Nappy horse - again

Kirstineridesagain

Kirstineridesagain

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My share horse has slight arthritis in one front leg, has just been treated for ulcers but has been declared fit for light work. My main issue, which has been the same in all the time I’ve known him, is napping. Particularly when he’s on his own out hacking, but also with company (to a lesser extent). He will do it throughout the hack and will just stop, usually after passing a person on foot going in the opposite direction. He tries to go up to them, I think he’s looking for a treat. 😂 But he won’t move after they’ve gone and then I’m sat on him for ten minutes, trying to get him to move, before jumping off and leading him for a bit before jumping back on. If I’m in company and he naps, the person on the ground or on horseback can lead him a bit and that helps too. But I am usually riding on my own due to difficulties finding riding company.

I’m almost at my wit’s end but if I stop riding him no one else will. He’s never been easy to ride. He should have a bit of exercise to keep him fit but I’m finding the getting on and getting off really off putting (party’s since I’m not great at getting on from the ground without the saddle slipping).

(The horse has regular physio and saddle was recently checked, and he’s been like this for years apparently, just wondering what to do when the napping happens to get him to move forwards).
 
I’d suspect arthritis is worse than you realise - possibly more widespread? Mine had ulcers and would nap. He had thin soles and wasn’t coping in hoofboots anymore. We shod him, treated the ulcers and he’s not stopped since. Stopping and ulcers are symptoms of pain, not misbehaviour. Speak to his owner and ask them if they could get the vet to check him over 😊
 
mustardsmum said:
I’d suspect arthritis is worse than you realise - possibly more widespread? Mine had ulcers and would nap. He had thin soles and wasn’t coping in hoofboots anymore. We shod him, treated the ulcers and he’s not stopped since. Stopping and ulcers are symptoms of pain, not misbehaviour. Speak to his owner and ask them if they could get the vet to check him over 😊
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Yes, could be. He came running down the field to see me the other day - but carrying a rider is of course more work. He’s shod and the ulcers should be gone by now…
 
Kirstineridesagain said:
Yes, could be. He came running down the field to see me the other day - but carrying a rider is of course more work. He’s shod and the ulcers should be gone by now…
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Did they not do another scope to check?? Baffled why people don’t do this!

They may not have gone, they could be the same or worse, depending on the type of ulcer and location they can be very difficult to treat. I would suggest you ask the owner to get him scoped again to check. And yes sounds like the arthritis could be more widespread too.
 
Mine does this though had gotten better with age (he does still try and mug people). Also very arthritic. But I think the difference for me is that mine has done it since he was 2 and from the very first ride I ever had on him so for him, it is quite normal. I think it's a lack of confidence for him (he has never been a confident horse) which can be worse when he is now having an arthritis flare up. He's 19 next month and has a few other odd things that he does that never stopped doing since a baby. Has the horse always been that way?
 
My retired lad started napping a hell of a lot more when his arthritis was progressing - it was one of the hints he was dropping, along with not standing to be tacked up, sluggish off the leg and generally not liking his ridden work.

Perhaps your share horse's arthritis has progressed a lot further than anyone realises and his napping has been slowly getting worse over the years cause it's causing more problems for him?

I'm a believer that horses act certain ways because they are trying to tell us something - they don't wake up planning to be naughty and inconvenience us.

Personally if he were my share, I'd insist on another scope to check for ulcers (there is a high chance that they aren't completely gone and I can't see from your original post that he had a follow up scope to see if they were gone the first time) and not be riding him. You can still give him exercise by walking him out in hand etc, but personally the history of ulcers and arthritis is saying to me that he is possibly having a flare up of the ulcers due to the arthritis and it's a never ending circle.

On a different note - has your share always been nappy to hack? Some horses are naturally less confident and this manifests itself as the nappy behaviour. What happens if you sit there and use the "wait him out" approach? No smacking with a whip or yelling, just sitting there and waiting him out to see what happens. This can take a long while so probably best to do when you have plenty of time. Another thing I am wondering - what happens if you ask him to back up in the direction you want to go and then after a few steps turn him around so he is facing the right way? It's a lot more work for him to go backwards and then turn to face where he is going. However, I'd be careful employing this tactic as it can be turned against you if not careful.
 
mustardsmum said:
I’d suspect arthritis is worse than you realise - possibly more widespread? Mine had ulcers and would nap. He had thin soles and wasn’t coping in hoofboots anymore. We shod him, treated the ulcers and he’s not stopped since. Stopping and ulcers are symptoms of pain, not misbehaviour. Speak to his owner and ask them if they could get the vet to check him over 😊
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Yes - difficult because he's a share but if he were mine I'd be talking to the vet about trying him on bute for a couple of weeks to see if he becomes any more cheerful about his work (in case it's the arthritis doing it).
 
