My poor daughter

Basically yes. You cannot drive someone to hospital in an emergency situation (I think you would be ok for a check up, or booked operation.) We were told if someone fell off nd we felt they needed to go to hospital, we were to call an ambulance and under no circumstances allow someone to drive them.

It's illegal, because it's illegal to drive a car without insurance.
 
It might not state it on your insurance, but that is what we were told. It's like you are not allowed to take money from people as you are acting as a taxi, you carry people in a emrgency, you are acting as an ambulance. And to be honest if someone was in a lot of pain in the back of you car and throwing up etc, you probably would drive more eratically, be distracted and more likely to be involved in a accident.. We argued with the guy about it means it will take more time to get to hospital by the time you wait for an ambulance, but he was adament it was the law, and I believe him.
 
Well that certainly is food for thought, but what a stupid law that is.
I mean you only have to have children in the car to be distracted don't you? Is there a law against that too?
My hubby drove me to hospital when I was in labour, I must tell him what a lawbreaker he is
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I have a friend who is a police woman, I'm going to ask her if this is correct.

So sorry to highjack your thread like this skewbald, I hope your daughter recovers ok.
 
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Basically yes. You cannot drive someone to hospital in an emergency situation (I think you would be ok for a check up, or booked operation.) We were told if someone fell off nd we felt they needed to go to hospital, we were to call an ambulance and under no circumstances allow someone to drive them.

It's illegal, because it's illegal to drive a car without insurance.

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I must say, I have never heard this before in 17 years of driving
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Infact, I have heard it suggested that in some cases it is quicker to drive an injured person to hospital. Obviously that depends on the injury.

Are you sure they didn't mean that it is safer for somone with serious injuries to be taken to hospital by ambulance?
 
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I have a friend who is a police woman, I'm going to ask her if this is correct.



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Do you? Are you sure she is a police woman ??
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I must check this, as I also run youth groups, and I must admit we have it in our accident plan that one of us might take a slightly injured child to hospital. It would have to be awfully slight though, it's pretty much always an ambulance job with other peoples' kids.
DH is home now, and intends to write to the practice manager to complain. His concern, like the paramedic's and many people on here, is that they packed me off to a location I had said I had no idea how to find, with a potentially worsening casualty in the car.
 
The thing is, it is illegal to drive while uninsured, so it doesn't have to be illegal to drive with an injured person in the car, if the insurance companies sneak it into their conditions, does it, it becomes illegal by default.
I wonder if it's true? You 'd have to ask an honest insurance underwriter.
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I have grave doubts on this. Many times a Dr will suggest a patient is driven by car to hospital as it can be quicker than waiting for an ambulance. Being uninsured is being uninsured, regardless of any passenger.We should also remeber that not everything we are told is true (not meaning any offence by this post, just stunned)

Any links to this info please?


Sorry the-skewbald, What an idiot of a receptionist, just hope your daughter feels 100% better
 
I would imagine that if it were a part of your insurance conditions, it would be in their terms and conditions. They wouldn't have a cat in hells chance of upholding such a condition if it weren't.
 
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I have a friend who is a police woman, I'm going to ask her if this is correct.



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Do you? Are you sure she is a police woman ??
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For the purposes of this she is!!
 
But as far as I know, anything you are not covered for (within reason) is detailed in the policy document (eg that you can't use the car for business purposes unless specified)! I'll check this too as I've been driving for 27 years and I have never heard it said!
 
I too have had the misfortune of attending a BHS first aid course...and they were probably trying to advise us, as members of the public, against adopting the role of a paramedic. If we did so, we would not be covered by the car insurance, should the injured party suffer further as a result of our actions. People are becoming increasingly worried about litigation.
Your car insurance will be fine, especially if you are carrying your own family and friends. The only question in terms of insuring cars and passengers, would be if you were deemed to be using your car for work purposes, and you had stated it was a leisure vehicle.
Generally, if you work with/teach children, it is a good idea to avoid ever being alone in a car with them, injured or otherwise.
S
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I am fairly sure that it is NOT illegal to drive an injured person in your vehicle. In order for the insurance to be invalid, the cover would have to specifically state that and it doesn't cover you for transporting an injured person to hospital (or at least mine doesn't). It does say that i cannot accept money, so if someone asked me to take an injured person to hospital for money, then that would invalidate the insurance.
 
This is why as volunteers, we have ended up with almost no scenarios where we would take them anywhere. We are not allowed to be alone in the car with them so we would have to take another adult, (or another child, which is usually not a very bright idea, you must admit!) and in most circumstances, that would leave either not enough adults back where we were starting from, or another adult alone with another child!!!
It's a bally nightmare.
Mind you, of course, in this case, it was my daughter so that angle doesn't exist.
In the dark days of long ago, on one of my brief forays out of horses, (either fed up with having black, cracked hands, or had fallen for some chap who didn't do rural, can't remember which but either way didn't last long!) I worked in an insurance office. Can't say I remember this being an exclusion, but it kind of wouldn't surprise me, if they thought they could swing not paying a few claims this way. It would have to be stated in the policy document, but it wouldn't have to be in plain english, shall we say?!
 
