Moving horses to ex cattle grazing

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Yobbycob

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My horses have been yard and stable kept for the past 12 months (due to unfortunate circumstances, not related to their health/metabolism) but now am moving my Irish cob and his campanion pony to a new home where they will have access to paddocks. (YAY!)
This land was previously used by organic cattle and had been reseeded a few years ago with what i have been told was a high sugar grass ideal for dairy. I do not have any more info on what this grass is. The neighbouring farmer runs his sheep on it at present and is taking hay from one of the other fields. (In my ignorance grass is green that about all i know!!!)
Obviously I have concerns over whether this grass is going to be harmful to my horses, they are currently a little overweight (last batch of haylage was obviously way too high quality and it took a while to adjust the quantities to balance this, in the meantime they have become too chubby) and I am trying to reduce their weight further prior to the move in 6 weeks.
I know i will need to restrict their grazing for a while as they adapt to grass, and I will keep them in at night with a hay (not haylage) net. I was thinking initially 2 hrs in the morning and 2 in the afternoon, which would mirror their haylage eating schedule of 3 nets a day, taking about 2hrs to eat each net. So does that sound alright? How long will i need to wean them onto grazing for until they can be out all day?
My main query is, Will this grass be ok for them them or am i practically guaranteed to give them laminitis by putting them out on this cattle grazing? Obviously i don't want to take any risks, but at the same time I want to give them a better lifestyle to their current stable/yard set up, which is a pretty miserable existance for them. They deserve their freedom after their time on concrete!
Does anyone think it may be feasible to alter the grass quality again, re reseed it so to speak?! I apologiose for my utter ignorance in this matter, and hope someone with some knowledge of the subject can offer some help.
 
Personally I would be concerned about turning out onto dairy grass, but that's easy to say because I live at the edge of the fells and the grass here is rubbish! So its perfect for horses. If there's no other option, could you turn them out at night instead of in the day? Sugars are higher in the daytime. Or could you set up a track system and feed hay on it?

If the land owner (assuming it's not you) has no objections then you could take the rather big step of ploughing it up and reseeding, although I am not sure exactly what grass mix you can buy that isn't aimed at being lush and green. Maybe a meadow grass type mix. If I was starting from scratch my choice would be a meadow type mix with plenty of wild flowers, plus planting a load of native shrubs and hedging for them to browse. If you did go down this route perhaps you could keep a track going to use while the rest of the field is sorted out.

If you can keep the sheep on it as well that's always a bonus, they'll eat up the grass and also the worms too :)
 
Ploughing and reseeding will take so long to establish that it is not that realistic on what is likely to be rented land, I would use a track or strip graze where the hay has been taken off before it gets too much chance to recover, keep the sheep coming on to get the best out of it, I should think after a few years of grazing, silage cutting the quality will have been reduced, most dairy land is reseeded every few years to get the best grass this if you are lucky will be well past that stage.
I moved onto dairy land years ago, took hay then grazed with no problems apart from the year I spread with manure in autumn, the following spring I had a couple of big horses go down with laminitis, so have never done that again.

I think you need to set up a small restricted area, turn out as you plan so you can gradually allow longer and give soaked hay when in to keep the sugar intake as low as possible, plenty of exercise will help keep the weight down, they should be very happy to get out after so long.
 
Yobbycob said:
Obviously I have concerns over whether this grass is going to be harmful to my horses.
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I have personal knowledge of this as my horse was grazed on land that had a 100 year history of having a dairy herd on there. He was an import and it was an absolute nightmare as he kept getting repeated colics due to the high sugar/protein content of the grass. Apparently, so I learnt, the way cattle graze is different to horses as they bite the grass much nearer the ground than horses, thus the grass grows back with thick and very nutritous swards of grass. Evenutally after repeated weekly bouts of gassy colic due to the grazing my vet and I diagnosed a system whereby if the horse showed the same normal symptoms of colic he had previoulsy exhibited I was go give him bute in his feed (he would always have room for feed!) and then put him on the horse walker or lunge him and then put him back in his stable. The idea being that the horse would still continue to exhibit colic symptoms if his colic was severe as the pain would over ride the bute.
This was such a simple and yet cost effective idea and saved me thousands of pounds and several hundred vets visits. Eventually with the addition of pink powder, and less time out at grass the horse became colic free.

When a new livery bought a new horse (imported that week) I warned her about the grazing and knew her horse would be susceptible as he was a WB and newly imported (thus not used to grass) and she chose to ignore me. Her horse got colic very soon after and I was lucky enough to spot it pawing the floor of the stable and was able to monitor it and call the YO who called her and the vet out. If she had listened to me advise her to turn out for short periods to build up the horse resistance she would have saved herself the bother and cost of calling a vet out.

I would be extremely worried about moving to ex cattle grazing and would be very reluctant to do this with my own horse.
 
I over winter my horses graze the cattle paddocks, & I would be happy to graze them in the summer but with a lot of restriction. If its dairy grass it will be a rye grass mix which is likely to be higher in sugars than a special 'horsey mix' but I am assuming as you said grazed by organic cattle it will not have had artificial fertiliser spread but will possibly have had Farm yard manure.
I would restrict grazing using strips or tracks and introduce slowly perhaps grazing in hand for a couple of days for half hour or so until you see a change in the droppings & no signs of tummy upset/colic. Droppings will be much greener on grass than hay and probably softer but not runny or squishy. You will know what is normal for your horses.
 
Restrict grazing, strip graze or if you can, make a track around the outside of field...dairy grass is regularly fertilised, different rich grass for production of milk...sugar levels are lowest at night, high in the daytime...
 
My Tb mare lives on land originally intended for cattle but had not been fertilised for many years. It does get rich in the Spring, we restrict them. We did keep a pony there too, he was really, really restricted-
 
Get a forage analysis done to check what the sugar levels are. Forage plus are one bunch that do it, then you can act with knowledge.
 
WelshRuby said:
I understand grass grazed by sheep will be rich.
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Not necessarily, it depends on the grazing itself. We have sheep on but the land is too poor for cattle. The sheep fertilise it to some extent but so do horses. And they eat it, more importantly. I do think their advantages far outweigh any risks.
 
Sheep graze the grass down much lower than cattle. Cattle do not have upper teeth, so they need longer grass they can get hold of and rip and swallow, and then lie down and cud.

I am in the process of turning mine out onto grass, after being severely restricted all winter, and looking very healthy and not overweight.

I always make sure they have hay in their stomachs to start with, and to start with turn them out in the later afternoon on a very small patch. This can last them 2-3 days and gradually let them out earlier in the day, still after having some hay first. Then I gradually increase the size of the patch with electric fencing, but in the evening. They are still brought in at night.

If they are out 24/7 I might pen them up on a much smaller area for some time, like an outdoor stable, and continue to give them a small amount of hay, just to keep their digestion used to it.
 
Many MANY thanks for everyones responses and advice, we will definitely track or strip graze them and restrict the time they have out, they will have ENORMOUS stables (18x20!) and both covered and outdoor hard standing so will still have plenty of room to move. The pony will be lunged/long reined every other day for exercise and the horse lunged/ridden similarly, hopefully they will be happy and in good shape and stay free from laminitis and colic, fingers crossed!
 
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