Needing some advice on a horse nervous of bridle and saddle

clockwork.satan

clockwork.satan

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Well... It's nice to be posting in a section other than 'veterinary care' for a change but, *sigh*, allow me to regale you with a short tale of woe.

About five years ago, we bought a three year old unbacked and overheight (now 15.1hh) Highland Pony. In the beginning, everything went smoothly - we were able to back him without any problems and he was as placid and as calm as you like. We were able to start his training and everything seemed to be going nicely. But then he managed to get himself cast in his stable and hurt his sternum, which we only found out about after my other half was catapulted from his back in the school after trying to turn him. After a while of not being girthed up, we found ourselves having to go back to square one with the saddle as the pain caused by the girth on his hurt sternum made him anxious of it. We done the whole on-and-off-a-million-times thing with the saddle and girth and he eventually accepted that they weren't hurting him.

Several things happened after that which prompted a few other saddle-related hiccups, culminating in the purchase of two rather expensive saddles and ultimately finding out around six months ago that he had Pyloric ulcers which were subsequently treated and appear to have completely healed now. The saddle has been checked and adjusted so that it's fitting properly and we've spent a fortune on getting the best girths and gear for him. We also bought a Transcend bitless bridle as he seemed to even react badly to bits.

Right, now for the problems we're experiencing now. Last night and for the past while, when we bring the saddle into the stable he spins and manoeuvres himself so we can't get it on unless we put a headcollar on him. He huffs and puffs and is wide-eyed and anxious to the point where he's jumpy, but once it's on him and girthed up he's absolutely fine with it. We've went through the on-and-off-a-million-times thing again, but his anxiety of the saddle never seems to improve.

When it comes to putting the bitless bridle on his reaction is even worse; when trying to put it on his head he rapidly backs away from it and gets all anxious again - but once it's on he doesn't seem to have a care in the world about it and can be lead out of the stable without any problems.

Has anyone experience anything like this behaviour? We can't figure out where this irrational fear of the bridle has came from. It fits him perfectly; there's no sharp stitching bits, it's beautifully supple and in all aspects appears perfect, and we're beginning to feel rather defeated by all of this.
 
It sounds as if something is still hurting, deep rooted fear should have gone with the desensitising you have done, he may be ok once you have the tack on but I would suspect there is still pain somewhere, if a vet has already given the all clear have you had a good physio to see him, that would be my next step as they often pick up on things the vet misses and the owner has sometimes not even considered.

If nothing physical is found I would ask someone very experienced to come and assess, he may be different with someone he doesn't know and it may be worth a try to see if he is reacting to you because you are taking such care to work with his issues.
 
I agree with BP - it is a strong reaction by the sound of it and I would have expected some improvement with all of the work you have put in. Vet check and then physio.

This type of reaction may not be to do specifically with the saddle or bridle, just his association that putting his equipment on means he is going to do something that hurts and / or that he finds stressful. What do you do with him when you ride? Is he leaving friends? Is he stressed out hacking? Finding schooling difficult?
 
The fact that he stops fighting once the kit is on does not mean he has accepted it or that it doesn't hurt. He may have just shut down. He has learned that fighting at that point does not help - and may indeed hurt more. That isn't a good place to be. BP's plan sounds a good one to me.
 
Wheels said:
What do you do with him when you ride? Is he leaving friends? Is he stressed out hacking? Finding schooling difficult?
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Sadly, we've never got him to the point where we've been able to do much with him so far, due to the various issues he's had. Once his saddle and bridle are on, we're able to school him perfectly in the school and he's perfectly happy. We can sit in the saddle and he seems to accept it but the moment we try to get him moving, he starts spinning.
 
clockwork.satan said:
Sadly, we've never got him to the point where we've been able to do much with him so far, due to the various issues he's had. Once his saddle and bridle are on, we're able to school him perfectly in the school and he's perfectly happy. We can sit in the saddle and he seems to accept it but the moment we try to get him moving, he starts spinning.
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When you say "school" do you mean long reining/ lunging not riding, so he is now 8 and not yet properly backed? if so I would seriously think about getting someone else involved, once you have ruled out pain, as he may just require someone who really knows what they are doing to give him some confidence, spinning under saddle if not due to pain sounds like a confused horse that needs guidance and at his age he needs to be getting on with life, although I would want to rule out something serious being wrong with him before taking a more firm approach to his training.
 
be positive said:
When you say "school" do you mean long reining/ lunging not riding, so he is now 8 and not yet properly backed? if so I would seriously think about getting someone else involved, once you have ruled out pain, as he may just require someone who really knows what they are doing to give him some confidence, spinning under saddle if not due to pain sounds like a confused horse that needs guidance and at his age he needs to be getting on with life, although I would want to rule out something serious being wrong with him before taking a more firm approach to his training.
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Well, yes. We're well aware of his age and are well aware that he should be going well by now, but after severe laminitis, stomach ulcers and various ailments he's had a really bad start at life and half of the time it feels like we're making as many backwards steps as were making progress. We had him checked about four weeks ago by a physio who didn't find anything worrying, but I was thinking that we should get him and possibly the saddle checked again. We've also made sure he's on all of the correct feeds and supplements now - he's such a difficult horse to manage on several fronts and believe me when I say that we've got enough experience. We're just at the point where we're getting frustrated, particularly since we're on a busy yard where other people seem to have no problems with their horses at all.

I was just looking for some advice and you've confirmed my thoughts - we'll just need to get him checked over again.
 
You didn't mention laminitis before and it seemed rather a long while if he had only had a few minor ailments/ saddle fit issues to slow down progress, I have seen enough horses over the years to know how easy it is for owners to go too slowly because they are very careful and sometimes they need a firm prod in the right direction in order to make progress, however experienced you are sometimes you get too close to the horse and a fresh pair of eyes can really help, it is not a sign of failure in any way just looking for a new approach is a positive step once you have tried everything within your own toolbox.
 
This might not be terribly helpful but the only one of mine that had a similar reaction turned out to have arthritis of the facet joints which did not and would not have shown up on normal back X-rays, it took bone scan and then ultrasound to confirm but it has a rubbish prognosis
 
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