Moving to another breed

[blodwyn1]

We lost our much loved golden retriever in November and also couldn't face getting another one. I went for a ready trained red labrador and couldn't be happier as she is so different but also so easy.

 

[druid]

Field or Sussex spaniel. Or show bred Cocker.

 

[Katieg123]

@Katieg123 , speak to @Chiffy about flatcoats, she is a mine of information on them.

Sorry the top of my post was meant to be a quote of the OP! I've had flat coats on and off for the last 25 years and love them dearly looking to get another in the next 2 years or so as we lost ours last year

 

[Cinnamontoast]

English setters and Munsterlanders are very, very scarce.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

English setters and Munsterlanders are very, very scarce.

We see 3 English Setters quite often when we take the dogs to a country park at the weekend. They are often part of a group of all 3 types of setter.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

We see 3 English Setters quite often when we take the dogs to a country park at the weekend. They are often part of a group of all 3 types of setter.

Imports? Whenever I look for one, they’re only in Ireland.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Imports? Whenever I look for one, they’re only in Ireland.

No idea! They are all different ages. If I get a chance, I will ask next time I see them but don't hold your breath, the brown one is going through a reactive stage, after an unfortunate incident near home one day, so we are working on that but trying not to let her get too close to on lead dogs.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

No idea! They are all different ages. If I get a chance, I will ask next time I see them but don't hold your breath, the brown one is going through a reactive stage, after an unfortunate incident near home one day, so we are working on that but trying not to let her get too close to on lead dogs.

Ooh. That’s unfortunate. I know you’ll be doing lots with her, I think it’s so important to keep them as social as possible. Life was quite stressful with puss cat!

 

[Moobli]

It’s wonderful having a dog in a million … until the day you lose them . I’m so sorry for the loss of your wonderful golden.

Would having a female GR be different enough to Henry? If you definitely want a change of breed then a show bred Labrador would likely fit your criteria, or a show bred Cocker spaniel would be mellow and lower drive whereas the WCS is anything but mellow.

 

[J&T]

Any more recommendations are in still welcome but I have a shortlist now ,

Show Cocker spaniel
Irish red and white setter
Flat Coated Retriever

i would love to hear from flat coat retriever owners on the forum on how similar and different they are to Goldens?

 

[Petalpoos]

Just a word of caution and I am ready to be shot down by the flat coat retriever owners on here, but a number of the FCRs I have known of have died of bone cancer and they do seem to be particularly susceptible. My last curly coat died of that at 7 and it was horrible.

 

[Finlib]

Any more recommendations are in still welcome but I have a shortlist now ,

Show Cocker spaniel
Irish red and white setter
Flat Coated Retriever

i would love to hear from flat coat retriever owners on the forum on how similar and different they are to Goldens?

We have had 2 Irish red and whites different breeders different bloodlines both were much more driven especially as young dogs much more so than the 4 ,Red"s I have had .They would pick up a scent and run! Recall was a challenge got better with age (4 to 5).Not as people orientated as my reds friendly but not siting right next to you or on your feet like the reds.A bit full on when meeting people red more sedate sit quietly for a pat and cuddle.Red and whites inclined to bowl you over again got better with age (4 or ,5years old!!!)
They were never cut out to be PAT dogs where as the reds loved it.
Red and whites are difficult to find (a couple of breeders in the east and one in Staffordshire I know off and were quite a bit more expensive ,(rarity I guess )
.My neighbour has had 4 flat coats lost them all to cancer all under ,10 years old one only 6 one 7 and two were 8 present one is ,9 and has had 2 toes removed with bone cancer research it but I believe there is a cancer problem which I think the breed is trying to address

 

[AmyMay]

Just a word of caution and I am ready to be shot down by the flat coat retriever owners on here, but a number of the FCRs I have known of have died of bone cancer and they do seem to be particularly susceptible. My last curly coat died of that at 7 and it was horrible.

I was going to mention their longevity. I don’t know any over 8 sadly.

