Nappy horse - help

[sjdress]

Horse started napping about 6 months ago. Vet investigations revealed some issues which have now been treated, however upon coming back into work is napping again leaving the yard. Doesn’t do it with more professional riders, or will try briefly but they can get her going easily. I am really struggling! I do get her going eventually but after a bit of a fight/ stress etc. I’ve been told to give her a smack but feel nervous to do this, which I think she then picks up on my nerves. I’ve pony club kicked, growled etc and she just spins of goes backwards.
so upset as she didn’t do this before her issues. She is now sound and is only doing it leaving the yard so I am wondering if it’s a habit. All other pain symptoms have gone so I’d like to think she is no longer in pain…
I am wondering if she needs a better rider and I should cut my loses and sell or if I keep pushing through and eventually she will come right. Feeling at a loss of what to do.

 

[Birker2020]

Horse started napping about 6 months ago. Vet investigations revealed some issues which have now been treated, however upon coming back into work is napping again leaving the yard. Doesn’t do it with more professional riders, or will try briefly but they can get her going easily. I am really struggling! I do get her going eventually but after a bit of a fight/ stress etc. I’ve been told to give her a smack but feel nervous to do this, which I think she then picks up on my nerves. I’ve pony club kicked, growled etc and she just spins of goes backwards.
so upset as she didn’t do this before her issues. She is now sound and is only doing it leaving the yard so I am wondering if it’s a habit. All other pain symptoms have gone so I’d like to think she is no longer in pain…
I am wondering if she needs a better rider and I should cut my loses and sell or if I keep pushing through and eventually she will come right. Feeling at a loss of what to do.

Try turning her bum towards the gate abd asking her to walk backwards. Even if you can't get her through the gate this way you may find when you ask her to move forwards after, she will as it's very boring walking backwards.

It worked for my horse!

 

[Skib]

Both my beloved share horses have napped. Horses are genetically programmed to maximise food intake and minimise energy used. They also want to stay with the herd. My share napped yesterday but only on leaving the yard to hack solo. And the YM had to exercise authority to force her to go. I was told to hit the mare, that hitting my boot with my whip was not enough. That next time I ride her, I must hit her sharply on the shoulder.

I am an old lady rider and I dont like to argue with a horse when I am on its back and it is standing on tarmac. But I have decided next week (if she naps again) to use what I call the Richard Davison kick. One of his training DVDs shows his wife's horse unwilling to go from halt to walk. He tells her to lift both legs away from the horse and give it a single sharp kick with both legs. I have used this once on an RS pony but I have also been out with a RS escort on a slow cob who was completely unable to use this kick to get her horse moving. You really need give the horse an almighty kick and to do it sharply and with conviction.

Out hacking on my own I have found Mark Rashid's advice useful. Almost any horse that is napping will move on after 13 minutes, so just sit on it and wait. But most humans will wait only for 9 minutes. The horses I ride, have moved on long before the 9 minutes are up.

And remind yourself that though your horse may be stronger than you, you have the better brain. Dont imagine that you need to be a fantastic rider. Just think it out.

 

[scats]

I have a napper who will think nothing of standing on her back legs if too much pressure is applied. I find hopping off, leading her a short way and hopping back on solves most issues.

 

[AppyLover1996]

My now retired lad was a chronic napper and would absolutely bronc, rear, shy, spin and do absolutely everything to avoid going forwards. I made the decision to not ride until I worked out what bothered him and it turns out it was a case of him being anxious, and then when I would nag him to move on with my leg, tap with the whip behind my leg etc, it would be enough to trigger the explosion. Pressure is not always the answer when it comes to horses and I once had a professional put too much pressure on my retired lad, who went up vertical, came down and did the most almighty bronc he ever did in his life - said professional refused to get back on board and suggested I had him shot - imagine their surprise when 6 months later, I'm hacking him past their place tackless with no issues.....

