Mud rash that will not heal

ycbm said:
I can't swear it's related but I've not had a case of mud fever since I started feeding copper and zinc.
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I'm at that stage of being torn between trying everything feed related, and wondering whether to wait a little bit and see if the Nano-E and/ or hay change make a difference.

My Silver Whinnys have just arrived so I'm going to start by trying them on her fronts. Wish us luck!
 
HashRouge said:
I'm at that stage of being torn between trying everything feed related, and wondering whether to wait a little bit and see if the Nano-E and/ or hay change make a difference.

My Silver Whinnys have just arrived so I'm going to start by trying them on her fronts. Wish us luck!
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Inwould definitely go one at a time normally otherwise you'll never know what worked, but in the UK I would have every horse I'm responsible for on copper and zinc all year because of general high iron levels, and on vitamin E November to April for lack of fresh green stuff.
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bluehorse said:
Gosh I could have written your post! I am struggling with this too. My silver sox arrived on Friday so he was turned out in them on Saturday with woof boots over the top to keep them up. I was very impressed as his legs were clean and looked really good but Sunday morning he totally refused to let me put them on. He’s such a polite soul but he waved a leg at me so I knew he meant it. I’ve tried everything, over the counter and vet prescribed. His legs are filling so I think it was just hurting when I was trying to put them on, apparently they do loosen off a bit after a while so I’m not giving up just yet. He’s now on oral steroids which seem to be helping and for turnout his white socks are slathered in silver spray as turnout boots rubbed and inflamed the whole situation. My vet has said not to turn out unless in boots but silver spray is doing a much better job for him. When he comes in i wash his legs with warm water and rub in aqueous cream so that it gets quite frothy. Leave for 15 mins and then wash it again with warm water and the scabs start to come away. He‘s on steroids every other day but I’ve got him on one or two Danilon a day as the legs are filling which make his skin split. He’s also on a vet cream which has an aqueous base but also has antibiotics and steroids. I rub that in twice a day. all of this seems to be improving things but what I have found out is that what works one minute doesn’t seem to work for long. I don’t have a diagnosis but suspect LV, vet said it can be an auto-immune disorder where the body just attacks itself. I feel a bit more hopeful I can sort it out and as soon as his legs are a bit more comfortable for me to handle I’ll be putting the sox on. Hope you find a solution.
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I was always told to minimise washing, and avoid daily washing
 
Fieldlife said:
I was always told to minimise washing, and avoid daily washing
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absolutely, until I stopped washing and cleaning I didn't make progress. What worked was just the vet's cream once a day and SOX with nothing on top of them to let the air through with electrical tape to support them if needed. SOX removed at night in the stable and then washed overnight unless you have 2 pairs.

Mine had been on a good dose of vit E for years and also zinc and copper. I am pretty sure it was auto immune. I can't prove it but t he only thing that was different was that I fed him herbs. I don't know if this stimulated or affected him but it seemed a strange coincidence I had had no problems until then and no problems since. Obviously I stopped the herbs when I wondered if they were the underlying cause.
 
Daktarin athletes foot spray got rid of my horse's infection. It started in August and got progressively worse, spreading to all his legs with white socks, while I tried the standard creams and stuff. Used the Daktarin twice a day and washed and thoroughly dried his legs whenever they got properly muddy - it cleared up in a few weeks. May have been coincidence, but give it a try.
 
Fieldlife said:
I was always told to minimise washing, and avoid daily washing
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I had several vets out to mine over the course of his condition. The first one told me to scrub the scabs off daily and the second told me to leave them alone and apply the cream over them. If the vets don't know what's best there's no hope for the rest of us.
 
If you can get close enough another remedy is Zinc Ointment. It gets very sticky in cold weather so keep it in the house for pliability.
I heard about this from an old boy, years ago, he said they used to apply it to the legs of the horses in WW1 to protect them from the mud.
This goes along with ycmb's beliefs.
 
