Mounting issues with young cob

[travellingpony]

Just wondering if anyone has any suggestions. Cob is 4/5 been backed and ridden away about a year. I brought her a month or so ago. She had an issue with an ill fitting saddle with previous owner. Saddle properly fitted now, passed vetting and seen by physio no physical issues at all.

She isn't very good at being mounted from the block. I have been working on it using plenty of standing at the block not getting on and tried waiting her out. None of this seems to be making any real progress. I tried today as recommended by my instructor to give a treat. This just ended up with my being mugged and her focus totally lost.

The mare is very sweet and has come on leaps and bounds in the stable and being led (she was quite bolshy when she came). She is very bright and picks things up quickly but is also quite green and hasn't seen a lot.

I don't think that the mounting issue is fear at all as eventually she will just stand and some days will straight away. I tried using other things to mount from and they are fine the first time and then she won't again!!! She isn't running off she just tactfully shoots sideways at the last second..

I am trying to be quiet and patient about it but i'm not sure this tack is working or i'm maybe i'm missing something. If you have someone to help she is perfect every time but sadly this isn't practical for me on a daily basis.

Once on she can hump her back and bit a bit tense on occasions but if you ask her to go forwards she is fine. I am making sure she has walked round in hand a bit before getting on to be comfortable as she finds the indoor a bit worrying (she likes to see other horses) she doesn't call or anything anymore though and seems more focused on me.

Any thoughts? There are some people very into groundwork I know and they are saying focus on that rather than the riding but I know little about Parelli type games does anyone think that could be beneficial? I'm in no rush to do anything with her at all but do want the basics right if that makes sense.

 

[be positive]

Groundwork can be useful, I think I would do a little lunging or long reining to establish a connection where she listens to you and learns to STAND when asked wherever you are before mounting, that should get her a bit more settled, possibly a little tired so she will be more accepting of standing while you get on, ensure she does stay completely still until asked to walk on whether being ridden or in hand.
The other thing is to practise after work, get off and on until she stands still, if you are going to treat it must be well timed to stop her mugging you, the treat is given after you get on while she is standing still not given before you mount otherwise she is being encouraged to mug you and can still move if she feels inclined.

I have no experience of the P games and have no desire to learn, having dealt with "problem" horses without using tricks I think you can get round most issues if you learn to "read" the horse you are dealing with, most will learn to read their handler equally well given half a chance and soon become easier to deal with.

 

[laura_nash]

Any thoughts? There are some people very into groundwork I know and they are saying focus on that rather than the riding but I know little about Parelli type games does anyone think that could be beneficial? I'm in no rush to do anything with her at all but do want the basics right if that makes sense.

I would agree with doing some groundwork exercises. It doesn't have to be to the exclusion of riding though, just make every other session groundwork (or something like that). Personally I would steer clear of Parelli, there is some good stuff mixed in there but overall its a bit nuts. Kelly Marks Perfect Manners book is a good start for basic groundwork exercises.

 

[Bens_Mum]

Thoughts on parelli are interesting I have had people suggest that with mine too

 

[splashgirl45]

i agree with the other posters, i would lunge her first just for 10 mins so she settles and treats are good but only once you are on and she has stood completely still, could you get a friend to help for the first few days and give a treat to reward standing still and then another once you are on...then do away with the first treat and gradually transfer the giving of the treat to you only when you are on board...another who says keep clear of parelli, use the old fashioned, good horsemanship groundwork and be very patient and i am sure you will get there in the end.good luck

 

[travellingpony]

Thanks all would anyone be concerned about the tension when you get on or the humping? It never becomes anything more and she just walks on fine but i'm slightly paranoid about all things back related. The physio was really happy with her and the saddle new and professionally fitted so don't want to get her back for £50 if its not thought necessary? She has always done it just some days more than others..?

 

[LD&S]

I recently got cob and she was a bit pushy so I got one of the IH recommended associates out, not cheap but she suggested ground work as it would help her ridden work as well as soon as she's mounted likes to walk off, she has improved but tbf I haven't done a lot with her.