Anyway back to your conundrum - I would check tack fit and teeth to see if she isn't trying to tell you something, just cause the veterinary issues are fixed, there might be secondary issues to work through. Providing that the above comes back fine, I would then speak to the professionals and see if they can come out and give you a lesson on how they managed to get her to move forwards (I noticed you mentioned that pro riders can get her to move but she won't for you) as they might have a technique or trick which doesn't involve anything that could raise your anxiety levels and escalate the situation. One thing I'm wondering is will she willingly leave the yard if you have a foot soldier? If she'll follow a foot soldier out the yard, I would start with that and do small circular routes to start off with, have the foot soldier in front at all times and then gradually work your way to the point where the foot soldier comes along but stays back so they are still there for backup if needed but you and your mare are leading. Once confident with that I'd try leaving the foot soldier at home (but carry a mobile phone in case of emergency!) and trying to hack out on your own. Finally - the good old fashioned wait it out method hasn't failed me and I've used it on everything from little 12.2 kids ponies all the way up to big Shires who aren't afraid to throw their weight around.

Good luck

 

[Boulty]

What happens if you lead her on foot out of the gate and then get on further down the drive? (leave yourself an appropriate mounting block at your chosen point) Or if that’s too much lead her until well away from the yard & then hop on? The theory being that you gradually get on at an earlier & earlier point until you’re mounting in the yard and just going wherever from there.

Obviously relies on the horse being reliable to lead and happy to leave without a fuss if you’re on foot but may help you avoid having the argument & help the horse feel more confident about leaving the yard

 

[sjdress]

Once she’s decided no she won’t lead In hand either , either plants herself or goes backwards! There are a few yards along the lane from our yard and she seems to try and stop at every single one so wonder if she’s attached/nervous. Previously to the lameness issues she would hack anywhere and never say no, it’s extremely frustrating and upsetting

 

[maya2008]

If one sharp smack worked for the pros (and she didn’t buck or react negatively) then it is worth a try. She’s perhaps feeling unsure and has lost her confidence a bit, then feeds off your nerves. I’ve seen children lose confidence in trying harder things following a period of time in which they were in pain (injury/illness). It wasn’t conscious, just feeling a little fragile, and lasted for many many months afterwards. Not out of the realms of possibility that a horse might feel the same.

 

[asmp]

Do you ever have a wingman? One who will be happy to go behind at times so your horse is in the lead?

 

[sjdress]

Do you ever have a wingman? One who will be happy to go behind at times so your horse is in the lead?

Yep once she has left the yard she’ll go in front, behind, wherever !

 

[4Hoofed]

If getting off and leading doesn’t work I would work on some ground work stuff as well in the arena or yard like yielding hind and fore quarters, backing up, bending the neck as some in the meanwhile homework. And repeat the same ridden in the yard. When the reluctant behaviour comes out if it’s safe to do so you can let her stand and then back her up, turn on the hindquarters, turn on the forehand etc, either mounted or ridden and basically make it harder work to be there then just walking forwards.

Another solution I have had great success is to just wait it out. A old gent I worked for gave me the very sage advice once of why on earth are you trying to physically fight with something 10x your size and strength. The one caveat I always have with this technique is not to let them rest the leg, snack or look around. Just stand and look where we want to go. If they even take half a step biiig reward well done pony. I do think eventually they get bored and go.

I don’t blame you for not wanting to give her a smack etc, and especially if she did have some physical issues in the past she may have some bad associations and some learnt behaviours.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

I would ask her to stand in the gateway facing the way you want to go. Don't kick or anything, just sit. If she moves in any other direction other than where you want to go, again face her that way and ask her to stand. Eventually she will get bored, it could take hours, but once she walks on of her own accord you may find she doesn't do it again. It also means you are nice and calm as you basically have to do nothing!! Its worked for me in the past.

 

[Peglo]

I think I watched a video that encouraged nagging rather than force. So tip taps with your heels repeatedly until horse moves forwards. Not hard, just softly to make it annoying. As soon as they move forward stop tapping. If they stop again back to tapping. It doesn’t matter how slow they move forward the tapping must stop as soon as they move so they are rewarded for going forwards. It might take patience to start with until she realises that going forward is more comfortable.