Hello folks, I'm afraid she was put to sleep yesterday afternoon. What I didn't post in my OP, because it was too painful, was that she had also started to find it hard to get up after rolling. I hoped and hoped it was just because the mud rash was so painful, but yesterday it was clear that she really couldn't manage anymore. She did get up, but it was heart breaking to watch her struggle and I knew the time had come. It's why I was so reluctant to keep her in, because I was worried that we were close to the end and I wanted her last few days to be in the field with her best friend. I think really the mud rash just exacerbated existing problems. We knew she had arthritis in her neck and the vet thought she probably had some neurological issues going on as a result that were making her a bit wobbly. This, combined with painful mud rash, meant it was all just too much. She went quickly and peacefully and with as much dignity as can be hoped for. She was 30 years old and I had her for over 21 years, since I was 11. She was the best girl, and I will miss her so so much.
 
HashRouge said:
Hello folks, I'm afraid she was put to sleep yesterday afternoon. What I didn't post in my OP, because it was too painful, was that she had also started to find it hard to get up after rolling. I hoped and hoped it was just because the mud rash was so painful, but yesterday it was clear that she really couldn't manage anymore. She did get up, but it was heart breaking to watch her struggle and I knew the time had come. It's why I was so reluctant to keep her in, because I was worried that we were close to the end and I wanted her last few days to be in the field with her best friend. I think really the mud rash just exacerbated existing problems. We knew she had arthritis in her neck and the vet thought she probably had some neurological issues going on as a result that were making her a bit wobbly. This, combined with painful mud rash, meant it was all just too much. She went quickly and peacefully and with as much dignity as can be hoped for. She was 30 years old and I had her for over 21 years, since I was 11. She was the best girl, and I will miss her so so much.
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What a sad update. I really feel for you.

I'm so sorry. I had one PTS for exactly the same reason, couldn't get up easily. Very hard decision to have to make in that situation but you know there is just no choice. It is all you can do for them.

RIP little horse.
 
paddy555 said:
What a sad update. I really feel for you.

I'm so sorry. I had one PTS for exactly the same reason, couldn't get up easily. Very hard decision to have to make in that situation but you know there is just no choice. It is all you can do for them.

RIP little horse.
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Thank you xxx
It was hard because she was still very much her feisty self, but it's a decision that sort of makes itself because you can't risk them not being able to get up at all, or hurting themselves trying.
 
HashRouge said:
Thank you xxx
It was hard because she was still very much her feisty self, but it's a decision that sort of makes itself because you can't risk them not being able to get up at all, or hurting themselves trying.
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I absolutely do know where you are coming from with this. For mine it was I want him PTS today because he may not be able to get up by the morning if he goes down over night. He spent the day very happily in his paddock with not a care in the world whilst I spent the day feeling cr*p.
It is difficult to say how much I know what you are feeling now. Take care of yourself.
 
im so sorry to hear this HR ? You fought for her recovery with everything you could, making the hardest but kindest decision in the end.
Im so sorry you had to go through this, her age would have been a limiting factor with healing, and you bravely made the call ..big hug x


Here’s some info you may find useful to fit some jigsaw pieces about her case together:

I was going to mention as reading this thread today from your first post, your instinct to stop ryegrass and switch to meadow was likely right.
Ryegrass contains photosensitising compounds that can affect pink-skinned areas of horses, thin-skinned areas of sny colour horse (legs and facial bone areas) and/or horses with weak/damaged livers, and worst case scenario is both affecting a horse.
The PS compounds are normally filtered by the liver so that photosensitivity isnt an issue in healthy black-skinned (majority of) horses, except those with weak livers (more likely the older they are), wont filter the PS compounds efficiently and they circulate in the bloodstream at too high levels causing skin photosensitivity symptoms - the main overt symptoms being facial sunburn, but also scabbing on the body.

No matter the season the ultraviolet light is strong enough to cause a ‘skin scab’ reaction, ive known it to occur in winter horses. Strong sunlight just makes it a lot worse more quickly, but clouds let UV lightwaves through too.

Older horses have weaker constitutions to de-tox PS compounds quickly, so can become burdened moreso by them and their whole-body effects. They dont just affect skin but internally the inflammation makes all systems have to work harder. We just notice them to be more lethargic and down outwardly, with skin issues.
PS compounds are also in some antibiotics, so if we suspect a PS case is happening we need to be careful not to use certain antibiotics, as they compound the issue.

My grey young gelding had an attack of this 6 yrs ago - he was fit and young and it was very concerning at the time if he would de-tox this issue and pull through. It was compounded by a toxic plant in some haylage he had. So he had that plant weaken his liver, then the PS compounds of the ryegrass that was part of his diet were circulating at high levels in his blood causing his skin to become sensitised to UV light. This was black-skin legs and face. He had hives due to the toxin on nis body, then his legs got scabby, in patches and oozed serum, due to the ryegrass PS compounds.