My horse is exactly the same napping wise. It isn't ulcer or arthritis related but purely napping. Not saying it is only naughty behaviour, there is some genuine fear there but if he gets 'away with it' next time it is worse. Don't be like me and give up, it needs patience, understanding and perseverance. My horse also likes to follow some random person which I let him once. He followed for a while until he realised 'where am I and why am I following this random person'? :eek:
 
Is this is the same horse you were riding last year that struggled so much with hills you had to get off and lead him? Wasn’t he described as having a stiff back and stubborn and lazy?

I’m sorry but it sounds like pain. I think he’s struggling and doesn’t know how else he can tell you this other than napping.
 
I’m coming to the conclusion that he may need to retire. He’s been like this for years, apparently. But he’s nearly 20 now and he’s telling me he’s had enough, I think. I’m taking him out Friday morning with a friend and her horse, they’re only doing a short one, and it may be our last hack out together. I’ll see how he is in company then.
 
It’s sad - we’ve had some lovely hacks despite his nappiness. I’ve never pushed him too much, and let him be a slow and steady horse, given him breaks and never done more than three rides per week, at the most. We managed to get a third place in an Icelandic competition and he did me so proud. He’s big (for an Icelandic), with a strong build (plus some extra weight) and we look and feel like a good match (when he’s on form). But maybe I’m not a rubbish rider, maybe he’s just not wanting to work anymore. He’s a stunning horse and I will really miss being behind his ears and enormous blonde mane.
 
A vet once told me the worst thing you can do for an arthritic horse is stop exercising. After she treated his hocks she said our pony must be ridden everyday to keep his joints mobile. The difference was huge, I swear that’s how we got him to his mid 20’s. Chat to owner and vet - keeping him mobile is actually important, it’s the same as people. If you get the extra weight off him that could also make a big difference. You can ride on bute, the key is keep him comfortable and keep him moving.
 
mustardsmum said:
A vet once told me the worst thing you can do for an arthritic horse is stop exercising. After she treated his hocks she said our pony must be ridden everyday to keep his joints mobile. The difference was huge, I swear that’s how we got him to his mid 20’s. Chat to owner and vet - keeping him mobile is actually important, it’s the same as people. If you get the extra weight off him that could also make a big difference. You can ride on bute, the key is keep him comfortable and keep him moving.
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Stopping riding doesn't equal stopping exercising though - you can walk a horse in hand to build fitness and muscle strength without the strain of carrying a rider.
 
Yes, you can, but he’s quite strong when leading on the ground and dives for grass constantly. If he were mine I would probably put in more effort, but also got a mare in foal to tend to so not sure realistically how much time I want to spend walking him in hand.
 
Some horses nap for the sake of it, not every single napper has an issue but to get a horse through it, needs a strong confident rider.
BB was a terrible napper and he had no issues, apart from colic twice. He was just scared of hacking alone but when he was with another horse, he would show off.
It took me about 2 months to get him to stop napping and actually realise that going out alone was less hassle and drama and actually fun. After that, he never napped again and we went wherever we wanted ☺️
 
Kirstineridesagain said:
Yes, you can, but he’s quite strong when leading on the ground and dives for grass constantly. If he were mine I would probably put in more effort, but also got a mare in foal to tend to so not sure realistically how much time I want to spend walking him in hand.
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Nobody has any obligation to exercise a horse to keep arthritis at bay. Our obligation is to keep our horses free of ongoing pain. That obligation rests with the owner, not you.
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Little update. Went out on Friday and he was the best he’s been in months. Suddenly cantering up a little hill where he’s never cantered before! And then cantering twice more on the hack. He did stop dead in his tracks once. He refused to go down a very steep but short bit, then when I offered the alternative route, which is much easier, he just stopped again. I got off and lead him down, got back on and he just went on as if nothing had happened. He walked faster than usual, too. Now the other horse company definitely helped, so I’m thinking taking him out by himself is just not worth it. But I will go out on a few more short hacks (this one was about 30 minutes) in company, and keep monitoring him. He runs to see me in the field (probably hungry!), and isn’t girthy when I saddle up anymore. So ulcers hopefully successfully treated.