I have heard similar.. my friends gran had a stroke, doctor said to take her to hosipital as it would be quicker, when arrived at hospital, the doctor went beserk and said it was illegal and the insurance wouldn't be valid and we should have called an ambulance
 
How can it invalidate the insurance if the policy does not specifically state the driver of the vehicle cannot carry an injured person?

Google it and see what comes up.
 
Sorry to cause such a debate!
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I really don't know, it was just what I was told by the first aid people, although as S would probably agree they are slightly, shall we say "self important"!! Don't want to be mean, they are lovely people, but I'm anyone who has met them would agree.

I just saw what they said had some logic behind it, and I certainly now won't travel someone with an emergency problem in my car. But maybe the scenario would be different if it were family. I don't know.
 
I think that possibly people are getting mixed up over Car Insurance and the possibility of opening yourself up to be sued if anything inapropriate/untoward happened?
 
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.. but not surprising
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My 85 year old dad fell, he crawled to phone , doctors receptionist actually told him that as he had got to the phone there wasn't much up with him
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He couldn't get in my mums car, the pain was too bad and I don't live in the U.K., so they wait and call and wait and.....

12 hours later, yep, 12 hours later a district nurse came to see him, , my poor dad had broken his hip
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Bloody doctors receptionists ....

(( Good vibes))) to you and yours x
 
Ive worked in Insurance for 14 years (sad I know) and have never heard it invalidates your insurance. It would have to be part of the policy conditions if it invalidates a compulsory insurance so I would say its not true.
 
Hubby is at work tonight and works next door to an ambulance station. They often pop into the shop, so if he gets a chance, he will see what the Ambulance Staff think.
 
I hope your daughter is soon feeling better. I too have a horror story to do with doctors receptionists too. My friends son was off colour the week before xmas, he was only 11 weeks old and was a prem baby so had only been home from hospital about 4 weeks at the time.

So anyway his mum rang nhs direct, described his symptoms and was told he wasn't an emergency but to ring the doctors in the morning. So my friend sat up literally all night with her son, and then rang the surgery up at 8am when it opens. They gave her an appointment for 10:30am, she told them that she thought that was too late, but they wouldn't budge. Anyway by 9am he was getting worse so she rang back again, only to be told by the receptionist that she was being a fussy mother and thats she had been given an appointment "what more did she want!", anyway my friend decided to take him round to the surgery and wait there in the hope that he'd be seen sooner.

The doctor saw him at 10:30 and dialled 999 without even taking him out of his snowsuit because he was grey, floppy and lifeless. Our local hospital does not accept children and the hospital that belongs to the same trust that he should have gone too is about 10 miles away and the paramedics deemed it too risky for him to be taken there as he may not have survived the journey and so he was taken to a different nhs trust hospital- where he was in ICU for a week- on a ventilator, and then in hospital for a further 5 weeks (including his first xmas and new year). Does that sound like a fussy mother??
 
Should I pop in and resolve this one????........
Oh go on then.....here we go...

Firstly... I know how people react to any accident, especially if you are out and about on your horse. Sometimes thinking becomes slightly confused and you do what you think is right at the time!
In the event of ANY accident, take a step back, take a very big deep breath....then take another....look at the bigger picture and think what just occured.
In this case you did what you could, you did what you thought was right...nobody can fault you....
HOWEVER... in the event of an accident and you have the smallest reason to suspect any concussion/knock to the head, or in a riding accident with any sort of fall that WAS NOT clean and straight froward.....
DONT move the casualty, allow a few minutes to recompose if they insist they are ok, only then should they move VERY slowly and very carefully. In children or those who appear to have been concussed, get an ambulance out, don't worry about em being busy or saving money....just get on the phone and get the casualty seen by an expert...the ambulance service will not think bad of you even if they only attend, assess and advise.Not all patients need to attend hospital....however only an expert can make that call!!!

If this situation occurs to anyone again, and you attend a GP surgery, be aware that if a patient condition is getting worse, insist on a nurse or doctor seeing that patient before transport. It is a right, and can be demanded, NEVER EVER allow a receptionist to make the call, most only hold a very basic first aid cert, if anything. If your in a surgery and you feel the need to upgrade the response, as the patient is getting worse, insist the surgery call and ambulance.....
DO NOT leave to make the journey in a private vehicle, whilst in the surgery you are in the proximity of life saving equipment and people who know how to use it.