It was touch and go, and at the time i didnt know about the PS compounds - so continued feeding ryegrass haylage. The other haylage had the toxic weeds in it causing instant huge chest/body trunk hives so immediately had to stop that!
I gave him everything i could to detox liver from the toxic weed, thinking that was my only problem causing his symptoms, and 3 weeks later the hives were gone and the leg scabs took slower to heal, but eventually did, with the hair falling out.
Having helped his liver it then could filter the PS compounds in the ryegrass from the blood, causing the leg scabs to heal.
At the time i thought the leg scabs were hives turned very sore. But his body hives never developed scabs and oozed serum. The legs seem to be affected by PS moreso, and the facial pink nose skin, or thin-skinned areas.

I havent found despite looking, exacting studies detailing whether photosensitising compounds in ryegrass have increased over the years with all the GM ryegrass grown now. The info isnt easy to find if its out there. But i find tetraploid and diploid ryegrass have uprated sugar bred into them, so it may be that the PS compounds have increased too. Hence why even cattle farmers growing fields of tetra and diploid ryegrass are seeing more cases of PS in their herds.

Any ill horse and those with liver issues needs ryegrass eliminating while the health/ liver issues are ongoing. PS symptoms themselves can be indicative there’s a liver issue in the horse.
It’s very difficult to know this is occurring with the ill horse, because we have other ‘overt’ diagnoses that have been around for years vets are more likely to diagnose. Im not sure the vet world is up to date with understanding the link between skin issues and PS compounds in ryegrass. Ryegrass is SO common in many hays and haylages now in the equine feed world too, compared to even 10 yrs ago.

My boy was young and very vibrantly healthy, no health issues, and it almost caused him to be PTS as the symptoms were within and without weakening him in various ways. An older horse i can imagine would easily be floored by this, especially if there’s unknown weak/damaged liver health. I was shocked how quickly things went south with him, so can understand many horses with other known compounding health issues not being able to recover, forcing the pts decision to alleviate the suffering.
 
HashRouge said:
Hello folks, I'm afraid she was put to sleep yesterday afternoon. What I didn't post in my OP, because it was too painful, was that she had also started to find it hard to get up after rolling. I hoped and hoped it was just because the mud rash was so painful, but yesterday it was clear that she really couldn't manage anymore. She did get up, but it was heart breaking to watch her struggle and I knew the time had come. It's why I was so reluctant to keep her in, because I was worried that we were close to the end and I wanted her last few days to be in the field with her best friend. I think really the mud rash just exacerbated existing problems. We knew she had arthritis in her neck and the vet thought she probably had some neurological issues going on as a result that were making her a bit wobbly. This, combined with painful mud rash, meant it was all just too much. She went quickly and peacefully and with as much dignity as can be hoped for. She was 30 years old and I had her for over 21 years, since I was 11. She was the best girl, and I will miss her so so much.
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So very sorry. That is just brutal. RIP Lass.
 
Flame_ said:
Daktarin athletes foot spray got rid of my horse's infection. It started in August and got progressively worse, spreading to all his legs with white socks, while I tried the standard creams and stuff. Used the Daktarin twice a day and washed and thoroughly dried his legs whenever they got properly muddy - it cleared up in a few weeks. May have been coincidence, but give it a try.
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I've used that before as well a d it got rid of it have used it on rain scald as well a vet told me to use it.
 
Oh my gosh I’m so sorry. What a special thing to have a horse for 21 years, but how heartbreaking to let her go. You made the best choice for her and gave her a peaceful and dignified end. Please look after yourself and take some comfort that you gave her an amazing long life. Having made the same decision to prevent further suffering, I wouldn’t wish it on anyone. Take care of yourself x
 
irishdraft said:
Was just reading your thread OP and came across your sad news, so sorry to see this x
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Me too. I'm so sorry HR.

I was going to say her symptoms were very similar to Monty's but his wasn't mud fever at all it was a sugar allergy. We controlled it for a few years by giving him a very low sugar diet but even a bit of a flush in the grass was enough to set it off and it he was becoming less and less tolerant of any sugar in his diet. He was unbearably itchy all the time. It was one of the reasons we had to let him go in the end.
 
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