I’ll also sign him up for another massage - well renowned physio at the yard.
 
Kirstineridesagain said:
He refused to go down a very steep but short bit, then when I offered the alternative route, which is much easier, he just stopped again.
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Sorry to pick up on one thing, but this is interesting because struggling to walk downhill can indicate arthritis behind. Obviously I don't know your horse so I'm not saying that's what it is, but it's just worth bearing in mind. My horse has an arthritic hock and although it is managed, I do tend to lead rather than ride him down steep hills.

Glad to hear you had such a nice ride on Friday, hopefully the napping was ulcer related and now they're treated, he is more comfortable.
 
Barton Bounty said:
Some horses nap for the sake of it, not every single napper has an issue but to get a horse through it, needs a strong confident rider.
BB was a terrible napper and he had no issues, apart from colic twice. He was just scared of hacking alone but when he was with another horse, he would show off.
It took me about 2 months to get him to stop napping and actually realise that going out alone was less hassle and drama and actually fun. After that, he never napped again and we went wherever we wanted ☺️
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No horse ever naps for the sake of it. I thought we'd all moved past this idea by now.
 
ycbm said:
Nobody has any obligation to exercise a horse to keep arthritis at bay. Our obligation is to keep our horses free of ongoing pain. That obligation rests with the owner, not you.
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I cant imagine ever expecting a sharer to stop riding but keep coming up to lead out a bolshy horse. I cant see the owner asking for that either. Pain killers and turn out work just as well as a 30mins wander down the lane.
 
mustardsmum said:
I’d suspect arthritis is worse than you realise - possibly more widespread? Mine had ulcers and would nap. He had thin soles and wasn’t coping in hoofboots anymore. We shod him, treated the ulcers and he’s not stopped since. Stopping and ulcers are symptoms of pain, not misbehaviour. Speak to his owner and ask them if they could get the vet to check him over 😊
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Mine is the same - she’s naturally not keen to hack alone and is definitely spookier/more insecure alone, but only really naps when something isn’t right. First was a keratoma, then when she needed hind shoes. There’s a fab equine behaviourist called Gemma Pearson who strongly claims that the vast majority of napping is due to pain.

Widgeon said:
Sorry to pick up on one thing, but this is interesting because struggling to walk downhill can indicate arthritis behind. Obviously I don't know your horse so I'm not saying that's what it is, but it's just worth bearing in mind. My horse has an arthritic hock and although it is managed, I do tend to lead rather than ride him down steep hills.

Glad to hear you had such a nice ride on Friday, hopefully the napping was ulcer related and now they're treated, he is more comfortable.
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KatieDM said:
I seem to recall that issues with going downhill can also point towards stifle problems? Has that been investigated? Obviously you’re just sharing so unless the owner is willing to do a full work up and investigations, it probably won’t get resolved.
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The other potential issue with downhill is navicular, or in my horse’s case it was a keratoma in her front hoof.
 
He went willingly down a much longer, steeper hill without napping. And since Friday we went down the same short hill and he didn’t nap. I agree that horses don’t nap for fun, but he is a bit of a puzzle of a horse - since he was quite young he’s had this behaviour, he’s seen by a vet regularly, a physio has assessed him as well recently, and without a complete work up it’s impossible to find out exactly what’s bothering him.
 
Gloi said:
It's often insecurity. They get confidence from their fieldmates so need to be able to take confidence from the rider to be happy to leave home.
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If I lead him on the ground he never naps (much - apart from trying to nibble grass). He does sometimes “freeze” when he sees something strange, so it could be a form of spooking. Thankfully he never takes off.
 
Yesterday he surprised me again. Went out with two others. One is doing rehab and had to do a certain amount of trot, but no cantering. He had no problem keeping up, and did more trotting (tolting) than he’s ever done on a hack. I had to hold him back at one point. Totally different horse, ears forward, only stopped twice for a few seconds (he is quite unfit). If I can keep taking him out with others I think he’s happy (and I will be too - he was genuinely fun to ride yesterday). Even in walk he was energetic, smooth and fast - I’m baffled at the change. Maybe the ulcers were bothering him quite a bit before.
 
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