I’ve tried it walking horses too. Wiggling the rope and asking forwards rather than pulling. I’ve found it quite effective

 

[Skib]

Anyway back to your conundrum - I would check tack fit and teeth to see if she isn't trying to tell you something

Is she too hot? It is so warm here at the moment and though she is clipped, when I untacked her, she was sweaty under her girth and numnah even after a hack that was almost entirely in walk.
The first time this share mare napped with me, it was an exceptionally hot day and we were on meadows with no shade. It was a heat wave summer and she had already carted one novice rider straight back home. So I am convinced that her napping means she doesnt want to leave the shade or that something is uncomfortable. Last week I thought it was the bridle. But I guess it was once again the heat.

 

[Alibear]

Out hacking on my own I have found Mark Rashid's advice useful. Almost any horse that is napping will move on after 13 minutes, so just sit on it and wait. But most humans will wait only for 9 minutes. The horses I ride, have moved on long before the 9 minutes are up.

Thanks for this, it wasn't a nap but Amber was spooked about a corner of the arena last night, as there were horses in bright turn out the other side of the hedge. This starts most winters and becomes a battle. So I just sat with her facing it for 13+ minutes no fuss no bother and then she walked on without any issue.

 

[Skib]

Thanks for this, it wasn't a nap but Amber was spooked about a corner of the arena last night,

Well done you for giving her the time

The Pippa Funnel video from which I learned much of my riding (unlikely I know) has her riding in the school on a horse that spooks on the short side near the same corner each time, due to a white van parked in the lane that ran by that side of the school, I seem to remember. You may find the vid on You tube. As far as I can remember she repeatedly circled round that same corner. Just accustomising the horse to the van. I dont remember her forcing the horse but I do know she rode with more authority than I did at the time and my escorts out hacking would sometimes tell me it was time for my Pippa Funnel act. Meaning, Take charge of the animal.
One can also reduce spooks by lowering the horse's head. It is something to do with the depth of focus, that they lower the head and have a close up focus to view the grass they are grazing. A high head indicates they are focused on the horizon and may tense at the possible danger lurking there.
If you are schooling in a correct outline (which I dont really do these days0) the movement of the horse's head is then limited by the reins, so a horse might appear more spooky in the school than when you were out hacking.

 

[Birker2020]

I have a napper who will think nothing of standing on her back legs if too much pressure is applied. I find hopping off, leading her a short way and hopping back on solves most issues.

Yep I think the secret is to rein back but not be over restrictive with the hands whilst using the legs at the same time.

 

[dorsetladette]

Can you trot out of the yard? just straight off the bat, hop on and go! don't give her or you time to think about it. Get behind her and really push forward with all your 'doors' shut as it were so she only has forward to go. A couple of times of that and you should be fine I would have thought.

If the above isn't an option I'd walk her out in hand and get on once your past the nappy bit. With hoping off to solve the issue you really need to do it before the apprehension gets hold to avoid the backwards thinking to kick in. timing is important.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I have a napper who will think nothing of standing on her back legs if too much pressure is applied. I find hopping off, leading her a short way and hopping back on solves most issues.

This mine is the same and it's not worth hitting them it just upsets them and it then becomes a negative experience for everyone.

The horse is quite new to you so just take time and be patient, I got mine better by leading him on a very short route everyday for a week then I would lead him part of the way then get on and eventually rode him the whole way.

Once he confidently hacked that route I repeated the process with a new one and he did get much better.

 

[sjdress]

Had a better time today. Got on and straight away I could feel her tensing up and falling out her shoulder, almost like she was anticipating the napping.
So I just made her stand and wait. We then moved off and we got half way down the track when she stopped, I didn’t let her turn so she reversed. I sat it out and eventually she went forward and we completed the rest of the hack with no issues. I’ll just have to keep chipping away at it I think: just wish I knew why she was going it and what’s causing it

 

[dorsetladette]

Had a better time today. Got on and straight away I could feel her tensing up and falling out her shoulder, almost like she was anticipating the napping.
So I just made her stand and wait. We then moved off and we got half way down the track when she stopped, I didn’t let her turn so she reversed. I sat it out and eventually she went forward and we completed the rest of the hack with no issues. I’ll just have to keep chipping away at it I think: just wish I knew why she was going it and what’s causing it

brilliant news - well done! Keep us up dated.