 

[NinjaPony]

Outlandish suggestion… my friend has got a 1 year old Pyrenees Mountain dog and she is fabulous. Enormous, lovely thick coat, very striking and has the most gentle temperament. Loves children, dogs, ducks, small dogs etc, and meeting people is her favourite hobby. She’s quite independent like a lot of the ‘sheep guarding’ breeds, her favourite hobby is watching over the garden, but very social and outgoing. They might be a bit big though, she is a very large dog!

 

[J&T]

We have had 2 Irish red and whites different breeders different bloodlines both were much more driven especially as young dogs much more so than the 4 ,Red"s I have had .They would pick up a scent and run! Recall was a challenge got better with age (4 to 5).Not as people orientated as my reds friendly but not siting right next to you or on your feet like the reds.A bit full on when meeting people red more sedate sit quietly for a pat and cuddle.Red and whites inclined to bowl you over again got better with age (4 or ,5years old!!!)
They were never cut out to be PAT dogs where as the reds loved it.
Red and whites are difficult to find (a couple of breeders in the east and one in Staffordshire I know off and were quite a bit more expensive ,(rarity I guess )
.My neighbour has had 4 flat coats lost them all to cancer all under ,10 years old one only 6 one 7 and two were 8 present one is ,9 and has had 2 toes removed with bone cancer research it but I believe there is a cancer problem which I think the breed is trying to address

Thank you for the detailed response on Irish red and whites. Irish/ red setters sound more suited to me based on your experience with them.

Can reds be good off leash with training? They don't sound too different from goldens but different enough to not remind me of henry.

Update on my shortlist

Irish setter
English show Cocker spaniel

I couldn't own a breed who doesn't reach at least 8 years old cancer is in Golden's too but not as bad I've lost 2 out of 10 Goldens to cancer one at 10yrs and 8 months and Henry at 14yrs 3 months.

 

[Clodagh]

I think a setter would be completely wrong (and my mum used to work them). Bonkers, highly strung and bred to range at a distance, so that’s what they do. They would be as different to a show bred goldie as possible.
Tbh I don’t think anything would suit you better than another goldie, but I accept you don’t want that.
Show cockers seem very sweet but there are so many bad tempered ones now, Spaniel Aid are forever rehoming ones with a bite history. And I think they are very prone to ear issues? Happy to stand corrected on that.
I think a flatcoat would be better than a setter.
All just MO!

 

[J&T]

I think a setter would be completely wrong (and my mum used to work them). Bonkers, highly strung and bred to range at a distance, so that’s what they do. They would be as different to a show bred goldie as possible.
Tbh I don’t think anything would suit you better than another goldie, but I accept you don’t want that.
Show cockers seem very sweet but there are so many bad tempered ones now, Spaniel Aid are forever rehoming ones with a bite history. And I think they are very prone to ear issues? Happy to stand corrected on that.
I think a flatcoat would be better than a setter.
All just MO!

@horselib has any of the above been your experience of Irish setters?

Is their different lines like show and working?

 

[Finlib]

I think a setter would be completely wrong (and my mum used to work them). Bonkers, highly strung and bred to range at a distance, so that’s what they do. They would be as different to a show bred goldie as possible.
Tbh I don’t think anything would suit you better than another goldie, but I accept you don’t want that.
Show cockers seem very sweet but there are so many bad tempered ones now, Spaniel Aid are forever rehoming ones with a bite history. And I think they are very prone to ear issues? Happy to stand corrected on that.
I think a flatcoat would be better than a setter.
All just MO!

I do get cross when people say they are bonkers NONE of my red Setters were bonkers they were my shadows on a walk their recall was brilliant they had much less of a 'nose" than the red and whites.I would call them on a walk only to realise they were right next to my legs! All 4 have not been from a showing breeder.Do your research and you will have a gentle kind dog .The 2 that went into stroke units would gently rest their heads on people's laps for a stroke .
None of my Setters red or red and white have been highly strung!
They all went everywhere with me huge country fairs ,horse trials, riding steam trains small and large ferry boats and taken it all in their stride best of all everyone smiles when they see a Setter.My friend always says a walk takes four times as long as everyone has to say hello to my Setters.