 

[cobgoblin]

She's probably expecting pain from the badly fitting saddle and hasn't realised that it won't happen now.
Stand her alongside a gate to mount so she can't move sideways and if possible have someone hold her head. It'll take quite a few goes before she realises that mounting doesn't equal pain.

 

[be positive]

Thanks all would anyone be concerned about the tension when you get on or the humping? It never becomes anything more and she just walks on fine but i'm slightly paranoid about all things back related. The physio was really happy with her and the saddle new and professionally fitted so don't want to get her back for £50 if its not thought necessary? She has always done it just some days more than others..?

It would bother me if it continued once she accepts being mounted properly, at the moment it is probably still related to her anticipating discomfort and the tension itself will be causing some discomfort, you need to break the cycle completely so she is relaxed about standing still, at any time, if some hunching up remains then further investigations would be worthwhile but at the moment the behaviour is still a habit that should be possible to get over.

 

[PorkChop]

I like to teach them in a large non slip area with a moveable mounting block.

So you stand on the mounting block and they have to move around you, they soon realise that it is harder work to have to keep walking around you.

Allow lots of time, break each part of the mounting process into small chunks, and don't move on to the next bit until they are standing quietly.

 

[Sukistokes2]

Just standing her at the block and waiting her out is not enough, you have to reward her for good behaviour ( what you want) and punish/ correct poor behaviour. ( what you don't want) Teaching her to stand shouldn't take long, about 30 minutes. She has been hurt and she is expecting to be hurt again. My horse had a similar issue except he took off and I ended up on the front of some poor woman's Discovery.

Lead her to the block and stand her. Reward her for standing ( pat, treat, up to you ) then walk her away. Circle her around and back to the block, stand her again, reward her, lead her away. Slowly increase the time she stands at the block. Make it a pleasant experience. Anytime she so much as moves a inch, before you say so, circle her and put her back to where you want her. That's her punishment, so to speak. When she is standing relaxed make a move towards the block. If she stands, reward if she moves, circle. Slowly work your way up the block. Standing receives a reward, moving gets a circle. If you have someone with you make sure they are not holding or blocking her moving. The whole point is she learns on her own. Then do foot in the stirrup, putting weight, etc etc etc , always sticking to the reward or punishment. As it seems she has been hurt badly , it may take a couple of sessions but it will work. You just need to be patient. Also once up just sit there a bit. Do not move from the block straight away.

 

[Evie91]

My little mare was like this when I first had her (also a young horse).Would lead to the block, stand and as I stood on block to get on she walked off or stepped sideways or backwards. We tried going round in circles but got nowhere fast!! (Probably a pun in there somewhere!).
We started with someone standing holding her at the block, distracting her with a treat whilst I got on quickly, she would take a few steps and wanted to walk off straight away which I let her initially.
Progressed to standing at the block, person stood in front but not holding, then rider giving a sweet once on and just standing still.
Now I can get on by myself, give her a treat and we stand whilst I faff and then ask her to walk away when I choose.
It can be done but takes time and patience. She is now fab to get on.

 

[AdorableAlice]

The OP is possibly reaping the reward of the pony never being taught to go, whoa and stop at the halter breaking stage. In the ideal world the go,whoa and stop should be taught and then maintained from weaning stage. I wonder if the pony stands when asked whilst being ridden, very possibly not.

I think it would be worth going back to the basic training, perhaps using a dually and reinstall the go/stop before concentrating on the mounting issue. When it's feet can be controlled it will be a whole lot easier to progress to sort the other issue out.

The Op's problem is very similar to what we had with the bonkers carthorse and it did take a lot of time and careful handling to eradicate. We did not get on him even after he had stood correctly, we did brush him off the top of the block, fiddle with his mane, lean over him, put a foot in the iron and weight it and bang the opposite stirrup leather etc. Two of us stood on the block and chatted whilst he stood being ignored, all he had to do was be still. He had to learn that standing by the block did not mean being made to feel anxious, then we progressed to standing him by the post and rail or a gate, we climbed up the gate and sat there. All this work was done on BOTH side of the horse, this is crucial. We also stood him facing the block so we were above his head. It is far safer to have a tall, wide and very solid block to do all this from.