 

[Breather]

Horse started napping about 6 months ago. Vet investigations revealed some issues which have now been treated, however upon coming back into work is napping again leaving the yard. Doesn’t do it with more professional riders, or will try briefly but they can get her going easily. I am really struggling! I do get her going eventually but after a bit of a fight/ stress etc. I’ve been told to give her a smack but feel nervous to do this, which I think she then picks up on my nerves. I’ve pony club kicked, growled etc and she just spins of goes backwards.
so upset as she didn’t do this before her issues. She is now sound and is only doing it leaving the yard so I am wondering if it’s a habit. All other pain symptoms have gone so I’d like to think she is no longer in pain…
I am wondering if she needs a better rider and I should cut my loses and sell or if I keep pushing through and eventually she will come right. Feeling at a loss of what to do.

Breathe. Remember to breathe. Notice your breathing. Notice your horse's breathing.
Breathe deeply and calm for your horse.
Notice how your breathing changes in different situations with your horse.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

Had a better time today. Got on and straight away I could feel her tensing up and falling out her shoulder, almost like she was anticipating the napping.
So I just made her stand and wait. We then moved off and we got half way down the track when she stopped, I didn’t let her turn so she reversed. I sat it out and eventually she went forward and we completed the rest of the hack with no issues. I’ll just have to keep chipping away at it I think: just wish I knew why she was going it and what’s causing it

In my experience te less you fight them the quicker they come round. My retired lad would just stop dead and spin for home for no reason. I always had a battle with him to get going again. After reading about just sitting and waiting he napped again, I sat and waited it out and he never did it again!
Well done for hacking out successfully

 

[eahotson]

Both my beloved share horses have napped. Horses are genetically programmed to maximise food intake and minimise energy used. They also want to stay with the herd. My share napped yesterday but only on leaving the yard to hack solo. And the YM had to exercise authority to force her to go. I was told to hit the mare, that hitting my boot with my whip was not enough. That next time I ride her, I must hit her sharply on the shoulder.

I am an old lady rider and I dont like to argue with a horse when I am on its back and it is standing on tarmac. But I have decided next week (if she naps again) to use what I call the Richard Davison kick. One of his training DVDs shows his wife's horse unwilling to go from halt to walk. He tells her to lift both legs away from the horse and give it a single sharp kick with both legs. I have used this once on an RS pony but I have also been out with a RS escort on a slow cob who was completely unable to use this kick to get her horse moving. You really need give the horse an almighty kick and to do it sharply and with conviction.

Out hacking on my own I have found Mark Rashid's advice useful. Almost any horse that is napping will move on after 13 minutes, so just sit on it and wait. But most humans will wait only for 9 minutes. The horses I ride, have moved on long before the 9 minutes are up.

And remind yourself that though your horse may be stronger than you, you have the better brain. Dont imagine that you need to be a fantastic rider. Just think it out.

Lot of good advice there.

 

[Northern Hare]

Some excellent advice I was given for when a horse shies/naps and spins, is that the rider must not continue turning the horse in the direction of the horse's spin to get the horse facing forward again.

So if the horse shies/naps and spins half way around to the left, do not continue turning him to the left to get the horse facing forward again - you must insist that he turns back to the right to face forward.

Keep doing this and it will make a massive difference - it really helps to break the cycle, but it has to be every time.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

Some excellent advice I was given for when a horse shies/naps and spins, is that the rider must not continue turning the horse in the direction of the horse's spin to get the horse facing forward again.

So if the horse shies/naps and spins half way around to the left, do not continue turning him to the left to get the horse facing forward again - you must insist that he turns back to the right to face forward.

Keep doing this and it will make a massive difference - it really helps to break the cycle, but it has to be every time.

