moving to france - anyone taken the plunge?!!!

[lucky7]

Me and the OH are in serious discussion about moving to France this year.
We would be taking our 3 kids 9, 11 and 2 and we are expecting a baby in May. We are both self employed and lucky that i can take my business with me (online based) I have a cat & 2 horses - cob and welsh D which we plan to take with us.
The part we are looking at is south and is approx 50 mins south of Toulouse. We have found several properties to look at each with a minimum of 5 acres of land.
I know there are a few of you living in France and wanted to ask a few questions regarding horses and how you find it, pros and cons horsey wise.
How do you go about finding the following:
a farrier and a vet?
Feed suppliers
Local competition venues

Any other general info is welcomed. Thanks

 

[kateandluelue]

Hello! Im very jealous as would love to move to france. Sorry cant offer much help but i have a friend who moved over, thats good ages for your children to go and get accustom with the Language. When my friend moved over her daughter was 13 and was integrated into a french school where the teachers would not speak English to her. This was really hard for her initially but she said she picked up the language really quickly and was fluent after 1 yr.

With regards to the horses my friend who moved there advised- in some areas where there are alot of trotter racing yards, there are a good selection of vets, retail outlets etc so it may be worth speaking with local yards etc for farriers and vets?
Good luck with the move!

 

[PollyP99]

I didn't take horses with me but did ride. The main thing I would say is be very aware your 11 year old will struggle in college (secondary school) if he is going out with little french. I would be looking at private international school if I were considering taking a child of that age to France (in fact truthfully I wouldn't do it).

The younger ones should do ok but personally I didn't rate secondary education at all in France we returned here after 6 years, our son was 9 when we came back but due to go to college the next year. They go the year of their 11 birthday regardless of when the date is.

Horse wise I shared whilst there and found the flies horrendous, not much the way of fun events (fun rides etc), and grass seriously lacking in the height of hot summers. Other than that most things are available

 

[Shady]

i am in dept 12(1-2 hrs from toulouse) and was in 81 before, you say near Toulouse? is this because of the airport or you like this area? Booboos on here is down near there, she might be better than me on this,
it's very very hot there in summer, English horses can struggle with it, you will ride early in the morning or get eaten by the flies, must give them access to shade in summer, winters are very cold too
look carefully at properties, some look great but have no bridleways near them( this is a tricky one as some of the best tracks are used by the hunt and you sort of find them, google maps can help a bit but local knowledge is better)
if you like a particular house, afterwards go to the nearest village and ask about vets , schools, feed stores ( sometimes the estate agents know these things)
Anglo Info is great to pose a question on, loads of great answers on there
Greenacres and Le bon coin are fab for house hunting and you can get a better deal this way as people can multi advertise in France so the price changes and you can get a good deal buying privately.
there's so much more to say but i am happy to try and help more if you want to pm me but i don't have kids and i don't compete, sorry!!

 

[LadyRascasse]

I haven't moved to France but I worked in a feed shop where we had a customer who used to drive over from france once a month to buy his horse food as it was so expensive over there. He obviously lived in northern France so could be different in the south.

 

[sunnyone]

Our horses are 2 hours to the east of Toulouse.

Feed is sold by pet feed merchants who will also sell chicken and dog feed etc. They have names such as GammVert and Animal World. Do not expect to find straights. You're lucky if you get maintenance and competition cubes or mix. Most French only feed hay and stale baguettes it seems to me.

Blacksmith sometimes adverts on www.leboncoin.fr Again most horses kept at home are barefoot and can compete show jumping as the arena is constructed to take account of this. Don't know about other disciplines. Charges for a trim are generally about €30 in our region.

Vet, ask another owner. Our area has one that everybody for 50kms around swears by. The other vets at the practise do not touch equines, and you can be asked to bring the animal in. Ours has a crush outside for work requiring lots of light.

