Nasty dressage judge?

[Batgirl]

'I think at lower levels they think they have to prove how much they know, when in fact they are just showing what k*obs they are.'

What a horrid sweeping statement. I am at lower level and new to judging. I certainly am encouraging and get fantastic feedback about my judging. I think you will find that the kn*bs are the people who are kn*bs, whether they are a judge or not is irrelevant.

I appreciate that we all like to judge bash a bit but the sport wouldn't happen without judges, so report the kn*bs to the organisers and BD where appropriate and appreciate the nices ones. Simple.

If I were judging a test that was like yours sounded I would have serious concerns about your control and ability to take a horse cross county, that said I wouldn't be rude about it as I am not a kn*b. When I am responsible for riders safety it is dangerous of me to assume that 'I bet it goes double clear', what if it has an accident instead, I am not in the habit of gambling with peoples lives.

I am sorry OP had a bad time and the judge sounds rude but everyone wading in with their judge bashing two penneth worth, be careful how many potential judges you might put off. Already there are far too few new yung judges coming through and without judges you can do you sport. We are VOLUNTEERs you know.

 

[honetpot]

'I think at lower levels they think they have to prove how much they know, when in fact they are just showing what k*obs they are.'

What a horrid sweeping statement. I am at lower level and new to judging. I certainly am encouraging and get fantastic feedback about my judging. I think you will find that the kn*bs are the people who are kn*bs, whether they are a judge or not is irrelevant.

I appreciate that we all like to judge bash a bit but the sport wouldn't happen without judges, so report the kn*bs to the organisers and BD where appropriate and appreciate the nices ones. Simple.

If I were judging a test that was like yours sounded I would have serious concerns about your control and ability to take a horse cross county, that said I wouldn't be rude about it as I am not a kn*b. When I am responsible for riders safety it is dangerous of me to assume that 'I bet it goes double clear', what if it has an accident instead, I am not in the habit of gambling with peoples lives.

I am sorry OP had a bad time and the judge sounds rude but everyone wading in with their judge bashing two penneth worth, be careful how many potential judges you might put off. Already there are far too few new yung judges coming through and without judges you can do you sport. We are VOLUNTEERs you know.

I was not judge bashing, its just in my experience, and I have written for people who have not had BD training and people who are List 1 doing PSG, that the more experienced the judge and also so the more qualified, the more insightful the comments are. There are some people who are completely out of their depth and the training that BD does weans them out and there is a lot of reflection on the marking.
You do not have to be qualified in anything to be polite, just because you think the rider should be doing a better job than they are doing not give you the right to be rude and sometimes cruel and make comments that are sometimes will read by children that they would be hauled over the coals for if they said them to their face. If you think a rider would be out of control XC, that's your opinion, but as the biting and tack is often different the combination may gel better and its the ground and jump stewards job to decide.
Being sat in an enclosed space with someone who has no tact and diplomacy and being expected to write things which I think down right rude judged is not pleasant, and that why I will not write them. When you write for someone who looks at the whole picture, with insightful comments, and wry humour its a joy and these people are often also excellent teachers which can not be coincidence.
I volunteer for a lot of things, the fact that an event uses volunteers should not effect how it is run, or the standard of judging, they have paid to enter, you also have to take into account that a lot of centres are commercial enterprises and think who is actually getting the most benefit out of the volunteer.
I am one of these people who hear everything and say now't, but I to pass on my comments to organisers, its up to them to decide but you only have to look at showing people vote with their feet.

 

[glamourpuss]

This does sound an unpleasant experience but I have to agree with the poster who saw it through the eyes of the judge a little.

To be honest if I saw a very excited, unbalanced horse which appeared to be struggling with a simple dressage test, I'd probably question the safety of the rider taking said horse SJ & XC as well. I remember once at a BE80 watching a girl on a horse do an awful dressage test (& trust me I've done BAD tests so I know how it can happen), she then went on to SJ & that was dreadful as well (cat leaping & very little control). Nothing was done & XC they suffered a near rotational & the rider broke her wrist really badly!

Obviously in your case you knew the horse would be ok to jump but the judge didn't.

This isn't me knocking you or doubting you as a rider at all, it's hard when your confidence is low & thus may have caused you to feel more sting from the judge's words than was probably intended.