With regards to this vehicle insurance issue.....
In law, there is NO SUCH INVALIDATION of policy clause, you can transport anybody to any location at any time if you have standard insurance. The passenger can be DEAD, still you are insured.
If the need arises to transport a patient from any accident scene, you need to make careful considerations....
1) Will the patient remain stable and in the same condition for the whole journey?
2)Is it safe for the patient to be transported at normal road speed, under normal conditions
3) Is it likely you may need emergency assistance whilst on that journey
4) Is the vehicle suitable for the patient with the injury?

In most cases, after asking the above, it will result in you requesting a ambulance..... with the exception of the most minor injuries, ie hand/foot injury / minor cuts and grazes.

Anything like a suspected fracture/back injury/internal injury/crush injury.....calll 999, even a qualified first aider should not attempt to transport people with these injuries.

Again, your insurance won't be invalidated, as you are NOT acting as an ambulance... the definition of which is a vehicle carrying a stretcher and designed to transport persons on a stretcher. However always remember....if a patient needs to be transported to hospital at speed....CALL 999, you are not qualified to transport at high speed and outside of road traffic regulations.
Some first aid trainers advise of the do not transport suggestion for your own good, if something goes wrong or your involved in another accident on the way, you could end up with a rather serious situation on your hands. However they should not make comment on insurance policy, and to do so could render them unsuitable to be trainers!!

If the need to carry out first aid should arise, think.... are you trained and confident to assist without doing harm? There is only one GOLDEN RULE in first aid....."DO NO HARM" and you will have no issue with compensation etc.
If everybody walked on by and failed to assist when trained, because they were scared of being chased for compo etc, many many more people would die as a result.

If your involved with horses, or any other high risk activity...you really should be considering first aid training, the more people we have amongst us, who can assist confidently, the safer the sport will become. It doesn't take a lot of your time, it's fairly cheap and it will give you an enormous confidence boost knowing what to do when a scary situation occurs.

If you need more advice on getting trained...feel free to pm me, UK wide, you can get trained cheaply....by full time ambulance staff and medics!!
 
Thankyou Boltonrider. You have clarified the fact that your insurance will NOT be invalid, but that the condition of the patient is the crucial factor.
 
OMG I hope she is OK. I'm afraid that is the sort of attitude you get these days. My surgery nearly killed me a few years ago as they told me there was nothing wrong with me. I had a severe chest infection and I suffer from chronic asthma!!! Was told to come back in a week! I was in hospital the next day and my husband was told I had an hour to live! If in any doubt now he takes me to A&E where I know I'll get the right treatment.
 
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I hope your daughter is soon feeling better. I too have a horror story to do with doctors receptionists too. My friends son was off colour the week before xmas, he was only 11 weeks old and was a prem baby so had only been home from hospital about 4 weeks at the time.

So anyway his mum rang nhs direct, described his symptoms and was told he wasn't an emergency but to ring the doctors in the morning. So my friend sat up literally all night with her son, and then rang the surgery up at 8am when it opens. They gave her an appointment for 10:30am, she told them that she thought that was too late, but they wouldn't budge. Anyway by 9am he was getting worse so she rang back again, only to be told by the receptionist that she was being a fussy mother and thats she had been given an appointment "what more did she want!", anyway my friend decided to take him round to the surgery and wait there in the hope that he'd be seen sooner.

The doctor saw him at 10:30 and dialled 999 without even taking him out of his snowsuit because he was grey, floppy and lifeless. Our local hospital does not accept children and the hospital that belongs to the same trust that he should have gone too is about 10 miles away and the paramedics deemed it too risky for him to be taken there as he may not have survived the journey and so he was taken to a different nhs trust hospital- where he was in ICU for a week- on a ventilator, and then in hospital for a further 5 weeks (including his first xmas and new year). Does that sound like a fussy mother??

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Thank goodness he recovered, that is terrible.

My daughter was very poorly a few weeks ago. She was a bit off colour in the morning. I put her in bed, hubby was home so I quickly dashed off to see to the horse.

When I got back, she was out of bed sat on the sofa with a temperature sky high, she was lethargic, floppy, couldn't hold her head up and we had to close the curtains as she couldn't stand the light. I telephoned the doctors and was given an appointment for 4 hours later. I had to argue for that appointment, the receptionist wanted to book her in for 2 days later.

My daughter was 20 months old. Over the next hour, her temp was rising and calpol was doing nothing. We took her vest off and saw the rash.

I put her in the car, got to the doctors and got the ususal off of the receptionist. So I flipped and refused to move until she saw a doctor.

Doctor came out, took one look at her at practically shoved us into his room. He gave my daughter a thorough check up, did the glass test on the rash and it did disappear. We were told to watch her very closely through the night, take her temp every 30 mins and take her back in the morning. If we felt she was getting worse, to take her straight to hospital.

The receptionist had a face like slapped a@@e when I walked back through. The doctor walked with us and gave her a look of death!
 
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