Depends on the horse. I was always told this but then I had a new mare that used to nap to the right and the only way with her was to continue with the turn and drive on as she straightened out. If you so much as touched the left rein she stiffened and went up. We got round it by my sister making sure to ride up on my right at any possible right turn and she would just shepherd her past or round to the left. Eventually she forgot all about it.

 

[khalswitz]

This

My now retired lad was a chronic napper and would absolutely bronc, rear, shy, spin and do absolutely everything to avoid going forwards. I made the decision to not ride until I worked out what bothered him and it turns out it was a case of him being anxious, and then when I would nag him to move on with my leg, tap with the whip behind my leg etc, it would be enough to trigger the explosion. Pressure is not always the answer when it comes to horses and I once had a professional put too much pressure on my retired lad, who went up vertical, came down and did the most almighty bronc he ever did in his life - said professional refused to get back on board and suggested I had him shot - imagine their surprise when 6 months later, I'm hacking him past their place tackless with no issues.....

Anyway back to your conundrum - I would check tack fit and teeth to see if she isn't trying to tell you something, just cause the veterinary issues are fixed, there might be secondary issues to work through. Providing that the above comes back fine, I would then speak to the professionals and see if they can come out and give you a lesson on how they managed to get her to move forwards (I noticed you mentioned that pro riders can get her to move but she won't for you) as they might have a technique or trick which doesn't involve anything that could raise your anxiety levels and escalate the situation. One thing I'm wondering is will she willingly leave the yard if you have a foot soldier? If she'll follow a foot soldier out the yard, I would start with that and do small circular routes to start off with, have the foot soldier in front at all times and then gradually work your way to the point where the foot soldier comes along but stays back so they are still there for backup if needed but you and your mare are leading. Once confident with that I'd try leaving the foot soldier at home (but carry a mobile phone in case of emergency!) and trying to hack out on your own. Finally - the good old fashioned wait it out method hasn't failed me and I've used it on everything from little 12.2 kids ponies all the way up to big Shires who aren't afraid to throw their weight around.

Good luck

My now retired lad was a chronic napper and would absolutely bronc, rear, shy, spin and do absolutely everything to avoid going forwards. I made the decision to not ride until I worked out what bothered him and it turns out it was a case of him being anxious, and then when I would nag him to move on with my leg, tap with the whip behind my leg etc, it would be enough to trigger the explosion. Pressure is not always the answer when it comes to horses and I once had a professional put too much pressure on my retired lad, who went up vertical, came down and did the most almighty bronc he ever did in his life - said professional refused to get back on board and suggested I had him shot - imagine their surprise when 6 months later, I'm hacking him past their place tackless with no issues.....

Anyway back to your conundrum - I would check tack fit and teeth to see if she isn't trying to tell you something, just cause the veterinary issues are fixed, there might be secondary issues to work through. Providing that the above comes back fine, I would then speak to the professionals and see if they can come out and give you a lesson on how they managed to get her to move forwards (I noticed you mentioned that pro riders can get her to move but she won't for you) as they might have a technique or trick which doesn't involve anything that could raise your anxiety levels and escalate the situation. One thing I'm wondering is will she willingly leave the yard if you have a foot soldier? If she'll follow a foot soldier out the yard, I would start with that and do small circular routes to start off with, have the foot soldier in front at all times and then gradually work your way to the point where the foot soldier comes along but stays back so they are still there for backup if needed but you and your mare are leading. Once confident with that I'd try leaving the foot soldier at home (but carry a mobile phone in case of emergency!) and trying to hack out on your own. Finally - the good old fashioned wait it out method hasn't failed me and I've used it on everything from little 12.2 kids ponies all the way up to big Shires who aren't afraid to throw their weight around.

Good luck

Agree on the foot soldier - mine was a nightmare to start and would buck if any pressure was put on, so my husband walked with us.

He was there to just keep walking past for her to follow if she planted, but she walks faster so he’d end up behind when she was confident. By the end she’d lead off and not notice him there, all easy, but just meant she had a confidence boost when needed.

Another thing that worked was getting her trotting whenever I felt her back off, but before she stopped dead. Lots of voice and getting her going actively forward helped avoid stops.