 

[Clodagh]

I do get cross when people say they are bonkers NONE of my red Setters were bonkers they were my shadows on a walk their recall was brilliant they had much less of a 'nose" than the red and whites.I would call them on a walk only to realise they were right next to my legs! All 4 have not been from a showing breeder.Do your research and you will have a gentle kind dog .The 2 that went into stroke units would gently rest their heads on people's laps for a stroke .
None of my Setters red or red and white have been highly strung!
They all went everywhere with me huge country fairs ,horse trials, riding steam trains small and large ferry boats and taken it all in their stride best of all everyone smiles when they see a Setter.My friend always says a walk takes four times as long as everyone has to say hello to my Setters.

Fair enough, I’m delighted yours were so easy.

 

[lizziebell]

English setters and Munsterlanders are very, very scarce.

I grew up with Munsters (Large), and as already mentioned by another poster they do have a tendency to go long range out of sight, some have strong prey drive, and not always easy on recall.

 

[J&T]

I do get cross when people say they are bonkers NONE of my red Setters were bonkers they were my shadows on a walk their recall was brilliant they had much less of a 'nose" than the red and whites.I would call them on a walk only to realise they were right next to my legs! All 4 have not been from a showing breeder.Do your research and you will have a gentle kind dog .The 2 that went into stroke units would gently rest their heads on people's laps for a stroke .
None of my Setters red or red and white have been highly strung!
They all went everywhere with me huge country fairs ,horse trials, riding steam trains small and large ferry boats and taken it all in their stride best of all everyone smiles when they see a Setter.My friend always says a walk takes four times as long as everyone has to say hello to my Setters.

I guess it's down to breeder lines and what type their breeding.

I'm glad crufts isn't too far away so I can meet them in person and speak to experienced people.

Thank you for your experience of them @horselib much appreciated.

Do they go in search of saying hello to people like Goldens? Or are they more focused on their owner.

All my Goldens were focused on me but did love to get attention from others and treated every stranger like family

 

[Finlib]

They do seek out fuss if anyone goes ahhhh look at that gorgeous dog they siddle over for a fuss you hear a lot of what a beautiful dog said as you go about.Yes they adore people and seek out anyone who looks like they want a cuddle.
They are eternal puppies my present boy (17 months) often carries his cuddly toy with him when we go for a walk .
You need to put a lot of work in training them but it's worth it .

 

[Quoth]

Just to add I actually have one of the breeds suggested by another poster, a Welsh springer, and that breed would indeed meet your needs.

This is Honey my Welshie


After a period as an extremely bitey puppy, she became a very mellow but playful dog. She loves people, especially children whom she usually approaches on her belly making “please love me” noises. She’s extremely cuddly. On a walk she tends to patter along behind me. Supposedly she’s from a dual purpose line but tbh she’d make a rubbish working dog. Naturally good with other animals wild and domesticated, the exception to that is pheasant which she will go after. In fact we had an large escapee bunny trying to live feral in the garden, it was very tame, honey stalked it down the garden but didn’t really know what to do with it and ended up giving it a mutual sniff.

She is very sensitive and absolutely could not soak up mishandling in the way a harder dog might. She doesn’t like to be separated from her people at all. And she’s very soft mouthed.

She’s 11 years old now but still does the 2-3hrs a day moderate exercise my dogs get as baseline however I suspect she’d happily tolerate a fraction of that. While she gets restless if not walked she’s not usually a pain the posterior about it. Only downside is she does like the sound of her own voice.



I’m no expert on flatcoats but I did grow up with one and wouldn’t call it drivey in any way shape or form. More sensitive and exuberant than a golden or lab. She was something of a clown.

 

[J&T]

Just to add I actually have one of the breeds suggested by another poster, a Welsh springer, and that breed would indeed meet your needs.