Local competition venues : nothing like the frequency of ours e.g. weekly dressage etc, more like one a season at a club hippique. The French have to pass riding competency exams called Galops, and be medically certified as fit to ride before they can compete at all. The good news is Toulouse has a yearly Salon Equestre which goes on for 3 or 4 days so there is interest there. Finding out about them is sometimes hit and miss but local papers generally include something.

Flies can be a pain and most treatments are useless. In the end we brought over Deosect. The horse flies do seem to be super sized. Best idea is to ride before 9.30 or after 20h 00.

A good equine web site is Chevalannonce. They also do an almanac.

For finding out about non-equine matters try the Expat Forum/France page

 

[Hilary'smum]

Have you thought of Normandy or Brittany better climate for horses, less flies in our area (Morbihan) and masses of grass. Have you thought of renting for a year? When buying either through an agent or privately the buyer pays all the costs. Can add a chunk to the price so always check if fees are included in price

I struggle to find tack stores and feed suppliers who keep a regular stock. Anglo info for your area can be very helpful.

Not sure about bridal ways we have quiet lanes and occasional off road hacking on grass.

From experience of several friends local schools are superb. For the most part children were given extra french tuition. It would be worth while having intensive French lessons before you arrive if you can.

Comparing feed prices with daughter in UK prices about the same. Hay, straw and vets (in our experience) are lower.

Good luck whatever you decide.

 

[Moodymare88]

Hi, I lived in the south if France for 18 months about 5 years ago. I live 20 minutes from Toulouse. I didn't have a horse, but worked with horses. In the summer, it got very hot, sometimes 40 degrees c, our horses struggled and they originated from there. They would go out for a couple of hours a day, sometimes in the evening when It was cooler and were ridden very early, or late!

A couple of times, they were hosed off every hour as they were so hot. We did have snow in the winter as well, and lots of it!

Feed wise...the wasn't as much variety as we have over here. Although, we did manage to get a supplier who stocked 'havens' feed and baileys, so we would order in bulk. They don't tend to compete much in July and August, due to the heat and very had ground. Tack shops over there were few and far between, although this may have changed.

The good thing is they don't have ragwort, so no need to worry about that over there. I enjoyed it, learnt a lot but felt very isolated.

I hope this helps a little bit and good luck.

 

[Hilary'smum]

Hi,

The good thing is they don't have ragwort, so no need to worry about that over there.

Not so in Northern France and well worth checking before you buy. ,
..... Here at least

 

[ROMANY 1959]

Friend of mine lives near Normandy , they are renting a small holding with 7 acres and stables. As for feed they come home to kent every 8 weeks on the ferry and buy feed in bulk with a small trailer as they can't get the same variety in France. They found a good vet but the vet is 50km away, her two horses have gone barefoot and a farrier trims for €25 A time. They don't think they will stay there once her two children get to school age, as not many schools where they live, her husband is on a contract for work there,

 

[lucky7]

Thanks everyone, lots of useful info on here
Keep it coming

 

[Palindrome]

congrats! I live in the UK but am French (from Paris though). I would say go for it, the massive advantage is that your children will have access to university for free.

For vets/farrier, you could ask on French horsey forums perhaps?
Feedwise there is a good selection at agri merchant like GammVert (although you wont find the same things than here, you can still gets oats, barley, alfalfa nuts, pony nuts, etc...). For tack and bits n bobs there is Decathlon, Padd and Horsewood.

 

[Shady]

forgot to add that Equestrian Clearance will become your new best friend and only charge 4.99 for whatever you buy, RideAway, Robinsons and Derby House also deliver but are lots more!, i also buy wormers on line as vets are pricey here for them but as others have said vet fee's are much lower but a good equine vet is harder to find, i have one that possibly goes that far as he is amazing and likes to travel but until you buy i can't say for sure.
saddle fitters are tricky to find and treeless is a swear word here!!!

 

[Booboos]

We live between Toulouse and Carcassonne.

The only international school in the area is at the north part of Toulouse so keep this in mind before you commit to a property. Also look very closely at the tax implications of being self-employed. You need the help of a very good tax accountant to set things up or you may find it is better for you not to work than to pay French taxes!

