of chaff (alfa-a?) to add texture and then add the oil neat (veg oil for example, 200ml).
 
I would always advise having a fecal egg count done in these cases.
My gelding would drop weight, especially at this time of year and after a year of bad health, I decided to try herbal wormers.
I was advised to do a f.e.c. first and was shocked to find he had a high worm burden, even though his worming was up to date and he was always wormed with the yard programme along with all the others.
 
You could have him blood tested to make sure there's no tapeworm, although if he has put on some weight it sounds unlikely.

I really like baileys cooked cereal
Meal, you just add water and feed it straight away (mix it up like porridge) and you can feed your normal feed with it. Its non heating and has really made a difference to ours. Definately recommend it.
 
I feed my 16 hh, 19 year old Arab the same feed as you are doing. He also struggles to hold any weight, weighing 465kg. He,s happy, lively and shiny but it bothers me. I,ve had him blood checked, worming ect, all up to date. I had the baileys nutritionists in the area so they came out to look at my lot, and for him they advised adding digest plus to the feed he is currently getting to help him utilise it more efficiently. Only being doing this for a week, so not sure if it will help yet. Good luck.
 
I had a similar problem with my TB, I was feeding him quite a lot (speedibeet, barley, alfa oil, conditioning cubes!) to try and put weight on that he probably wasn't able to utalise it all anyway! I have swapped to the Pure feed company and use their Pure Condition. Thats all he gets now and he is doing so well! He lives out 24/7 and he looks great! Have a look at their website, they are very helpful and they are happy to talk at lenghth about what is best for your horse.
 
Ashtay I had a talk with baileys yeserday and yes it's a stubb scoop and a half to feed at a time so I have taken out the alfa a and so he's getting a scoop off topline and the other half is made up off linseed and sugar beet. A 3rd meal is going to be added
 
I would put him on three feeds a day, and change to haylage if possible. If not possible to change to haylage, then I would feed a tub of grass chaff or soaked grass nuts alongside his nightly hay, to boost the amount of calories he gets from forage.

I would also consider putting him on some sort of product containing a probiotic yeast (such as Yea-Sacc or some form of balancers)j. This will help ensure the best conditions in the hindgut so that fibre digestion is most effective and the horse therefore gets the most out of the feed he receives.
 
amymay said:
Have you tried splitting what sounds like two rather big meals in to 3?? May well help.
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/\ This.

Those feeds are too big for a horse to digest. One stubbs scoop of cubes/2 kg is the largest a feed should be. If you add to that afalfa and sugar beet you are adding fibre which will encourage the feed being pushed through without being fully digested.

Can you split it into 3 or even 4 meals per day? I would also change to haylage.
 
http://www.gravenhorse.co.uk/Products.htm

Full fat soya i would recommend, my very skinny tb has been on this for 2 months now, With a handfull of chaff, I give him a small jar full morning and night the bag lasts you a long while. You now cant see his ribs plus it gives them a gorgeous shine. If you email the guy john about your concerns. he will tell you about the products, how much to feed. he knows his stuff.great guy. x
 
I'm going to be really thick here now guys but interested in the answer, so if I feed my lad his night feed off a scoop off topline plus his linseed and mix with a little sugar beet so it's a smaller feed which will help digest properly, what's the difference in him than going and eating his haynet to having a bigger dinner?if you see what I'm saying. Does the hay digest differently to the feed he would off just eaten or would the hay on top push his dinner through still as a large meal?
Does that make sence?
 
Just to clarify the size of feed issue. The problem is with cereal-containing feeds (such as Baileys No 4). Cereal starch needs to be digested in the stomach, whereas fibre is mainly digested in the hindgut. So if the cereal starch is pushed through into the hindgut too quickly it won't be properly digested AND can upset the balance in the hindgut as well. So if you are feeding a cereal-based feed and it is larger than the capacity of the stomach (and the horse eats it all in one go) then you risk the undigested starch being pushed through to the hindgut. However, if you are feeding fibre feeds alone, then the problem doesn't arise because there is no cereal starch to worry about. So you can feed a bowl of chaff and beet that is more than 2kg, and similarly give a big haynet.

As regards giving a cereal feed and the horse then eating its haynet, I suspect that the hay is likely to be ingested at a much slower rate than the bucket feed, as it is long fibre, needs chewing and is not nearly as exciting to eat as cereal feed, so giving the starch a chance to be digested in the stomach.
 
Horses are designed to be trickle feeders - designed to graze a food stuff that passes through the system slowly. Bulking it up with hard feed (which a horse is not designed to eat) can sometimes have the affect of having no effect at all. Feeding the same hard feed qauntities, but split in to smaller feeds has the effect of allowing that feed to pass through slowly, and not be expelled from the gut without the calories being used.

The horses stomach is small - so the smaller the feeds, the better it is utilised.
 
TGM said:
I would put him on three feeds a day, and change to haylage if possible. If not possible to change to haylage, then I would feed a tub of grass chaff or soaked grass nuts alongside his nightly hay, to boost the amount of calories he gets from forage.

I would also consider putting him on some sort of product containing a probiotic yeast (such as Yea-Sacc or some form of balancers)j. This will help ensure the best conditions in the hindgut so that fibre digestion is most effective and the horse therefore gets the most out of the feed he receives.
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My thoughts,exactly:)
 
I'd change his hay to haylage. He might eat more anyway and it does usually seem to put more weight on (although you would have to watch that he doesn't get silly on it).
I would also consider changing the cereal-based feed for well-soaked grassnuts with grass chaff. This works well for putting weight on our old lady who can drop weight easily these days.
 
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