This is Honey my Welshie
View attachment 108282View attachment 108283View attachment 108284View attachment 108285View attachment 108291View attachment 108290

After a period as an extremely bitey puppy, she became a very mellow but playful dog. She loves people, especially children whom she usually approaches on her belly making “please love me” noises. She’s extremely cuddly. On a walk she tends to patter along behind me. Supposedly she’s from a dual purpose line but tbh she’d make a rubbish working dog. Naturally good with other animals wild and domesticated, the exception to that is pheasant which she will go after. In fact we had an large escapee bunny trying to live feral in the garden, it was very tame, honey stalked it down the garden but didn’t really know what to do with it and ended up giving it a mutual sniff.

She is very sensitive and absolutely could not soak up mishandling in the way a harder dog might. She doesn’t like to be separated from her people at all. And she’s very soft mouthed.

She’s 11 years old now but still does the 2-3hrs a day moderate exercise my dogs get as baseline however I suspect she’d happily tolerate a fraction of that. While she gets restless if not walked she’s not usually a pain the posterior about it. Only downside is she does like the sound of her own voice.



I’m no expert on flatcoats but I did grow up with one and wouldn’t call it drivey in any way shape or form. More sensitive and exuberant than a golden or lab. She was something of a clown.

She's beautiful, I do like Welsh springers but my sister owns them along with English springers and she told me their more energetic and lively than a Golden and she told me about them liking the sound of their voice which put me off because of my neighbors.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

I’m another who thinks that you can’t say any breed is bonkers. It depends on the breeding/lines/exercise/training. Some people might be put off by the energy of some breeds, but they’re not all mad as! I’m currently surrounded by 3 very calm springers, who will be very lively on walks and like to do zoomies in the garden and drive me nuts for the first five minutes when I come home.

Bear is Mr Chill, flat out on my knee, would be an amazing PAT dog. They’ve been properly exercised today, did training with dummies, had company most of the day, brilliant little dogs. Maybe not ideal for someone who doesn’t have time to entertain them, but I think a show type would be amazing.

There’s a gamekeeper on Petforums (@Moobli might remember, did the most amazing photography of the dogs) who always gets a golden and a springer, 6 months apart. Get 2, @J+T!

 

[J&T]

@Cinnamontoast my sister has show springers she said they would suit me as their not far off a Goldens energy level of from a show line but less than a Welsh as she's found welsh's need a bit more.

It's the coat that puts me off as it looks like it'll be more work than a Golden

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I think a setter would be completely wrong (and my mum used to work them). Bonkers, highly strung and bred to range at a distance, so that’s what they do. They would be as different to a show bred goldie as possible.
Tbh I don’t think anything would suit you better than another goldie, but I accept you don’t want that.
Show cockers seem very sweet but there are so many bad tempered ones now, Spaniel Aid are forever rehoming ones with a bite history. And I think they are very prone to ear issues? Happy to stand corrected on that.
I think a flatcoat would be better than a setter.
All just MO!

I have known some completely mad Reds and used to get an English turning up on the doorstep regularly, by herself, owners really struggled to keep her at home. Fortunately the roads were quieter in those days.

 

[Clodagh]

I’m another who thinks that you can’t say any breed is bonkers. It depends on the breeding/lines/exercise/training. Some people might be put off by the energy of some breeds, but they’re not all mad as!

I was using bonkers as needing a lot of training and stimulation to be able to be tired enough to be calm. I will not generalise again.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

I was using bonkers as needing a lot of training and stimulation to be able to be tired enough to be calm. I will not generalise again.

Wasn‘t having a go! Just think on AAD of all places, we know better when it comes to stereotypes.

 

[Cinnamontoast]

@Cinnamontoast my sister has show springers she said they would suit me as their not far off a Goldens energy level of from a show line but less than a Welsh as she's found welsh's need a bit more.

It's the coat that puts me off as it looks like it'll be more work than a Golden

I reckon pretty similar. We clip ourselves, but it’s normally feather removal and shortening of ear hair. I won’t lie, with 3, the dust/fur can be a little overwhelming, but I’m a sh!te housewife.