Navicular and work/training issue

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A1fie

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Hi - I'd be grateful for some advice/experience on working a horse with navicular. My horse has got many issues with his legs. Currently he is correctively shod and sound. He has been brought slowly back into work over the last year and has hunted over the winter (on good ground and only for a couple of hours at a time).

All he has done all his life is hunting. He was never schooled by his previous owners. Consequently he has never learned to carry himself properly. Due to past pain related issues, he found a way of moving that was most comfortable/least painful for him.

He is no longer in pain but still has the same gait, the typical short strides associated with navicular.

Now he is fit and his back, teeth and feet have all been sorted out I would like to start training him to balance himself properly. I have previously been his fifth leg and would try and support him myself (v silly idea!)

He had physio the other week and his front end is 100 times better than it was but his back end is weak. He basically pulls himself along with his front legs instead of pushing from behind.

I have started lunging him gently once a week in an equiami and working him over cross poles a couple of times a week to help him start to build up muscles from behind. Additionally my instructor will ride him and give me a lesson on him alternatively once a week.

What I would like to know is whether it is possible for him to be trained to lengthen his strides if he has navicular or whether it would be unfair to make him try because of the possible pain it might cause?

I do not know whether he has navicular disease or symptons because he also has arthritis as well. The last xrays he had didn't show he did have it but he was not being tested specifically for it.

I think that it has to help him to learn how to hold himself properly but equally I don't want to ask him to do something that he just will not be able to do as it is unfair.

Any advice or suggestions would be gratefully received.
 
I would up the lunge work, but use a Pessoa (I don't know the one you're using, so forgive me if it does the same thing). I'd work him five days a week on it, starting with ten minutes a session (I'm all for doing things slowly).

You could also have him going over poles - have them in a row, have each pole alternately raised ends. This will help to strengthen the stomach muscles, which in turn will help to improve how he holds his body.
 
Sorry, forgot to say that I odn't know anything about the navicular angle, but if he's been hutnign then he should be able to cope with gentle muscle build up exercises one would have thought :). Check with your vet if you're not sure though.
 
Thank you Mrs M! Physio said lunging only once a week at the moment. An Equiami is similar to a pessoa but it is a continuous loop and so horse can't lean on it, nor does it sock it in jaw! I chose it because if my lad can lean on anything he will!
 
I don't really understand your post because you say he has Navicular and then further on you say you don't know if he has it because you only had him x-ray'd for arthritis, although he also has "many issues with his legs".


I am sorry it that sounds harsh because I obviously don't know all the details, but from what you say, I would be grateful the horse was rideable and I would concentrate on just quiet hacking.
 
It's not so much the muscle build up I'm concerned about, it's more whether he would actually be able to lenghten his stride without it causing him pain, if you see what I mean.

It's difficult to know how much of how is going is due to habit or the thought of pain, or whether he short strides because he physically can't lengthen them because of the navicular. Am probably not explaining it very well!
 
Tracey - no it doesn't sound harsh I admit it is confusing. I just didn't want to go through in detail all his past history. His symptons point towards navicular but it hasn't been formally diagosed. His other issues include arthritis of coffin joint and some possibly beginning of ring bone. The question was really whether if a short striding horse has navicular is it possible through training to help him lengthen it and carry himself better.

I am grateful he can be ridden but obviously want to help him to be the best and most comfortable he can and if training will help him then I think that it is better than him slopping around.
 
yes it is possible to get him striding out more - mine has navicular, arthritis in hocks and coffin joint on front right.
She is worked 6 days a week, schooling or lunging and very rarely hacked. We hace lessons from a dressage trainer - we have worked to get her balance better and to bring the point of balance back instead of dragging herself around on the forehand. She now does push more with hindlegs, she brings wither up and when she brings wither up we can get medium trot. This is from a choppy short striding horse.
I have a nice contact where she can rest her 'chops on' my hands !!! she isnt leaning but i am part of her balance system - she needs my contact and she doesnt pull on me and i dont pull on her.

you can use lunging, poles but you do need to teach him he cant go on forehand - mine will go like a tank if i let her- so i halt, rebalance and then walk on - if goes 'chest first' then halt. rebalance then walk on. when can balance in walk we trot - same if goes chest first halt immediatly, rebalance (that means getting him still accepting contact and not allowing to move head to either side has to stay central til you'feel' when balanced )
then trot on - long process but they learn cant run and also cant lean on you
(hope that makes sense v diff to write down)

we do prelim dressage and showing
 
Thank you kezimac - that is just what I was hoping to hear. It seemed to make sense to me that it would help my lad if he learned how to carry himself better but I didn't want to rush in with a period of training if I was asking the impossible from him. That has cheered me up! Glad yours is doing so well too.
 
"He is no longer in pain but still has the same gait, the typical short strides associated with navicular. "

Navicular syndrome is a disease of the tendons/ligaments inside the foot that goes on to cause navicular bone erosion in some horses. Clear xrays would not mean that he does not have the syndrome, just that the bone has not changed. There is nothing in the disease that would prevent him lengthening his stride mechanically without also hurting. That short gait he has got, if it is in a naturally longer striding horse, is because the horse is in pain if it takes a longer stride.

If he has navicular syndrome and he appears sound then it is because he is equally UNsound in both front legs or all four legs. I would assume that the horse IS in pain, just equally so in each foot. I therefore think trying to "teach" it to stride longer is quite possibly unfair.

Test your horse by circling him 10 metres in trot on hard ground. If he is sound then, he is not in pain from navicular and his short stride might just be habit and retrainable. If he is unsound, your remedial shoeing has simply bandaged the problem up for a while.

Like another poster, I'm inclined to think that a horse who has multiple problems and has spent his life hunting should not now be being asked to go round in circles in an arena, but should settle for life as a quiet hack.

If you could get your horse to work barefoot you would probably see a big increase in his movement, though he might grow some very odd shaped feet to cope with his multiple leg and foot issues. Unfortunately a foot which looks balanced to us is often the last thing a horse with arthritis actually wants on the end of his leg.

I think we have exchanged messages before and your horse is one who cannot manage barefoot??? I have a rehab case here now who is coming up to four weeks with me. His navicular is well on the way out, I think, in spite of Tildren, Adequan, Hyaluronic Acid injections and bar shoes failing to cure him. But the really interesting thing is that this horse is insulin resistant and simply could not grow thick soles whilst it was allowed to eat grass, even in a starvation paddock. I took him on to prevent him being put down, he was that bad. Off grass for nearly four weeks, he is unrecognisable as the same horse, footwise.
 
My tb was diagnosed last may with mild changes to the navicular bone and collapsed heels. He did not show the typical symptons of navicular, but was said to be bilaterally lame. I was given 2 choices, heart bar shoes or to go barefoot. I choose the barefoot option, as bei ng a typical Tb he can not keep shoes on at all. He now has his feet trimmed every 6 weeks and now shows no sign of navicular or bilateral lameness. I believed until his shoes were removed that he would never cope as a barefoot horse, but he has proved me wrong. He now competes in prelim and novice dressage, showing lengthened strides, ex race horse showing classes and show jumping, all barefoot. However, for hacking he does need hoof boots on all 4 feet to keep him sound as he does get very picky over the stonier ground. I feel that all this was picked up very early and I have been able to make good informed choices over his health with advice from both my vet and farrier. I hope my experience helps you.
 
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