 

[JFTDWS]

How horrid for you! I had a lovely little Welsh C & we did well at dressage up to elementary, unafilliated, Trailblazers etc. We went to out 2nd round elementary TB qualifier & rode a neat & accurate test, just the medium trot lacking which was just because of her type & build, everyone else was on big warmblood type horses. The judge told me afterwards that she "Thought I was very brave to even attempt this level on something like that" I was so upset that I wrote to BD although not their show & said how could they hope to encourage ordinary riders to join if that's what the judges think & not everyone wants a massive WB. They replied & said that although TB wasn't run by them they would contact the judge as she was listed & call her in for re training, result! Oh & we went to the finals & came 12th, very respectable! So don't let her put you off!

I had a not dissimilar comment from a very famous classical trainer/judge riding an elementary on my highland (who is more than competent at that level) Bizarrely, if they had managed to add up and calculate a % correctly, even she would've given him 69% for that test - somehow they managed to calculate it as 55%. I saw another sheet which should've been 68% but actually was listed as 78% :eek3: . I was livid, but not BD so nobody to complain to.

 

[Booboos]

What an awful experience! I'd let the organisers know. Judges are volunteers but that doesn't excuse them being mean and rude!

I once started the wrong test (I had learnt an earlier version). The judge rung the bell, we figured out what had happened and I was very apologetic and willing to call it a day. The judge let me continue with a caller but spent the whole time the caller was walking to the arena berating me for being an idiot, asking how someone could be so stupid as to learn the wrong test, on and on and in. Ironically the judge them misapplied the penalty for starting the wrong test!

 

[EventingMum]

I think most of us who have had competitive experience have had dressage judges we hope never judge us again and some we would like to judge us every time we go out. In the end you just hope that you end up with more of the later overall. We had a horse who wasn't a natural dressage horse, however he could jump the moon and was bold, held his lines and would always give his best xc. We just had to take the rough with the smooth, having had some none too pleasant comments, one memorably when the dressage arenas were just over the river from the end of the xc and horses were thundering along opposite him, he just couldn't keep a lid on it and exploded, the judge had a field day! At least twice at internationals the judges were 20+ marks apart and from the sheets you'd have thought they were looking at different tests. To balance it up we've had the odd good day too, especially when the judge called my son over at the end of the test and thanked him for producing a test that was such a pleasure to watch. With dressage you have to have a thick skin, despite judge training it is still to some degree subjective, however rude comments shouldn't be necessary.

 

[Pebble101]

I had a not dissimilar comment from a very famous classical trainer/judge riding an elementary on my highland (who is more than competent at that level) Bizarrely, if they had managed to add up and calculate a % correctly, even she would've given him 69% for that test - somehow they managed to calculate it as 55%. I saw another sheet which should've been 68% but actually was listed as 78% :eek3: . I was livid, but not BD so nobody to complain to.

I's not the judge who adds the scores though.

The judge rang the bell to say I had gone wrong once and I hadn't. It made it really difficult as I lost my train of thought and didn't have a caller.

 

[Pebble101]

Obviously in your case you knew the horse would be ok to jump but the judge didn't.

Which is why the dressage judge shouldn't be able to stop someone continuing with the rest of the day - the SJ is where it can be easily stopped if things are that bad. My lad's legs could go everywhere in the dressage test but he knew exactly where his legs were when jumping. I did a gridwork clinic once where he cantered down a line of 26 trot poles and didn't touch one. The instructor (very well known and high level) said he would have worried about my horse if he didn't know exactly where all his legs were. And that horse is probably the safest I have ever done XC on because he looks after himself and therefore me. I never had any dodgy jumps on him, the only time I came off him was on the flat when he slipped on a corner but I got back on and we were still place - I used studs after that.

 

[JFTDWS]

I's not the judge who adds the scores though.

No, but it is the judge who gives the individual scores and comments - and it is incongruous to give a horse nearly 70% whilst suggesting it is ambitious to attempt this level on such a small horse... I spoke to the judge after the competition - it was definitely not a positive comment, and the judge felt it was vindicated by the poor % on his sheet (which bore no relation to the % he actually should have received).