My horses came with me from the Uk and are very happy here. The climate is mild enough that they can live out 24/7 but they need shelters in the summer to provide some relief from the flies.

Vets are so so. They tend not to specialise as they do in the uk (e.g. Small animal or equine), they may refuse to come out even in an emergency and you don't stick with your vet but phone around until you find a vet willing to turn up. Some of their ideas are very old fashioned, e.g. blood letting for laminitis. The best, modern and up to date vet practice is the Clinique du Cheval in the north of Toulouse; I have to travel mine there when they have anything out of the really ordinary.

The north of Toulouse is a good area for SJ competitions. Other than that competitions are few and far between and it is nigh on impossible to qualify for the nationals. The French seem to have a different approach to competitions. Instead of small, frequent competitions, they have really huge, infrequent ones. So each competition centre might run one dressage competition a year but it will be a 3-4 day affair, with everyone staying over, having BBQs and fancy dress parties at night and entering 2 tests a day. I find this very difficult to fit in around two children.

Feeds are very simple here it is easier to buy from the UK or Kramer equitation do a decent range for smaller amounts from Germany.

Farriers, proceed with caution. Get your vet to recommend someone and keep an eye on them.

Will you be moving before you give birth? If yes keep in mind that there is quite a lot of complicated bureaucracy before you can get a carte vitale and therefore free treatment/help during pregnancy/birth.

PM me if you have any other questions.

The property market is very depressed at the moment so you should be able to get a very good deal. Beware of the local soil in places, it is extremely clay and you struggle to keep horses on it.

 

[Bobbly]

We did look at moving to France but decided it was not for us. We looked around Normandy/Brittany area as we have friends there but there was little for me to do with the horses apart from happy hacking, there is no showing scene except for specific breed shows and I don't do sj or dressage really. To compete affiliated you have to pass tests as well. From friends experience good farriers are hard to find and feed is a bit random. Have heard that you have to re-register your animals with the French authorities instead of retaining there British passport status too. One or two horsey acquaintances have now returned for these reasons. The property market is slow so there are bargains to be had but be warned, you could be stuck there for a long time if you hate it, trying to resell your property. With tax there are no allowances, you pay from the first penny you earn. in my friends area electricity is paid for at different tariffs for different days so you have to budget to do your washing etc. on the cheap days.........think carefully and check out the pro's and cons, there were too many con's for us.

 

[JCWHITE]

Lots and lots on here already to be considered, rent before committing is a good idea!
Availabilty of Engish feed is becoming easier in my area, but unless you have specialist needs, the French feed suffices.
Research research research.....

 

[Shady]

Booboos made an excellent comment regarding taxes , the government skin you alive over here in tax and social contributions if you are self employed , there are different statutes here and it is vital to get this one thing correct from the start, you need an English accountant ideally as the French ones often don't work for you but the government and will not give you the best advice( i am self employed and wish i had known 10 years ago what i know now) PM me if you would like the name of the one we use, he is excellent.
cars and white goods are very expensive here too, buy before you move.

 

[Casey76]

I'm over in Alsace, so just about as far from Toulouse as you can get.

On our yard we have baileys feed, and home grown straw and hay/haylege.

Competing wise, during the main season (Sep - Easter) we could easily get out every week for SJ with classes from 60cm up to Club1/Elite (1m/1.05) being the more common. To compete at Amateur it is much more expensive for the license and class entry fees (btw, ALL classes are "affiliated") Dressage is a little more uncommon over here, but if I was prepared to travel 1.5 hours I could probably get out 2-3 times a month. We've managed to get several people to the Nationals several years on the trot, but in Pony classes (under 18s) as we haven't had adults competing regularly yet.

Bobbly is right in that there is no "showing." You can get modele et allure" classes, but they are restricted to breed gradings mostly, and normally only occur once a year.

Also, just to say, if you want to compete at higher levels (Amateur and Pro) not only do you need your Galop exams (you need these for all classes) you also need a breed which is recognised by the Haras Nationaux, and many cross breeds aren't recognised.