When the standing still for however long asked, regardless of what was being done to him and without question was cracked he was mounted, just for a few seconds and then dismounted back on to the block, repeat the dose again and again. He was not ridden away from the block and he did no work. In effect his work for the day was the lesson at the side of the block (he was 4) with this cracked he was ridden away from the block around the yard and dismounted onto the floor. This was repeated with mounted off the rails or a gate too.

He is 5 now and pretty solid in the mounting manners/safety but we still have to be careful at a show. He is an anxious horse and all this mind numbing work has helped him. A difficult to mount horse is potentially highly dangerous, but if the op does the progressive training, never moving on until appropriate the problem can be sorted.

 

[travellingpony]

The OP is possibly reaping the reward of the pony never being taught to go, whoa and stop at the halter breaking stage. In the ideal world the go,whoa and stop should be taught and then maintained from weaning stage. I wonder if the pony stands when asked whilst being ridden, very possibly not.

I think it would be worth going back to the basic training, perhaps using a dually and reinstall the go/stop before concentrating on the mounting issue. When it's feet can be controlled it will be a whole lot easier to progress to sort the other issue out.

The Op's problem is very similar to what we had with the bonkers carthorse and it did take a lot of time and careful handling to eradicate. We did not get on him even after he had stood correctly, we did brush him off the top of the block, fiddle with his mane, lean over him, put a foot in the iron and weight it and bang the opposite stirrup leather etc. Two of us stood on the block and chatted whilst he stood being ignored, all he had to do was be still. He had to learn that standing by the block did not mean being made to feel anxious, then we progressed to standing him by the post and rail or a gate, we climbed up the gate and sat there. All this work was done on BOTH side of the horse, this is crucial. We also stood him facing the block so we were above his head. It is far safer to have a tall, wide and very solid block to do all this from.

When the standing still for however long asked, regardless of what was being done to him and without question was cracked he was mounted, just for a few seconds and then dismounted back on to the block, repeat the dose again and again. He was not ridden away from the block and he did no work. In effect his work for the day was the lesson at the side of the block (he was 4) with this cracked he was ridden away from the block around the yard and dismounted onto the floor. This was repeated with mounted off the rails or a gate too.

He is 5 now and pretty solid in the mounting manners/safety but we still have to be careful at a show. He is an anxious horse and all this mind numbing work has helped him. A difficult to mount horse is potentially highly dangerous, but if the op does the progressive training, never moving on until appropriate the problem can be sorted.

This is just it no halting when on board either. In hand she can be quite disrespectful too but its improving. There are just huge gaps in her education which is odd. She will be excellent with things you expect to be a problem and then something silly sets her off and she just panics.

She was a driving horse too. Works in a lovely outline (once you get on!) she will be super but there is a long way to go but no rush.

I will try all those suggestions thank you. I have enlisted a helper today so that will make things a little easier too.

 

[AdorableAlice]

This is just it no halting when on board either. In hand she can be quite disrespectful too but its improving. There are just huge gaps in her education which is odd. She will be excellent with things you expect to be a problem and then something silly sets her off and she just panics.

She was a driving horse too. Works in a lovely outline (once you get on!) she will be super but there is a long way to go but no rush.

I will try all those suggestions thank you. I have enlisted a helper today so that will make things a little easier too.

I am sure you will be able to train her to be mannerly and safe. Just set your goal posts and don't move them, horses thrive on boundaries and you have to be consistent in what the boundary is. You can't have a couple of strict rule days and then the 'oh it will do' because I am in a hurry day.

 

[travellingpony]

I have moved her on to DIY so that I am the only one doing the handling now and i'm just going to set out my stall now so there is no confusion.

Shes super shes just very green and important bits seem to have been glossed over. Christmas and terrible weather haven't helped as shes not been turned out or ridden as she normally would so is a little fresh too.

Thank you everyone for all the great tips i'm feeling positive now!