 

[Booboos]

Yes the competition thing is weird. For Amateur (which is kind of affiliated level but not quite the same) you need you galop 7. You can either do galops 1 to 7 or you get the local RC instructor to assess you and certify you - sounds daunting but it's easy. For Amateur the horse has to be registered and only horses with a recognised pedigree may be registered. All horses arriving in France have to have their passports registered. This is a bit costly and bureaucratic but no big deal. You have to have a French vet out to fill in the forms, you pay a fee and send everything in...then you spend a few months correcting mistakes, sorting out supplementary documentation and eventually you get your passport back with a few pages added. They do not swap British passports for French ones.

 

[Polos Mum]

My inlaws moved to France because property was cheap - what they forgot to consider is how much more expensive everything else is there! From tax to food. When they come to visit they fill a van with everything to last them (shampoo, toothpaste, clothes, food (esp veggy food) and even cheese) they can save the £100's for the cost of the ferry/ petrol, just by stocking up on basics.

Just make sure you do all your research before you commit.

 

[Bobbly]

We have a shopping list for my friends when we visit, we take Sainsbury red label tea bags, Mars bars (they say the French version taste differently) bacon by the shed load and cheddar cheese, stir in sauces and toothpaste. Have also taken pots of coloured paint and plants for the garden and it seems screws are very expensive....?

 

[DragonSlayer]

We have a shopping list for my friends when we visit, we take Sainsbury red label tea bags, Mars bars (they say the French version taste differently) bacon by the shed load and cheddar cheese, stir in sauces and toothpaste. Have also taken pots of coloured paint and plants for the garden and it seems screws are very expensive....?

I thought taking things like food and 'flora and fauna' had strict regs or is that outside the EU?

 

[Polos Mum]

that outside the EU?

Yep into/ out of Europe you can do what you like.

Bobby - glad it's not just my inlaws that are mad enough to take cheese TO France !! And you're right I'd forgotten about DIY equipment, they also bring their car back for service and new tyre etc! The day to day costs must be mad to drive 8 hours for a new tyre!

 

[Palindrome]

That's a bit strange as I find things tend to be less expensive in France, at least due to the conversion pound/euro (except for used cars due to not being a large international market for right hand drive cars I'm told), but with everything there is a range of price depending on quality and brand. You also have stores like Aldi.

You do not pay tax if you earn below a certain amount a year and this amount also depends if you have dependents like children.

From my experience of living abroad, 1st in the US and then in the UK, the main barrier is the difference in culture, then the fact that you might be far away from family/friends. I took straight away to the US but it took me at least a year to settle in the UK due to cultural differences (and the wet weather). I would say moving to south of France, you will tend to fit in better if you are a laid back type and like warm weather and fresh evenings on the patio. People will generally tend to be warm and not afraid of humane contact.

 

[Tern]

They take away 75% from taxes if you earn 1m.. just saying. The really strip you with taxes like Shady said.

 

[Booboos]

The south in particular is very Mediterranean in its approach to life which can be a bit of an adjustment for Northern Europeans. France does not share the Anglo-Saxon culture that unites much of US and UK values. Rather than individual liberties and voluntarism you have an emphasis on the State providing and service for the public good.

Tern the 75% tax was an emergency measure that has expired
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/12/23/us-france-supertax-idUSKBN0K11CC20141223

More relevant in probably the wealth tax. That affects more people than you might think as they calculate the value of all your assets, e.g. house, car, even horses, property abroad, etc. to arrive at the figure so it is relatively easy to exceed the threshold. There are exceptions and ways around things but a good accountant is a must!

 

[Amicus]

I knew a family who moved out there a few years ago both self-employed with four kids 7-15 all loved france but have moved back due to the tax laws involving self-employment (something like you have to pay it at the start of the business year) they said if it hadn't been for them being self-employed they'd have stayed so worth looking into. Sorry don't know any details!